Iowa v PSU - Jan. 27, 2023

[Wrestleknownothing]

3 minutes ago, fishbane said:

 

Back to predictions Flo posted there whiteboard war and Bray picked Iowa to win 21-12.  It's a more lopsided Iowa win than anyone predicted in this thread.

 

I will go one step further. There is not even anyone on Hawkeye Report predicting a 9 point Iowa win. The most diehard of those diehards has it as an 8 point Iowa win (21-13). Hell, 8 of 13 over there are picking PSU outright.

[PortaJohn]

Any Iowa insiders know why Caleb Rathjen is listed with Murin as a possible starter at 149?

[ionel]

37 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

I will go one step further. There is not even anyone on Hawkeye Report predicting a 9 point Iowa win. The most diehard of those diehards has it as an 8 point Iowa win (21-13). Hell, 8 of 13 over there are picking PSU outright.

prob to throw Carl off the secret plan.   We know Lee is the best ever seen, we know Gable could beat everyone in the room through HWT and Lee is better, thus Tom can plug Lee in wherever needed to win the meet.

1 minute ago, PortaJohn said:

Any Iowa insiders know why Caleb Rathjen is listed with Murin as a possible starter at 149?

to throw Carl off the Lee Plan, see above.

[PortaJohn]

1 minute ago, ionel said:

prob to throw Carl off the secret plan.   We know Lee is the best ever seen, we know Gable could beat everyone in the room through HWT and Lee is better, thus Tom can plug Lee in wherever needed to win the meet.

to throw Carl off the Lee Plan, see above.

Whoa!

[Mr. PeanutButter]

Yeah, if either Rathjen or Schriever wrestle at this thing, I am throwing a riot

[Jimmy Cinnabon]

1 hour ago, PortaJohn said:

Any Iowa insiders know why Caleb Rathjen is listed with Murin as a possible starter at 149?

Just a smoke screen.  Murin will go.

[PortaJohn]

11 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Just a smoke screen.  Murin will go.

This ain't football Jimmy.  Listing Rathjen doesn't change PSU's gameplan

[Jerry Callo]

I know Lee is good but I doubt very seriously he could beat either Kerk OR Cass.  This thing about one light weight beating the whole team is reserved for guys allergic to kyrptonite.  

[Le duke]

I know Lee is good but I doubt very seriously he could beat either Kerk OR Cass.  This thing about one light weight beating the whole team is reserved for guys allergic to kyrptonite.  

A while back someone on HR said, “Spencer would tech Nick Lee. He’s never felt anyone as strong as him.”

The same Nick Lee who regularly wrestles with World silver medalist and 3x NCAA champ at 149, Zain Retherford. Who brutalized Sorensen on top.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

2 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

I will go one step further. There is not even anyone on Hawkeye Report predicting a 9 point Iowa win. The most diehard of those diehards has it as an 8 point Iowa win (21-13). Hell, 8 of 13 over there are picking PSU outright.

I personally have Iowa winning a close one, only because I feel the particular Iowa wrestler's personal history makes him a slight favorite in a number of individual matches.  I have Iowa winning close at 141, 149, 165, 285; and that is only because I picked Iowa to win close ones in those bouts.

In reality, if asked to pick a winner without picking ten bouts, I would say PSU.  I can see Iowa winning any of those four bouts.  I can't see them winning ALL of them., and they need them all.

[Holtfan]

I may as well get in on the fun.   

To me, swing is 149 and 285 -- PSU wins 149, you can put a stamp on it. Iowa wins 149 and it will come to to 285. 

Additionally--are we certain Brands goes at 174? He was out last week and it almost cost Iowa. 

