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Why don't Bob & Du support NCAA wrestling? They've gotta be making a killing off us fans with all these pop ups.

Assume you meant Kueter but I initially read it as a huge upset thinking it was Bastida taking out the defending NCAA champ...

Don’t they barely support many of their own fighters?

The UFC broadcasts college wrestling matches on fight pass.

Idk, a lot of us thought Amine would slow Mes down last season.

All times Eastern, with all times in parenthesis. *-indicates event is believed to be eligible for a one-pound weight allowance. Thursday, November 21: Indiana at Columbia, 7:30 PM Missouri at Illinois, 8:00 PM (7:00 PM) Friday, November 22: Seton Hill at VMI, 6:00 PM West Virginia at Appalachian State, 7:00 PM Duke vs. Michigan at Durham, NC, 7:00 PM Morgan State at Maryland, 7:00 PM Minnesota at North Dakota State, 7:00 PM (6:00 PM) Rutgers at Virginia Tech, 7:00 PM Embry-Riddle at Arizona State, 7:30 PM (5:30 PM) Arizona Christian at Arizona State, 7:30 PM (5:30 PM) Rider at Northern Illinois, 8:00 PM (7:00 PM) Wyoming at Oklahoma State, 8:00 PM (7:00 PM) Air Force at California Baptist, 9:30 PM (6:30 PM) Saturday, November 23: Bucknell, Cleveland State, Indiana, Kent State, Navy, Nebraska, Ohio, Oregon State, The Citadel at Navy Classic, hosted by Navy, 9:00 AM Princeton vs. Purdue at Chattanooga, 10:00 AM *American vs. Duke at Pittsboro, NC, 10:00 AM *Presbyterian vs. Utah Valley at Pittsboro, NC, 10:00 AM Princeton at Chattanooga, 12:00 PM *American vs. Presbyterian at Pittsboro, NC, 12:00 PM *Duke vs. Utah Valley at Pittsboro, NC, 12:00 PM Buffalo at Cornell, 1:00 PM Purdue at Chattanooga, 2:00 PM *Duke vs. Presbyterian at Pittsboro, NC, 2:00 PM *Wyoming at Oklahoma, 2:30 PM (1:30 PM) Iowa State at Iowa, 7:00 PM (6:00 PM) *Utah Valley at NC State, 7:00 PM *Air Force at Vanguard, 10:00 PM (7:00 PM) Sunday, November 24: *Binghamton, Brown, Buffalo, Clarion, Cornell, Sacred Heart at Big Red Invitational, hosted by Cornell, 9:00 AM Central Michigan, Drexel, Edinboro, Franklin & Marshall, Harvard, Lock Haven, Penn, Virginia Tech at PRTC Keystone Classic, hosted by Penn, 9:30 AM Army West Point, Binghamton, Bloomsburg, Columbia, Gardner-Webb, LIU, Michigan State, Penn State at Black Knight Invitational, hosted by Army West Point, 10:00 AM *Cal Poly, California Baptist, CSU Bakersfield, Oklahoma at Roadrunner Open, hosted by CSU Bakersfield, 12:00 PM (9:00 AM) Hofstra at Ohio State, 12:00 PM Rider at Wisconsin, 1:00 PM (12:00 PM) Campbell at Minnesota, 2:00 PM (1:00 PM) South Dakota State at Northern Iowa, 2:00 PM (1:00 PM) Arizona State at Oklahoma State, 2:00 PM (1:00 PM) Lehigh at Pittsburgh, 2:00 PM George Mason at SIU Edwardsville, 2:00 PM (1:00 PM) Little Rock at Northwestern, 3:00 PM (2:00 PM) Michigan at Virginia, 7:00 PM

Flo and Intermat still have a number of disagreements on who should be/is the starter at a number of slots. I have not done the research to see who is right. But I know a few off the top of my head. Daniel Cardenas is redshirting at Stanford. And they are both just guessing at 197 for PSU. Can anyone else fill in the gaps? There are also a number of wrestlers where there is consensus on who is starting, but a big difference of opinion on where they should be ranked. The table is sorted from largest to smallest difference (Flo minus Intermat) and filtered to include only those where the absolute value of the difference is seven or more.

As for the rankings, haven’t looked too closely at most of these. But starting with some of the higher ones… I don’t see how Ed Scott can still be in the top 10 after losing twice to guys in the 20ish or worse range. I lean towards Flo here. I also don’t see how you can put Renteria into the top 10 basically off of 1 win last season. I lean towards Intermat here. Relating to our other discussion, IMO it is somewhat inconsistent for Intermat to put Ferrari #1, but Sasso #11 with both coming back from serious injuries. I actually think Flo is being consistent here by putting both Sasso and Ferrari high, but not as high as they could be based solely on prior results.

