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Anyone else think this needs to be made illegal? I didn't like watching Zain do it years ago and I didn't like seeing Dean hit it on Amos at the end of their match tonight. Just seems like an accident waiting to happen to me.

I agree it should be illegal and it already is in HS. I don’t think this is being soft, it is protecting the integrity of the sport. It is essentially a submission because to get the move to work, you have to get your opponent to succumb to the pain first and then you just tip him over. If you have done this move to others or had it done to you, you know what I mean. I’ve seen some nasty power halves too, but I’m not advocating for that to be illegal because you are using leverage to try to turn him and it hurts when you fight it. This is where you can say, if it hurts too bad, just go over. Sometimes a power half is applied when the bottom guy is not in position to be turned and then it is just punishing the guy. That’s usually when the ref calls potentially dangerous. That’s fine, but I don’t like leaving the bow and arrow up for interpretation because the bottom guy is almost never in a position to be turned and it is not the move itself that gets the guy to turn, it is the act of submission that gets him to turn.

I thought the same thing. In particular there was a moment where dean put his knee between Braxton's back and the knee. There was nothing that could be done except rip his leg apart. This is 100% intentional and should be illegal.

I don't believe the sport of wrestling needs the bow and arrow. When applied, it is usually overly aggressive and unnecessary against an opponent who has already been beat down. Typically, punishment. Popular opinion or not, I'd like to see it go away.

As an NU alum and ex-wrestler, I say with all love that our play-by-play kid is comically bad.

Does anyone really understand why the B10 needs to take a "halftime" break? There's no halftime in wrestling! Especially when on the b10+ and no commercials. Do the second 5 guys get tired of watch the first 5 and need to take a nap, is it a union contract thing?

I was impressed with a bunch of guys last night. Barnett at 125 even against overmatched Steen. Bravo Young did what he always does. I liked both guys at 149. Gomez seems more in control and wrestles great positionally. The inside trip in the first period was terrific. I like Van Ness too. That guy never gave up and came close on a double twice in period two. Gomez gave that double up to Daton Fix at the Scuffle a few years ago so maybe Sanderson sees something there. Haines is going to be trouble. He is already tough on top. Loves getting that Turk instantly and he used it to get to a bow and arrow and I love the way he was trying to finish that by planting Model's foot on the mat but that got stopped. Most impressed with how he converted his last TD. Model had his head buried and I didn't think he could bring that in but he did. He must be a lot stronger than he looks. Hamiti transitions so smoothly. I think he is going to come on and improve into the post season this year. Everyone at 174 and up at PSU. Sheesh. So many hammers.

It's almost like it's not a monolithic entity and instead consists of individuals with different a backgrounds, experiences, and opinions. F*ckin WILD man.

Yes...a full nelson would be a turning move...and it's illegal. So we've clearly decided simply attempting to turn a guy in and of itself doesn't make a move legal. This...and it was after Amos gave up 2 when his knee just buckled...so it was that same knee(didn't look serious)...but I see both sides to it. It's really not a technique, it's almost more like a submission. I don't think Amos could have put his shoulders down(which is an old coaches comment...if it hurts too bad or you can't breath, put your shoulders down).

Lord willin', I'm there.

These are using Intermat's rankings for conference 'finish' for arguments sake... 125 1 - Lee, Iowa, B1G 1st 2 - Glory, Princeton, EIWA 1st 3 - Cardinale, West Virginia, B12 1st 4 - DeAugustino, Northwestern, B1G 2nd 133 1 - Bravo-Young, Penn State, B1G 1st 2 - Fix, Oklahoma State, B12 1st 3 - Arujau, Cornell, EIWA 1st 4 - McGee, Arizona State, P12 1st 141 1 - Matthews, Pittsburgh, ACC 1st 2 - Woods, Iowa, B1G 1st 3 - Alirez, Northern Colorado, B12 1st 4 - Bartlett, Penn State, B1G 2nd 149 1 - Diakomihalis, Cornell, EIWA 1st 2 - Gomez, Wisconsin, B1G 1dt 3 - Johnson, Iowa State, B12 1st 4 - Sasso, the Ohio State, B1G 2nd 157 1 - Robb, Nebraska, B1G 1st 2 - Humphreys, Lehigh, EIWA 1st 3 - O'Connor, North Carolina, ACC 1st 4 - Franek, North Dakota State, B12 1st 165 1 - O'Toole, Missouri, B12 1st 2 - Griffith, Stanford, P12 1st 3 - Monday, Princeton, EIWA 1st 4 - Carr, Iowa State, B12 2nd 174 1 - Starocci, Penn State, B1G 1st 2 - Plott, Oklahoma State, B12 1st 3 - Labriola, Nebraska, B1G 2nd 4 - Lewis, Virginia Tech, ACC 1st 184 1 - Brooks, Penn State, B1G 1st 2 - Keckeisen, Northern Iowa, B12 1st 3 - Hidlay, NC State, ACC 1st 4 - Coleman, Iowa State, B12 2nd 197 1 - Elam, Missouri, B12 1st 2 - Bonaccorsi, Pittsburgh, ACC 1st 3 - Dean, Penn State, B1G 1st 4 - Truax, Cal Poly, P12 1st 285 1 - Kerkvliet, Penn State, B1G 1st 2 - Parris, Michigan, B1G 2nd 3 - Hendrickson, Air Force, B12 1st 4 - Cassioppi, Iowa, B1G 3rd