125: Lee fall Steen 6-0 Iowa

133: Bravo-Young mdec Teske 6-4 Iowa

141: Woods mdec Bartlett 10-4 Iowa

(S)149: Murin dec Van Ness 13-4 Iowa

157: Haines dec Siebrecht 13-7 Iowa

165: Kennedy dec Facundo 16-7 Iowa

174: Starocci dec Brands 16-10 Iowa 
or
174: Starocci mdec Rhodes 16-11 Iowa

184: Brooks dec Assad 16-13/16-14 Iowa 

197: Dean dec Warner 17-16 PSU/16-16 tie

(S)285: Kerkvliet dec Cassioppi 20-16/19-16 PSU 

[PortaJohn]

Here you go @Wrestleknownothing (Assuming Haines Wrestles) with bout scores

125 Lee Pin  (1st period) 6-0

133 RBY MDEC (15-6) 6-4

141 Woods Dec  (5-3) 9-4

149 SVN Dec (3-1) 9-7

157 Haines Dec (8-3) 9-10

165 Kennedy Dec (6-4 Sudden Victory)  12-10

174 Starocci MDEC (14-5) 12-14

184 Brooks Dec (9-3) 12-17

197 Dean Dec (5-2) 12-20

HVWT Kerk Dec (7-3) Iowa 12 PSU 23 or 20-15 PSU if Haines shirts

Edited January 27, 2023 by PortaJohn

[Wrestleknownothing]

1 hour ago, Holtfan said:

I may as well get in on the fun.   

To me, swing is 149 and 285 -- PSU wins 149, you can put a stamp on it. Iowa wins 149 and it will come to to 285. 

Additionally--are we certain Brands goes at 174? He was out last week and it almost cost Iowa. 

125: Lee fall Steen 6-0 Iowa

133: Bravo-Young mdec Teske 6-4 Iowa

141: Woods mdec Bartlett 10-4 Iowa

(S)149: Murin dec Van Ness 13-4 Iowa

157: Haines dec Siebrecht 13-7 Iowa

165: Kennedy dec Facundo 16-7 Iowa

174: Starocci dec Brands 16-10 Iowa 
or
174: Starocci mdec Rhodes 16-11 Iowa

184: Brooks dec Assad 16-13/16-14 Iowa 

197: Dean dec Warner 17-16 PSU/16-16 tie

(S)285: Kerkvliet dec Cassioppi 20-16/19-16 PSU 

Atta boy

[Wrestleknownothing]

Supposedly there are other matches this weekend, and there is a rumor that they will even continue to wrestle until some time in March. I find it hard to believe, but who am I to take away hope? Instead, I will provide the final update before tonight’s dual between Iowa and Penn State.

Most Favored Wrestler Status

Cometh the hour, cometh The Man. It is a near universally accepted fact (can a fact be universal if it is only near?) that Spencer Lee will take his pinfall streak to eight this evening. It is also anticipated that he will grab the mic and announce to the world that “it’s a pinfall, people”.

Below are the weights ordered by total expected points for the expected winner. Only BAC had the intestinal fortitude to pick Jesse Ybarra to beat Gary Steen so Lee could bump up to 133 and do The Deed.

 

Honorable mentions go to Aaron Brooks and Carter Starocci who were also unanimous selections, but expected to score fewer bonus points.

UPSET ALERT

You heard it here first. Gary Steen has been playing the long con. And he has you all fooled. Like lambs to the slaughter.

Every Answer is Wrong

But we are right on average.

The expected final score is Iowa 14 – PSU 21. Last year the expected final score (19 - 13) was the actual final score, but no one picked that actual score. The same is true again this year. If however, the final is 14-21 then BerniePragle and Mr. PeanutButter will have some braggin’ to do, both having predicted 15-21.

 

Get That Fence Post Out of Your...

We got a bunch of fence sitters on this board. Some people just want to have their cake and eat it too. Those guys are the worst. Make up your minds already.

The are six namby pamby, wishy washy undecides who want to change their choice if Haines stays red tonight. 

No One Expects The Spanish Inquisition…

And no one expects the Hawkeyes to win the majority of matches. Even the most diehard among us have it five matches to five with an Iowa dual victory dependent on bonus point wins. Well really just one bonus point win, but who’s counting (me, I’m counting, of course I am)?