For the starters. ISU 165: Euton wrestled both duals, Gaitan wrestled in the Grand View Open. Gotta say it’s Euton right now. I think Flo is correct LR 165: They haven’t wrestled a D1 dual yet. I’d gotta say it’s Bianchi, it doesn’t look like Abdon has ever beaten someone in wrestlestat’s top 60, so even if he was the starter I’m not sure how he gets ranked 22 unless they are just giving him credit for Bianchi’s wins. I think Intermat is correct. PSU 197: Cochran wrestled their only dual, gotta say it’s him right now. I think Flo is correct Rutgers 149: Cetta wrestled against LIU and F&M, Clark wrestled against NC State and Duke. Gotta say it’s Clark. I think Flo is correct. Stanford 157: Yeah I thought Cardenas was redshirting. I think Intermat is correct. Virginia 133: Porter has wrestled both duals, I think Intermat is correct. Although Yarbrough has not wrestled at all, so unless he’s injured I’m not sure he should be in there all (which looks to be wrestlestat’s current opinion). So IMO I’ve got 3 for Flo and 3 for Intermat

I'd be surprised if he's getting any money apart from a break on tuition. The kid just lost his starting spot to someone a little better than him, a 197lber who couldn't make 197 anymore. Trephan's a 6th year senior with one more year of eligibility, and is a legit AA contender. I highly doubt there's anyone at NC State who's upset about this. I think everyone gets it.

Rutgers vs VT at the moss arts center. That’s one of the best venues in all of college wrestling.

Not until 1951.

Given the rapid shift from linear (cable) to streaming, it was only a matter of time until these types of actions began to pop up in courtooms. Maybe this one gets tossed but there will eventually be a tipping point. The PR response from Netflix was something that wrestling fans have been dealing with for years and should sound very familiar. Flo better hope the judge is given a free lifetime Netflix account as part of the kickback to make this case go away. https://www.tmz.com/2024/11/19/netflix-sued-tyson-paul-stream-issues/ The streaming quality during the Mike Tyson vs. Jake Paul fight was so bad, Netflix has actually just been hit with a class-action lawsuit over it, TMZ Sports has learned. Court documents we obtained show Ronald "Blue" Denton filed the suit in Florida on Monday ... just three days after he says he and thousands of others struggled to watch Netflix's broadcast of El Gallo's big win over Iron Mike. Denton claims that as soon as he and others tuned in to the broadcast at around 8 PM ET on Friday -- they "were faced with legendary problems, including: no access, streaming glitches, and buffering issues. Denton is suing Netflix for breach of contract, among other things ... and he's asking for unspecified damages. For Netflix's part, it hasn't publicly commented on the pending litigation ... although it did acknowledge in a statement Saturday there were issues with streams during the event. "We don't want to dismiss the poor experience of some members," Netflix officials stated, "and know we have room for improvement, but still consider this event a huge success."

Betting Wkn wishing he'd gone with the Lehigh avatar now. Yes I said I'm betting!

Does the ufc fund boxing or judo or bjj or backyard barn animal fighting? i not catching whey there is the idea that they are obligated in any way to support wrestling or any other fighting style….. other than this is a wrestling board. (As pointed out above. This year two of them supporting….). Is that not enough? maybe the beef is really with the wrestlers not giving back? I’m sure some do. Some don’t. Again…. We’re does the “obligation” come from?

He didn’t say the number came from TR, just that he scolded him for posting about it

Maybe he can be the answer to your question, @Pinnacle

Assuming that means Nathan Taylor is out for the year? Or was it already known that he is?

Mineo sucks...as a rule you should take EVERYTHING he claims with many grains of salt.

Ah, didn’t see that one. I saw he recently commented about Tom Ryan saying something to him about his comments about what tOSU supposedly offered Marcus Blaze. Didn’t see the post but I heard someone say the claim was $2.4 million?

Here are the departmental budgets for 2025. https://www.statista.com/statistics/200386/budget-of-the-us-government-for-fiscal-year-2012-by-agencies/ Looks like there are ample areas for DOGE activity. Anytime a department handles billions of dollars, there are way to cut that budget. You could just say 10% cut across the board, but that does not eliminate waste, but it would cut the budget.

Last winter Minnow posted the tragic injury to Travis Witlake without talking to family or anyone else about it. It was literally before anyone knew anything because someone let him know. Coaches got in his ear real quick and he took it down.

Dana isn't someone that I even consider.

Ramos seems like a good example. I believe he was only at 133 for a year because Purdue had Schroeder and didn't want to bench a senior.

