Nelson Brands tweets details on why his NCAA career is over

[PortaJohn]

2 hours ago, flyingcement said:

If someone believes that this is an outrageous crime for which a year of lost eligibility is appropriate, I would be curious to hear their rationale.  The insider information piece has been covered by Vak already.  Anything else we're missing? 

I personally think that the crime isn't outrageous at all but at the same time it isn't as if Nelson didn't know the rules.  He just didn't think he'd get caught.  That's an entirely different conversation that Nelson backers such as yourself, @Wrestleknownothing, & @VakAttack appear to be glossing over.  

Edited September 26, 2023 by PortaJohn

[manatree]

7 minutes ago, billyhoyle said:

Do you think Iowa or the coaching staff is responsible as well though? Clearly they failed to effectively communicate the consequences of gambling to their athletes. Do you think gambling is happening everywhere and Iowa/Iowa state simply were caught because of enforcement actions focused on Iowa, or are the Iowa schools doing a disservice to their athletes?

History is littered with people who have done things in spite of having the consequences effectively communicated to them. Nelson’s an adult, time to cut the apron strings.

[Wrestleknownothing]

8 minutes ago, PortaJohn said:

I personally think that the crime isn't outrageous at all but at the same time it isn't as if Nelson didn't know the rules.  He just didn't think he'd get caught.  That's an entirely different conversation that Nelson backers such as yourself, @Wrestleknownothing, & @VakAttack appear to be glossing over.  

You said you didn't want to read the thread, but somehow you are sure I have glossed over something. Rich.

[PortaJohn]

4 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

You said you didn't want to read the thread, but somehow you are sure I have glossed over something. Rich.

Apologies my friend.  Got curious and started diving in a few pages back.  

[wrestlingshoe]

2 hours ago, Husker_Du said:

1) i wouldn't characterize a HC in football missing 4 games 'meaningless'

2) regardless, just because there are some 'meaningless' penalties doesn't make the Iowa penalties wrong.

you're arguing like a god damn whiny democrat

You almost had me agreeing with you... this has nothing to do with Dem or Rep... He broke the rules, clearly. He deserves the penalty. And, you degrade your argument when you lower yourself to name calling. A normal mistake made by your conservative counterparts. 

[billyhoyle]

3 hours ago, manatree said:

History is littered with people who have done things in spite of having the consequences effectively communicated to them. Nelson’s an adult, time to cut the apron strings.

This is true-he is accountable, but I think the university failed as well. If you are running a program, and your athletes think it won't be a problem to gamble on athletics, you are doing something very wrong. 

1 hour ago, wrestlingshoe said:

You almost had me agreeing with you... this has nothing to do with Dem or Rep... He broke the rules, clearly. He deserves the penalty. And, you degrade your argument when you lower yourself to name calling. A normal mistake made by your conservative counterparts. 

Refusing to take accountability when you screw up/blaming the rules and law rather than your inability to follow them is a universal problem. 

[Lipdrag]

5 hours ago, Husker_Du said:

you're arguing like a god damn whiny democrat

Whoa, dude.  Harshest insult I've ever seen.  Racist, fascist, misogynist, sexist, chauvinist pig, Christian, male, homophobe, islamophobe, straight, white, cis, American, patriot, deplorable, despicable, able to understand numbers, prompt, logical, reasonable.  All of those insults just roll off the back without making a mark.  But to call a guy a whiny democrat?!?  I am shocked and appalled.  The nuclear option of insults has been deployed.  

 

[wrestlingshoe]

1 hour ago, billyhoyle said:

Refusing to take accountability when you screw up/blaming the rules and law rather than your inability to follow them is a universal problem.

Correct. 

NIL may soften the blow a bit for Iowa in the short term since they won't totally fall apart this year, but it could have a lasting effect on the program. May be like Minnesota's drop off after the JRob situation. 

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

6 hours ago, wrestlingshoe said:

Correct. 

NIL may soften the blow a bit for Iowa in the short term since they won't totally fall apart this year, but it could have a lasting effect on the program. May be like Minnesota's drop off after the JRob situation. 

Nope.  Best wrestling facility in the world is under construction, as well as plenty of NIL money to come.

[fishbane]

12 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Depends on which three games. The university chose the first three because they are the most meaningless, warm up, non-conference games. They did not want to wait on the NCAA to decide, because by then the games might actually be meaningful.

Not all 3 game suspensions are created equal and neither are all 1 year suspensions.   I recall when Jordan Oliver first failed a drug test at the US Open.  It was literally the worst possible timing for a 1 year ban.  Not only did he miss the trials that year, but he was banned for the entire qualifying process the next year.  This effectively made is a 2 year ban from trying to make the team.

In that instance the ban was tied to the failed test.  With on going gambling activities it's a little less clear when the ban should start.  First gambling activity? Last bet?  Since Brands started gambling in September 2022 and not knowing the exact penalty (1 year? 2 year? permanent ban?), he is possibly fortunate he was able to compete in the post season this past season. 

[Husker_Du]

13 hours ago, wrestlingshoe said:

You almost had me agreeing with you... this has nothing to do with Dem or Rep... He broke the rules, clearly. He deserves the penalty. And, you degrade your argument when you lower yourself to name calling. A normal mistake made by your conservative counterparts. 

1) it was a joke

2) i'm not arguing with a shoe

[Le duke]

Nope.  Best wrestling facility in the world is under construction, as well as plenty of NIL money to come.