Note: the original title of this section was Sister Kissing.

The Partisans
We all come to Intermat's message board for the non-partisan, well-reasoned, level-headed discussions, but every now and then it is good to take a peek at the wild one-sided views of the team specific boards. As mentioned previously, the Hawkeye Report crowd does not hold out great hope for the black singlets tonight. They are still predicting a PSU win by the score of 16 - 19. Meanwhile, the combined PSU faithful have the score 23 - 13. Irrational exuberance? Likely, but I am even more extreme in my prediction, so what the hell do I know?

Credits:

Thank you to @1032004, @BAC, @Barracuda141, @BerniePragle, @D3UC157, @FearTheTurtle, @fishbane, @flyingcement, @Gus, @Holtfan, @Interviewed_at_Weehawken, @ionel, @Jimmy Cinnabon, @Le duke, @Mr. PeanutButter, @Nailbender, @nhs67, @Nittanychris, @Perry, @Pish, @PortaJohn, @RandolphTJones, @TylerDurden, @VakAttack, @Wrestleknownothing

For playing my game.

 

Edited January 27, 2023 by Wrestleknownothing

[BerniePragle]

24 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

It is a near universally accepted fact (can a fact be universal if it is only near?) that Spencer Lee will take his pinfall streak to eight this evening.

Sure.  Facts aren't nearly what they used to be pre-internet.

Thank you for making the game for us to play!

[ionel]

28 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

 

Cometh the hour, cometh The Man. It is a near universally accepted fact (can a fact be universal if it is only near?) that Spencer Lee will take his pinfall streak to eight this evening. It is also anticipated that he will grab the mic and announce to the world that “it’s a pinfall, people”.

No way he does that and if he does he has no chance at Hodge award.  Danny said on his death bed there's no such thing, there are falls and pins and any who utter this nonsensical word are not worthy of my award.

Surprised there was no mention of the Wkn-nkW Symmetry Award.  A few folks entered this sub category with their 18-18 etc predictions but we all know that's silly because criteria will make it 19-18. 

For the sake of symmetry I propose Tommie & Carl agree pre meet that if it ends in a 16-16 tie which includes 2pt deductions for each team's bench then said dual shall be thus & therfore consider a tie and we shall henceforth & forthwith refer to this day as Wkn-nkW Symmetry Friday!

[Wrestleknownothing]

39 minutes ago, ionel said:

No way he does that and if he does he has no chance at Hodge award.  Danny said on his death bed there's no such thing, there are falls and pins and any who utter this nonsensical word are not worthy of my award.

Surprised there was no mention of the Wkn-nkW Symmetry Award.  A few folks entered this sub category with their 18-18 etc predictions but we all know that's silly because criteria will make it 19-18. 

For the sake of symmetry I propose Tommie & Carl agree pre meet that if it ends in a 16-16 tie which includes 2pt deductions for each team's bench then said dual shall be thus & therfore consider a tie and we shall henceforth & forthwith refer to this day as Wkn-nkW Symmetry Friday!

As much as I love symmetry, I love weird little corners of the rulebook more. Way more.

So here is what I now hope happens. The dual opens at 125 with Spencer Lee taking on Gary Steen. Just as the whistle blows Lee reaches up to adjust his own head gear. At that moment Steen fires the one and only bullet he knows he will get the entire match. Steen isn't strong enough to take down Lee, but after a bit of scrambling Steen finds himself in the rear standing position and he is hanging on for dear life. Their feet get tangled a bit and Lee winds up putting his hand down for a split second. The ref instantly calls the two for Steen. This only serves to anger Lee so he immediately spins on Steen and within seconds he has secured the pinfall and the match is over. Steam is pouring out of Lee's ears as he head butts every single Iowa fan that has made the trip to State College. Every single one of them is out cold with a strange contented smile on their faces.