This Sunday against Campbell.

Can we make this the predictions thread? 125: Iowa dec 3-0 Iowa 133: Frost Dec Ayala 3-3 141: Redding Dec Block 6-3 ISU 149: Parco Dec Echemendia 6-6 157: Johnson Dec Teemer 9-6 ISU 165: Caliendo maj 10-9 Iowa 174: Brands Dec 13-9 184: Arnold Dec Bockman 16-9 197: Buchanan dec Carroll 19-9 285: Bastida Dec Kerk 19-12 There are several interesting matches but even giving them a few upsets/tossups I’m not really seeing a path for ISU here.

Is there a time limit to that? AJ Ferrari is 2-0 against Stephen Buchanan (2021), but you have Buchanan #1 and Ferrari#4. Ferrari also has a significantly better record against common opponents than #3 Rocky Elam, and #2 Jacob Cardenas.

they were being critical of "his guy"!

Doesn't have to be that. Can be something as simple as having their broadcasters ask fans to support their local high school or college team. Mention that Campbell wresting (or whatever program is next) is on the verge of getting cut and needs support. Lots of ways to support that wouldn't cost them a dime.

@VakAttack if you are in to or are interested in learning about Western history I recommend "Blood and Thunder" -Hampton Sides. Kit Carson truly was the Forrest Gump of the West. It's a great starter or addition to that period of history.

Mendez got a takedown at the end of that match.

I was super concerned about that particular matchup. Craig is known for being very slippery and dangerous on bottom, meaning that Bo was likely going to avoid takedowns unless he was badly losing the standup. The size difference was also a concern. Two straight underwhelming performances, both on huge main cards and you can understand why Bo isn't a fan favorite. Meanwhile, I think he should probably just go full heel, ala "The Rock" when fans didn't buy his good guy persona. Bo had no problem being a villain in NCAA.

Not sure what the specific reason was especially since he wrestled 133 his first year after transferring, but Matt Ramos finished higher than Pat McKee in each of the last 2 NCAA’s and was also 3-0 against him.

I would think the scripted aspect would be the key point.

I have read every book and short story and every article written by Charles Dickens. It was popular to publish anonymous editorials and opinion articles during his day, so I might have missed one or two of those. I like to go back and re-read all of his books. He is my #1 hero. Since it's the season, I'm going to drop a short video I did about A Christmas Carol here: A smidgen of a transcript: I. What Was Dickens Trying to Do? In the first ten sentences of a very short book about Christmas, Charles Dickens used the words "undertaker," "mourners," "burial," "coffin," "deadest" and "unhallowed." But it doesn't end there. In those same ten sentences, which were short sentences for Dickens--one consisted of a single word--he also managed to squeeze in the word "dead" four times! In the eleventh sentence, there's another "dead"! Who gets away with that in a story about Christmas? It's like a children's story about ducks and ponies and vampires.

Some people just don't get their *I poop my pants, don't laugh at me* together in life until they get a gutcheck or a reality check. Personally, I tend to tell my story that my adult life really began at 29. Took me seven years to get my undergrad, had some personal and family issues to deal with. Was lazy in the classroom, paid for that by paying my way my last three years while working nights and announcing tournaments on the weekend. Went full-time in my chosen career two months after I graduated - hated it. Quit two months later to pursue the wrestling thing full time. I'm sure it's just amplified more now than it was back then, but it seems like we got some awfully judgy wrestling fans when it comes to the lives of our stars. I get it's a discussion topic for the boards, but at the same point, the level of scrutiny we see over someone else's life and talent isn't a trend I really enjoy. The contempt comes, at least from my perspective, that fans are disappointed that Gable didn't do what they thought he should have done.

Currently reading The Wright Brothers by David McCullough. Pretty good read. I was looking for more technical detail but he hits the highlights. Good book so far. mspart David McCullough

Yes, he would count.

Does Bubba count?

They went to lunch with Hitler. Got to keep an open mind those two!! mspart

I was there it was a crazy battle of attrition. Attacks throughout, not a hanging on each other snooze fest.

Let me first say I think Starocci is a beast. I was just s flippant in a previous thread that Ferrari wouldn't have a chance against Starocci. And I think Starocci will finish with a better college career than Steveson. Five titles trumps all and he'll probably get them. But Starocci ain't as good a Wrestler as Steveson, nowhere near. Since you brought up freestyle, Steveson has an Olympic gold medal and hasn't been in danger of losing a domestic match in I can't remember how long. I didn't make any argument about Starocci not making the team but the fact is that up to now he never would have been a favorite to do so, whereas Steveson uses world team qualifiers as takedown clinics. And with respect to college Steveson has two Hodges to Starocci's zero. And same thing, never in danger of losing since his double brain farts as a freshman. How many people think Steveson won't win in March if he is training seriously? ANYONE?