“The playing field has been leveled.” -Bob Nicolls


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

28 minutes ago, Le duke said:

 

“The playing field has been leveled.” -Bob Nicolls


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I wouldn't count on the facility alone "levelling the playing field," but Iowa will still be able to pull some top recruits.  The previous poster suggested otherwise.

[VakAttack]

12 hours ago, wrestlingshoe said:

Correct. 

NIL may soften the blow a bit for Iowa in the short term since they won't totally fall apart this year, but it could have a lasting effect on the program. May be like Minnesota's drop off after the JRob situation. 

Minnesota had an alleged drug distribution ring busted, WTF are you even talking about lol.

[headshuck]

Nice.

[manatree]

16 hours ago, billyhoyle said:

This is true-he is accountable, but I think the university failed as well. If you are running a program, and your athletes think it won't be a problem to gamble on athletics, you are doing something very wrong. 

These are adults with freewill, not Cold War computers running Fortran. Just because they chose to break the rules does not mean that Iowa admin was doing something very wrong. 

[Leg rider]

My .02 for what it is worth, for this situation it doesn't matter what anyone thinks of the rule, if you don't like it fight the rule, but as long as it is the rule, you have to follow it, if people got to decide and only follow rules they liked then there are no rules.

And I don't care if he missed the meeting, he knew the rule, every athletics department in the country hammers the gambling point, I sat through multiple compliance presentations in college and the fact that the NCAA considers gambling a cardinal sin was hammered into our brains for over an hour every year. The only relevance to him missing the meeting is that it is supposed to be a mandatory meeting and someone will have to answer for that. And no that does not mean LOIC type of for the people pushing that angle.

[Jimmy Cinnabon]

27 minutes ago, Leg rider said:

My .02 for what it is worth, for this situation it doesn't matter what anyone thinks of the rule, if you don't like it fight the rule, but as long as it is the rule, you have to follow it, if people got to decide and only follow rules they liked then there are no rules.

And I don't care if he missed the meeting, he knew the rule, every athletics department in the country hammers the gambling point, I sat through multiple compliance presentations in college and the fact that the NCAA considers gambling a cardinal sin was hammered into our brains for over an hour every year. The only relevance to him missing the meeting is that it is supposed to be a mandatory meeting and someone will have to answer for that. And no that does not mean LOIC type of for the people pushing that angle.

"But I don't like the rule because the parties who knowingly violated it are being punished for breaking it and they happen to represent my favorite school!  It's not fair!"

Edited September 26, 2023 by Jimmy Cinnabon

[1032004]

10 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

"But I don't like the rule because the parties who knowingly violated it are being punished for breaking it and they happen to represent my favorite school!  It's not fair!"

Do you still think the gambling suspensions are a nothingburger?

[Maxwell Smart]

When does it ever end?  

[AgaveMaria]

23 hours ago, billyhoyle said:

This is true-he is accountable, but I think the university failed as well. If you are running a program, and your athletes think it won't be a problem to gamble on athletics, you are doing something very wrong. 

Refusing to take accountability when you screw up/blaming the rules and law rather than your inability to follow them is a universal problem. 

Are we talking Wrestling or Donald Trump?

[flyingcement]

On 9/25/2023 at 3:40 PM, Husker_Du said:

i believe that, for breaking a known, existing rule in wrestling, the penalty should be loss of a year of eligibility. 

anything else is meaningless in ncaa wrestling. 

 

I'm not saying the NCAA should decide not to enforce their rules, I'm just saying i don't think the crime as written, fits the penalty in many cases.  Of course he could know that would be a possibility for him but I still think it sucks and feel bad for him as a result.  Funny because I never particularly rooted for him as a wrestler.  

[flyingcement]

On 9/25/2023 at 5:37 PM, PortaJohn said:

I personally think that the crime isn't outrageous at all but at the same time it isn't as if Nelson didn't know the rules.  He just didn't think he'd get caught.  That's an entirely different conversation that Nelson backers such as yourself, @Wrestleknownothing, & @VakAttack appear to be glossing over.  

I'm not glossing over.  I break rules all the time hoping not to get caught (nothing serious obviously)

I acknowledged he made a decision to do so and it didn't work out for him.  For that I feel bad for him.  I don't think sports gambling is that big of a deal outside your own sport.  Hope the NCAA reconsiders their rule for the future or draws a reasonable line for what's considered de minimis

[GreatWhiteNorth]

On 9/25/2023 at 3:14 PM, Husker_Du said:

there are clearly two distinct arguments being made in this thread and they're getting mashed together

A) what the rules are

B) what you think they should be

(this is not directed at any one individual)

Don't forget the 3rd argument you made about "whiny <political party>"

It's the super dumb one where you think it's a good idea to post condescendingly to roughly half the US population.

That one.

Why bird brains seem to think that having half the US fighting against the other half is a good idea, I'll never know. Here's a hint - the US is stronger if we focus on working together instead of fighting against each other.

Strength is something we may need going forward in these uncertain times.

[RicoSwaff]

Politics are pretty easy to avoid these days! Bye-golly-gee-youuuuu-betcha!!! 
 

if I had a dime for every political dispute I’ve had to babysit in the past 2 weeks on my own thing’s comment section, then I would probably have $100…. Which is nowhere near where I have to be in order to pay the electric bill this month! 
 

COME ON PEOPLE!!! PICK IT UP! THERE AREN’T ENOUGH POLITICAL DEBATES TAKING PLACE IN WRESTLING THREADS THESE DAYS! SLACKERS!!!