I don't know if anyone here grew up watching Bowery Boys reruns, but the classic "It was 120 degrees centipede" was one of my favorite malapropisms ever.

Reminds me of a story. When I was in high school our 250 lber was legendary for eating. He always said when he got home from school, he would eat at his Gramas across the street, then have supper at home. One of the other kids on the team had a car and used to give us a ride home after practice. One night we went to the Red Barn fast food joint, like Mickey Ds. When the girl asked what we wanted, the 250 lber said "Give me 6 Big Macs". She said they didn't have Big Macs, they had Big Barneys. He said "Give me 6 of them too".

Lol. Check this out. https://rokfin.com/article/11764/Jaggers-Friday-Mailbag--162023 Should winning certain in-season tournaments give a seeding boost that's similar to UWW ranking series events? "I feel like it's almost the only way to keep the competition at tournaments on the level. I say we add the Last Chance Open to CKLV, Midlands, and Scuffle as the big four seeding tournaments and hold it in February...Do I expect any actual change to resolve this forfeit issue? I don't. The powers that be are not about to change the entire system of college wrestling because Seton Hall Pirate isn't getting his full slate of wrestlebacks."

That'd be a pin with SHP's new rule.

Cardani had surgery in the off-season. Maximo is super talented, but has been slowed down by injuries and illnesses. And speaking of injuries ... ... Mikey Carr had an amazing redshirt freshman year, wrestling in the B1G finals after beating Nick Lee handily in the semis. And those weren't my favorite moments of that year. My favorite moment came in his first varsity match against Jaydin Eierman when he shot a double and picked him up and carried him around the mat on his shoulders until the ref called him for stalling. Ha! Who even does that? Then, injuries tore him apart. As a model student and citizen, he's the perfect reason for medical redshirts.

UIUC did not have a med school until 2015-16ish. They created a new engineering and quant based med school that is the first of its’ kind in the US. I don’t think the first class has even become fellows yet. So maybe that could have a different type of rigor and intensity for a year 2 than a “typical” med school? Or maybe he’s getting a grad cert and skipped med school? @ILLINIWrestlingBlog what’s the scoop?

F*&$# You!!

At this point, we should start giving exaggerated congratulations to ranked wrestlers who don't actually duck each other. We should commend Vito for going out there with nothing to gain after having beat Latona twice in the past including earlier this season.

think this may be his "medical white lab coat" year.

the bow and arrow is totally legal in free all ages... up until a couple of years ago it was illegal for only the little kids... schoolboy and down... never seen anything other than a kid acting hurt because he just lost... that is not to say it is not uncomfortable... last year i stopped a bow and arrow in a cadet match because it was applied to a kid who had no idea how to wrestle and that poor kid turned against it and i did not want to see his knee get ripped apart... a former world team member coach and his former high level wrestling wife both jumped all over me saying how it is not illegal... why did you stop it... blah blah blah... i explained to them both i knew it was perfectly legal and their kid did nothing wrong... but the other poor kid had no clue how to wrestle and i did not want him getting hurt just because he didn't know anything... i felt the same way reading this thread...