Over the course of the next four matches there are numerous reffing controversies. Cael Sanderson throws multiple chairs and costs PSU two team points. Terry Brands wrestles the shoes off the official and starts twisting them in his face earning two team point deductions, one for each shoe.

The balance of the match goes back and forth. The highlight for PSU is when Max Dean secures the bow and arrow on Jacob Warner, pauses to give a knowing nod to the crowd, and then proceeds to empty every arrow in the quiver on poor Warner before securing a pinfall of his own.

PSU has a three point lead at this stage, but Big Time Tony Cassioppi secures a last second takedown to seal the win over Greg Kerkvliet, and the dual victory over PSU on tie-breakers.

But for some odd reason there is a delay in declaring the winner of the dual. Officials are huddled at the scoring table. There is a call for more calculators and more batteries. And finally, after an excruciating amount of time, it is announced that PSU has won the dual on the seventh tie-breaking criteria. 

That's right. In defeat Gary Steen won the dual for PSU in the very first second, while losing the battle he has won the war. The rest of the two plus hours was just delayed gratification.

 

When two teams finish in a tie in a dual meet or a team-advancement tournament, the following criteria shall be applied to determine a winner:

a. Greater number of victories. Note: Forfeits, defaults and disqualifications count toward total number of victories.

b. Combined total number of falls, forfeits, defaults and disqualifications.

c. Total match points scored only from decisions, major decisions and technical falls.

d. Total near fall points scored only from decisions, major decisions and technical falls. (Example: N-2 + N-2 + N-4 = Total of 8 near fall points scored for one team.)

e. Total number of takedowns scored only from decisions, major decisions and technical falls. (Example: T-2 + T-2 + T-2 = Total of 3 takedowns scored for one team.)

f. Least number of unsportsmanlike conduct calls.

g. First takedown scored in the dual meet.

 

Edited January 27, 2023 by Wrestleknownothing

[dragit]

1 hour ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Supposedly there are other matches this weekend, and there is a rumor that they will even continue to wrestle until some time in March. I find it hard to believe, but who am I to take away hope? Instead, I will provide the final update before tonight’s dual between Iowa and Penn State.

Most Favored Wrestler Status

Cometh the hour, cometh The Man. It is a near universally accepted fact (can a fact be universal if it is only near?) that Spencer Lee will take his pinfall streak to eight this evening. It is also anticipated that he will grab the mic and announce to the world that “it’s a pinfall, people”.

Below are the weights ordered by total expected points for the expected winner. Only BAC had the intestinal fortitude to pick Jesse Ybarra to beat Gary Steen so Lee could bump up to 133 and do The Deed.

Every time I read one of your gems like this, I think, "Why can't the people I work with be this thorough, engaging, and insightful?" 

And then I think, "I wonder if the people he works with ask why he goes through the motions with them while saving all his thoroughness, engagingness, and insightfulness for that gang of has-beens and ne'er do wells on that pathetic wrestling board?"

[ionel]

1 hour ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

As much as I love symmetry, I love weird little corners of the rulebook more. Way more.

So here is what I now hope happens. The dual opens at 125 with Spencer Lee taking on Gary Steen. Just as the whistle blows Lee reaches up to adjust his own head gear. At that moment Steen fires the one and only bullet he knows he will get the entire match. Steen isn't strong enough to take down Lee, but after a bit of scrambling Steen finds himself in the rear standing position and he is hanging on for dear life. Their feet get tangled a bit and Lee winds up putting his hand down for a split second. The ref instantly calls the two for Steen. This only serves to anger Lee so he immediately spins on Steen and within seconds he has secured the pinfall and the match is over. Steam is pouring out of Lee's ears as he head butts every single Iowa fan that has made the trip to State College. Every single one of them is out cold with a strange contented smile on their faces.