I have in-laws who go to Trump rallies. We get along great.

The first Fidel was bad enough...now a second one?

Any of John Lockhart's NCAA matches in 2001.

I am in a weird spot with this. I thought that the old rules were so restrictive and harmed the athlete especially in lieu of a coach's ability to go to different schools on a whim. Where we are now has really become untenable. Players coming and going multiple times in a career. This can't be good for sport. I would like to see the athletes get one free transfer. After that there has to be a penalty. Coaches need to be able to know how to build their rosters. NIL needs to be reined in and there be actual NIL work associated with any pay. If a guy makes a deal with Dave's Chevrolet or Nike great. I don't want some murky transfer of money to come to State University to play soccer. The NCAA seems to have really dropped the ball here with their own rules. I can only speak for myself but all of this as currently being executed is driving me away from college athletics.

Ahahahahaha I thought it was a great read.

Whatever you think of Askren, he's not entirely wrong here, and if anything may be understating the severity of Iowa's missteps here. A few related reasons: 1. They will lose top high school recruits who view Iowa as overly disloyal, as Iowa is the first to hit "zero loyalty" threshold. Yes, there's been "recruiting over" before, but until now, there's always been a sense that, for wresters of a certain seniority and skill level, the coaching staff will be like "naw, I'm good" when transfers come knocking or donors are asking coaches on encrypted Telegram threads who to go after. Glazier/Buchanan changes all that. The idea that a school would go out on the open market to try to financially lure in someone to displace a 5th year senior who had only 1 loss going into B1Gs is stunning. It means no one is safe. High school recruits will see this and know, for a fact, that unless you just won a national title, Iowa is going to be trying, every year, to pull in someone better than you. For the most part, other schools have used the portal to fill holes, but only Iowa has sought to use it to upgrade everywhere. As long as other top schools don't follow suit to the same extreme extent, that's going to push recruits away from Iowa, and be a huge recruiting advantage for their competition. 2. This turn toward transfers and away from loyalty is especially harmful to Iowa, which historically has been so reliant on their branding to lure in recruits. Come to Iowa for the "Iowa style," Iowa once said. "Oh that Johnny, he really wrestles the Iowa Style, he'd be great for them," wrestlers hear. But not anymore. They can't say that's their brand when they just have a hodge-podge of guys from different programs who each wrestler their own pre-developed style, most of which don't really mesh with Iowa in any particular way. Kids might go to Iowa because they fare well, but their branding, already eroding, is down the tube. They're losing their cache and sales pitch. 3. Ben was right to cite the loss of culture, too. It's the difference between a bunch of close-knit guys who came up from the farm system, and a bunch of guys who came on as free agents. They just aren't going to be that tight, with no sense of solidarity or brotherhood. Recruits doing their on-campus visits won't see the camaraderie, and existing guys will find easier to leave without feeling bad or nostalgic. (As is clearly the case with 5 leaving in 3 days.) I suspect the guys that remain will be that much harder to coach, too, as these aren't guys who have "bought in" on the Iowa way or the Tom/Terry coaching style. They are guys who are bought and paid for, and have no reason to care much about what Tom/Terry have to say. They'll yammer on about what it means to put on a black and gold singlet, and these guys will just laugh. 4. Iowa's spending is also too high on transfers relative to existing athletes. It isn't sustainable. I have no idea if the money being speculated on Twitter is accurate (e.g. $500K each for Parco, Teemer, Buchanan), but as some have pointed out, now guys like Ayala are going to look since they're being paid a fraction of that. That means you aren't just losing the guys at the weights where you recruited over them, you're also losing top guys at other weights who feel they aren't being treated fairly. 5. Admittedly, none of points 1-4 really matter if they have the bankroll to turn Iowa into the New York Yankees every season, buying a near-full roster every year. But the money won't be there forever. As I understand it, it's pretty much coming from one guy, and he's a pretty shady dude as it is. What happens when his money runs out or he crosses one too many lines, whether in recruiting or in any other seedy dealings? Iowa isn't nearly as flush with alumni money as many other schools. When that money dries up, then what? They'll need to rebuild their brand, their culture, the illusion of loyalty all over again, from scratch. Have fun with that. This whole thing reminds me of the Ferrari fiasco from last year: sacrificing integrity on the altar of winning, compromising whatever principles are needed to get ahead. At least AJ saved them before that went too far. But I don't think there's any saving Iowa from themselves this time.