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Ahh ... no!

....I can't believe the ref called a stalemate 2 seconds after a takedown, and also just watched as Parris layed on top of Cass for 45 seconds later in the same match. Parris is the better guy, but yeesh.

Watching guys panic when Siebrecht goes upperbody has been a small joy this year.

@BobDole i think this forum would benefit if there was a dislike button that if it reaches a certain number of dislikes, dumb threads like this can be removed

Odd thing is that Sparks has been dialing the crazy down, while Ray is at 11 and squeezing the knob to get it higher.

Nebraska courteously decided to forfeit at HWT so that we don't miss Spencer Lee Live

There are at least three cases where it is clear that only 11 votes were used. RBY at 133, Diakomihalis at 149, and Kerkvliet at 285. It seems to me that the root cause is most likely laziness. EDIT 1: If you look across the roster for those three weight classes there is a single coach who is on all three. I'm not saying Zeke Jones is responsible. I am just saying he is the only coach voting on all three. OK, I am saying he is responsible, even if I cannot prove it. So maybe not laziness? EDIT 2: Trivia Question: At what three weights does ASU have their three highest ranked wrestlers? Do not cheat by reading the first paragraph. For completeness, Jones is also the voter for 125 where they have their next highest ranked wrestler.

I will continue to buy high, sell low, just before the bounce.

The biggest problem is more mandatory stall calls have made refs ignore non-mandatory ones. 5 seconds on the legs is stalling, but 4.5 seconds 5 different times is 22.5 seconds of legal riding time. If a guy continuously drops for 4 seconds, call stalling. Not attempting a mat return is a stall, but letting him stand for 4 seconds and then pushing him out of bounds isn't stalling on top. The problem isn't the rules, the problem is refs refusing to call obvious stalling.

I always liked the idea of having the wrestlers start each period in neutral. Riding time is then awarded to a wrestler achieving a takedown or reversal. And Refs actually enforcing the neutral rules that already exist.

Maryland. Has. Finally. Won. A. B1G. Dual. H.F.S.

Parris' first TD, the ref immediately called for a stalemate. The announcers even commented on it. He had 2 seconds of RT. Then, after his last TD, Parris laid on Cass' hips for the last 45 seconds. It was inconsistent just within the same match. That said, I can't complain overall, Cass' first TD was flukey. He just doesn't have the juice to deal with Parris' power. EDIT: Yeah yeah, I see the typo now, lol.

The Michigan Mallards

Dude that trainers bald spot/ hair combo is epic.

Nomad is a perv.

Why does the guy who announces with Tim Johnson yell so loud? Is it because he is trying to compete with Shane Sparks' projected enthusiasm?

FFT by tOSU at Hwt ... so that we don't miss any of Spencer Lee. Nicely done.

If only the Martin Guitar Company knew that the extra hole would make it sound more like Willie, they would have manufactured them with holes there like they do with jeans now. mspart

Is a guitar more similar to an air conditioner or a banana? It is gonna blow his mind when he hears a guitar that cost $3.29 mail order from Sears is now worth a quarter million!

Not trolling at all. Fresh/Soph Kolat vs RBY Fresh/Soph are not close to being on the same level. But unfortunately for PSU Lock Haven reaped the rewards for those last two Kolat years and unfortunately for this discussion Kolat was no longer at this weight.

I'd encourage you to change it just to see some of the fun you could come up with but some people commented they didn't like it. If I were you, I'd just keep it.

Couldn't help myself sorry

Actually, that is the scandal! No D3 coach voted for Yianni!

The debate over brash and humble continues - godless, crazy, a**hole, wild, flawed, poor sport! I'm old enough to remember the Cassius Clay controversies when I was a kid. And I'm aware of controversies that predate Ali. The thing is that Ali and others had the talent, skills and charisma to help tilt the cultural bandwagon, making brash the acceptable (and for many the most desirable) cultural choice of later generations. But the occasional humble athlete and the old timers (culturally not necessarily age; in my case both) keep the debate alive. If Cater were on an opposition team he'd be on my villain list for sure. But since I'm a PSU fan I won't pearl clutch on this one. As long as he doesn't go criminal (almost did but coaches stepped in thankfully), I'll sit back and enjoy his wrestling. Over the course of a college career, some colorful personalities turn out alright (e.g., DeSanto) and some not so much (e.g., AJ). Here's to hoping Carter threads the needle and continues his career as colorful and not criminal.

Funny how this topic got turned into a trash on Trump thread. It is quite laughable. Anyway, the basis for all of this arguing is just blind partisan support followed by weird narratives in peoples heads on how what they believe is right.

True. It's no JC thread, but it's a slow Fri. morning...

its called riding time. but i think it's meant as control time. control doesn't mean i turn him, it means i control him. and im old enough to remember the fiasco in international where you couldn't win without 3 points... wasn't a fan of taht. this i must score 2 to get riding time is well.. about the same...