Over the course of the next four matches there are numerous reffing controversies. Cael Sanderson throws multiple chairs and costs PSU two team points. Terry Brands wrestles the shoes off the official and starts twisting them in his face earning two team point deductions, one for each shoe.

The balance of the match goes back and forth. The highlight for PSU is when Max Dean secures the bow and arrow on Jacob Warner, pauses to give a knowing nod to the crowd, and then proceeds to empty every arrow in the quiver on poor Warner before securing a pinfall of his own.

PSU has a three point lead at this stage, but Big Time Tony Cassioppi secures a last second takedown to seal the win over Greg Kerkvliet, and the dual victory over PSU on tie-breakers.

But for some odd reason there is a delay in declaring the winner of the dual. Officials are huddled at the scoring table. There is a call for more calculators and more batteries. And finally, after an excruciating amount of time, it is announced that PSU has won the dual on the seventh tie-breaking criteria. 

That's right. In defeat Gary Steen won the dual for PSU in the very first second, while losing the battle he has won the war. The rest of the two plus hours was just delayed gratification.

 

When two teams finish in a tie in a dual meet or a team-advancement tournament, the following criteria shall be applied to determine a winner:

a. Greater number of victories. Note: Forfeits, defaults and disqualifications count toward total number of victories.

b. Combined total number of falls, forfeits, defaults and disqualifications.

c. Total match points scored only from decisions, major decisions and technical falls.

d. Total near fall points scored only from decisions, major decisions and technical falls. (Example: N-2 + N-2 + N-4 = Total of 8 near fall points scored for one team.)

e. Total number of takedowns scored only from decisions, major decisions and technical falls. (Example: T-2 + T-2 + T-2 = Total of 3 takedowns scored for one team.)

f. Least number of unsportsmanlike conduct calls.

g. First takedown scored in the dual meet.

 

Just stopped at a Subway on way to Iowa (that's where ill find all the weeken wrestling correct.

You lost me at "pinfall "  

[Wrestleknownothing]

1 hour ago, ionel said:

Just stopped at a Subway on way to Iowa (that's where ill find all the weeken wrestling correct.

You lost me at "pinfall "  

Big mistake. Casey's is the best pizza in Iowa.

Examine the phrase "the best pizza in Iowa".

[Wrestleknownothing]

2 hours ago, dragit said:

Every time I read one of your gems like this, I think, "Why can't the people I work with be this thorough, engaging, and insightful?" 

And then I think, "I wonder if the people he works with ask why he goes through the motions with them while saving all his thoroughness, engagingness, and insightfulness for that gang of has-beens and ne'er do wells on that pathetic wrestling board?"

Gems? You are too kind.

The data I wrangle at work puts up a much bigger fight and the stuff I right about it is a tad drier. Too many editors. Too much compliance. Too many compliance officers who think they are editors.

This is my release.

[ionel]

11 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Big mistake. Casey's is the best pizza in Iowa.

Examine the phrase "the best pizza in Iowa".

That stop was in Nebraska.  Casey's is go to stop on a bike ride (I know em all in my area) pizza mi 75 of century gets ya thru the last 25, excellent by the slice pizza!

[Holtfan]

1 hour ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Big mistake. Casey's is the best pizza in Iowa.

 

This is, without a doubt, the most intelligent statement made today on this board! 

And I love the look on peoples face when you tell them it's "Gas Station Pizza".  

[dragit]

1 hour ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Gems? You are too kind.

The data I wrangle at work puts up a much bigger fight and the stuff I right about it is a tad drier. Too many editors. Too much compliance. Too many compliance officers who think they are editors.

This is my release.

Yep, completely understand, just substitute "clients" for "compliance officers."  Anyway, everyone here should be glad you need the diversion.

[Wrestleknownothing]

25 minutes ago, Holtfan said:

This is, without a doubt, the most intelligent statement made today on this board! 

And I love the look on peoples face when you tell them it's "Gas Station Pizza".  

I couldn't help but notice you deleted the qualifier.