Dan Gable's senior Year (1969-1970) Rick Ramirez, Missouri, 3:11 Gary Baker, Drake, 1:13 Larry Woodson, Missouri, 1:17 John Stein, New Mexico, 3:44 Tom Bensen, Arizona State, 3:52 Dan Larkin, Arizona, 2:57 Midlands Tournament John Fregeau, Illinois, 3:56 Larry Hurlburt, Central Michigan, 1:55 Warren Gamble, Ball State, 3:30 Dave Dominick, Oklahoma State, 7:43 Keith Lowrance, Michigan State, 6:42 Vince Raft, Southern Illinois, 3:46 Tom Meier, Nebraska, 5:21 Phil Fitzgerald, Oklahoma State, 5:45 Herb Campbell, Lehigh, 23-3 Fred Kemp, Hofstra, 5:47 Bill Beakley, Oklahoma, 3:40 Ivar Moi, Indiana State, 2:31 Doug Campbell, Oklahoma State, 1:32 Bob Pomplun, Mankato State, 3:50 Steve Walters, Kansas State, 2:40 Charles Annand, Colorado State U, 2:47 Dan Talcott, Colorado, 4:12 Don Silbaugh, Wyoming, 3:49 Mike Grant, Oklahoma, 9-4 Big Eight Tournament Dan Talcott, Colorado, 2:38 Lyle Cook, Kansas State, 3:56 Doug Campbell, Oklahoma State, 2:22 NCAA Tournament Larry Hulburt, Central Michigan, 3:11 Steve Walter, Indiana State, 5:28 Gary Pelci, Minnesota, 4:29 Bill Bleakley, Oklahoma, 2:27 Wayne Bright, Old Dominion, 6:33 LOST to Larry Owings, Washington, 13-11

... and we're in the middle of college wrestling season, I know, I know... D3

Is the plan to have Brooks bump up or recall Beard who is on loan from Lehigh? Can Carter bump up to cover 184, guessing he could.

I'm bored, no college football, too cold to ride outdoors.

Maybe they play it differently in Ohio. Where i am in high school its dead stop on the buzzer but club (in multiple states) soccer continuation. PS: just trying to protect you from airborne concrete, sorry but that.

... hold the pickles. D3

How about a "proportionally shrunken" 125 pound Gable Steveson versus Lee?

Yeah... especially if one is posting Play x Plays and it goes into SV-rideouts... that certainly went BEYOND 15mins (ex.: 133 OT bout, Arujau/Latona match) More like 15 minutes. Exclamation point! (...to me. ) D3

Because there are no time outs and the clock doesn't stop, the game has, 'added time' for the purpose of injuries, time wasting, arguing with the officials, etc. not for scoring chances. As I'm sure you're aware. If we added ten seconds to the clock after a stalling call though...

I order it with extra pickles, hold the sandwich

I really like it. Reminds me in Soccer when they are beyond the final time, but they are in the midst of a scoring chance, they let it go until things have settled down.

I thought Carr was going to med school and that’s why he didn’t come back last year? I don’t think this is what they mean when they say “he has a medical redshirt left.”

You have fifteen minutes. Period.

The pickle does make the chicken sammich!

Also if one is actively editing a post they should be able to go beyond the 15 minutes. C'mon Bob!

Jacob??? Is that you?

I really did believe ya ionel!

Have you got in line to understand how fast the line moves? The chicken is tasty & warm plus you can get with pickles.

They said he was 215 last year and 265 this year. It took me longer but I ground my way to an extra 50 too.

I don't get why people get so excited about chicken sandwiches, the Chik-fil-A near me always has a drive-thru line out of their parking lot.

Hilger was better as an athletic 225 pound heavyweight

LMAO at the substitution censor @BobDole

C'mon, man! It's happening up in Ithaca Jan 14th (& I'm not talking about the weather, either.) Cornell vs LEHIGH... and it looks pretty good for the home team too. (Maybee if someone could put some itching powder in the Big Red's singlets prior to the dual? ) D3

Minus 1 team point for unsportsmanlike when he celebrates by twerking at the Penn State bench

I don't care if you post on this thread or not. But you seem very invested because you started it and post the most on this. I asked you why you are concerned and you still have not answered that question. I see you are tired of arguing and not answering direct questions. That can wear on a guy I understand. You ask why I don't care, but I have answered that numerous times in this thread. All you have to do is read, and that direct answer is there in numerous posts. I have been very direct and clear. If you choose not to read them and understand them, that is not on me. I sense you are just argumentative for the sake of being argumentative. Whenever anyone, including me, asks you a direct question, nothing but deflection or obfuscation is provided. That can wear on a guy to have to do that all the time, whereas just answering the question would end it. Seems like a simple approach you might try. I enjoy your posts on the international board, full of great insight and actual facts and data. Very much unlike your political posts which are just opinion with no actual facts behind them. Opinion is ok. Everyone has one. But your attempts to prove your point by pointing to other opinions void of any actual data is not proving your point. That is ok, everyone has their deal going and I'm passionate about what I believe too. But I attempt to answer questions directly and show facts and data to bolster my point of view. But if you want to take a break, that's good. Probably be better all around. mspart

Just white-out the 1!

How about this one, guys?