No losses...no ties. I really kinda hate this type of debate since the sport has changed so much, but...how do you argue against this? I'm not gonna knock RBY for getting the extra year like O'Toole or Starocci since he actually missed a year, but this seems obvious. It's also just a totally different era. I'd argue Brands has just as much of a case as being #1 and...hell, Gable wrestled 130 and 137, right? Stieber wrestled a couple at 133. Kolat went 2-3-1-1 and he lost a GREAT match as a Freshmen vs 3X Champ and another Wrestler that has a claim, TJ Jaworsky. I thought he could have had NF in that match, but...Jaworsky just had more in the tank. You could argue FOR just about any of those wrestlers and I won't argue against them. I may argue FOR another, but these are all all time greats who have a viable claim...IMO. As for PSU Wrestlers, again, so much context that you can't list them by X of titles. McCoy...Joseph was a 2X Champ and a runner up in his 3 shots. He's one of the guys who really got screwed due to Covid. These are impossible to answer though. I'm not putting DT below every 3X Champ. In fact...he's #1 for me. A bit of a fluke pin vs Bubba and then he wrestled a top maybe 3-4 all time great in Dake in an epic match his Sr year. How about this...if RBY wins, and that's hardly a given(y

Ruth was my favorite of those. Man he was exciting

It isn’t DT’s idea, it’s been recycled for a while. I don’t remember when I first heard it, but I recall writing about that concept no less than 15 years ago.

You're taking away a weight class in the middle and adding two weight classes that...aren't quite as exciting(202/212). I get the idea of building for Freestyle, but you have to adjust your weight every level you go(unless you're a 125 your whole life). I'd be in favor of adding 97KG, but that's not a big enough spread from 197 LB for me. But you're taking away a 149LB National Champ so guys are more well adjusted to their weight cut for the next level. That doesn't seem like it should be the priority for College Wrestling. Something to consider, but not the priority. A National Championship is the pinnacle of the sport for many. I also like getting to see matches like Lee vs Yianni in Freestyle, but that's probably not the strongest argument.

I prefer David Taylor's idea. You get riding time if you turn a guy. If you don't, no RT. It encourages action. If you can't turn a guy, you need to let him up and score another way. I would even be okay if the top man is put on a 30 second clock. No turn, then action returns to the feet.

130 maps to the modern 141. Below are how the weights map through time These are the guys who won 3 of 3 or 3 of 4 titles at 133 and its predecessor weights. Not sure how you want to treat Logan Stieber who won 2 of his 4 at 133 or Barry Davis who won 2 of his 3 there:

Using a trusty dictionary... Pseudo = not genuine; spurious or sham Science = the intellectual and practical activity encompassing the systematic study of the structure and behaviour of the physical and natural world through observation and experiment Put them together, and we're most of the way there. "Pseudoscience" is neither a buzz word, nor is it trite - it refers to "not genuine science" aka fake science. One may wonder why anyone would possibly want to promote fake science. Cult leaders, grifters, con artists, and orange ex-presidents - to name a few. They are out there.

The scientific method or lack thereof. No surprise there. Let's all shove evolution and the mountain of evidence behind it under a rug because it contradicts our beliefs.

Holy shit. You keep proving you don't actually know what scientific theory is. It's not provable by definition. But it does use observation and experimentation to attempt to disprove them. The other is pseudoscience that does the exact opposite. Also, scientific theories are not taught as fact. They are taught as the best explanation for the given thing they attempt to explain, based on experimentation and observation. Some people clearly don't comprehend the difference, however.

You are absolutely wrong, 1 is no more provable than the other. My issue is so much is taught as fact and that no reasonable person would disagree. You're doing it here. There is a lot of scientific debate within the theory of evolution and that information is withheld because they want people to think a certain way. That is not education.

Interesting symmetry between the far left-hand (low) side of the distribution and the far right. Some posters need to keep this in mind before they complain about high school underclassmen wrestling varsity at 107 -- some of these young wrestlers grow into middle weights and some will be future college 125 pounders. Eliminate the high school opportunity for small guys, or guys who are later developers, and you'll lose some future college wrestlers. But, of course, I am biased. signed, Lightweight

We are already successful internationally, freestyle shouldn't be dictating what we do in a separate sport, and freestyle fans should piss off with all the rule change and weight class ideas. News flash no one watches freestyle or cares. We won a world championship last year and no one in America even know. Go fix your sport and leave this one alone.

Why so negative? I say yes, Iowa.

Agreed. Virtue signaling with no teeth. Which is the definition of virtue signalling. Make it look like you are doing something without doing anything. mspart

LJB is the perfect rep for Greco. Converting fans to the boring style left and right.

Nope. But keep on bashing the "women's style" while our greco program is a joke.

So if our greco guys are so great at par terre, why are our greco guys so bad at greco?

I completely agree. Why waste the match clock. When top has a leg in and is working a power half and the ref calls them up... annoying. Or you're got the lace hooked up and move down to extend bottom out...

I just watched the match and Garrett showed he is much better than DeSanto for the first period. Garrett looked awesome in that first period. He either gassed or lost concentration or something. I see no reason why he should have lost that match. As for DeSanto, kudos to him for continuing the pressure and take it to Nashon and getting the win. mspart

I watched it live. Nashon did gas, but DeSanto seemed to downshift midway through the match and find a better gear for him. Reminds me a lot of Aaron Pico vs Jayson Ness at Olympic Trials.