Lee "excuses are for wusses"

[Dogbone]

Hindsight is 20/20.  Coming into the tournament, Ramos was pinned by Lee in the 1st period the previous meeting and Ramos didn't make the B1G semifinals 2 weeks earlier.  There was no guarantee he would make the semis at NCAAs. 

Perhaps Lee should gameplan more, but there is no way Spencer can gameplan for everyone as much as they plan for him.   Also Lee was up 7-4 and on top in the 3rd, he wasn't unprepared, Ramos kept wrestling and hit his move and deserves all the credit. 

[scourge165]

3 hours ago, WrestlingRasta said:

In years past I would say a college athlete doesn’t ‘owe’ this kind of explanation to anyone. But that’s years past. In todays world college athletes are getting paid, and they’re getting paid by individuals and/or LLC’s based on their fan following. With that comes responsibility. I think in today business of college sports, an athlete does have a responsibility for an explanation as to why he withdrew from the national championship. 

Exactly. Athletes for years talked about how schools were making money off of their name and they weren't benefitting. Well...now they are and they can at least let you know if they're injured or not.

Again, not a hill I'd die on, but...he's also a 24 year old athlete. Chael kept calling him a "boy." He's not. He' a man. 

[Perry]

15 hours ago, PencilNeck said:

Lee would have won in the final against Glory.

Glory was going to beat him too. Would have made him front runner for hodge - if Lee was able to make it to the finals that is..

[Formally140]

I think he was trying to overcome hew with that extra bit of arrogance and chippyness he had this year

[BaldAt23]

6 hours ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

At no point did he injury default, nor did any person say that (outside of message boards or social media.)

 

[BaldAt23]

6 hours ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

At no point did he injury default, nor did any person say that (outside of message boards or social media.)

 

[mspart]

Lee got caught on a crazy move.   When was the last time you saw anyone do anything like that?   Maybe Sadulaev vs Snyder in the World Finals.  When Lee got turned around, he looked shocked, at least how I remember it.   He had the presence of mind to get his arms free but it was too late at that point.  Regarding forfeiting the rest of his matches, not unheard of.   It happens from time to time.   My guess is, without a National Championship possible, why put the knees in further harm.   Not worth the risk for 3rd place.   Especially if he has Olympic aspirations. 

mspart

[scribers]

Whenever I was pinned, I accepted it as a failure. I knew I could get better. And sure enough, I developed a world class bridge. It was my best move. My go to move. It was feared.

[scourge165]

43 minutes ago, mspart said:

Lee got caught on a crazy move.   When was the last time you saw anyone do anything like that?   Maybe Sadulaev vs Snyder in the World Finals.  When Lee got turned around, he looked shocked, at least how I remember it.   He had the presence of mind to get his arms free but it was too late at that point.  Regarding forfeiting the rest of his matches, not unheard of.   It happens from time to time.   My guess is, without a National Championship possible, why put the knees in further harm.   Not worth the risk for 3rd place.   Especially if he has Olympic aspirations. 

mspart

I'm a bit skeptical of Lee's Olympic aspirations. 

He was taken down quite a bit early in matches for a Wrestler of his caliber. The way he dominated in College was with that tilt, but with world Class Wrestlers being able to just lay there and not have to bring their arms in...so he can work the tilt, he's gonna have a lot more trouble turning people.

I'm absolutely NOT saying I don't think he can adjust. I think just getting healthier and in better shape will do wonders for him...but I see problems that will make a transition from Folkstyle to Freestyle...despite his very impressive credentials already.

[jchapman]

1 hour ago, BaldAt23 said:

 

The medical forfeit means Lee did not report to the match and does not get charged with a loss on his record.  An injury default occurs during a match and counts as a loss for the defaulting wrestler (eg Austin DeSanto vs RBY).

[wrestlingphish]

1 hour ago, scourge165 said:

I'm a bit skeptical of Lee's Olympic aspirations. 

He was taken down quite a bit early in matches for a Wrestler of his caliber. The way he dominated in College was with that tilt, but with world Class Wrestlers being able to just lay there and not have to bring their arms in...so he can work the tilt, he's gonna have a lot more trouble turning people.

I'm absolutely NOT saying I don't think he can adjust. I think just getting healthier and in better shape will do wonders for him...but I see problems that will make a transition from Folkstyle to Freestyle...despite his very impressive credentials already.

Tell me you haven’t watched Spencer Lee wrestle freestyle without telling me you haven’t watched Spencer Lee wrestle freestyle.

[scourge165]

30 minutes ago, wrestlingphish said:

Tell me you haven’t watched Spencer Lee wrestle freestyle without telling me you haven’t watched Spencer Lee wrestle freestyle.

LOL...wow...the most creative online retort in the WORLD!

Tell me exactly what you took issue with without going back to 2015? Unless this is Chael who thinks Spencer was "#1 in the Olympic rankings, he was favored to win Olympic Gold."

It always seems like people who do the "tell me you haven't without telling me you haven't," struggle to formulate a coherent response beyond the same thing 5.8 million others have said each day.

[Threadkilla]

Spencer showed up for the medal ceremony, and got his picture on the podium and had a photo shaking Ramos hand.   Gotta give him props for that.  

[Jason Bryant]

Spencer showed up for the medal ceremony, and got his picture on the podium and had a photo shaking Ramos hand.   Gotta give him props for that.  

Not to sound crass, but that’s kinda what you’re supposed to do.

[Threadkilla]

1 minute ago, Jason Bryant said:

Not to sound crass, but that’s kinda what you’re supposed to do.

I agree with that.  He should have wrestled back,  but who knows how a person will react in the same situation.  Under a microscope.   

[scribers]

I don’t blame him for not wrestling back. No team placement implications were at stake in either direction. Guys leave this sport with an assortment of physical handicaps. Why add to that for hubris 

[jackwebster]

13 hours ago, scourge165 said:

 world Class Wrestlers being able to just lay there and not have to bring their arms in.

Agree, though (to state the obvious) there's a lot more to wrestling on bottom at the world level. Thus, Fix can't get his trap arm to work anymore.

[Holtfan]

9 hours ago, Jason Bryant said:

Not to sound crass, but that’s kinda what you’re supposed to do.

Sort of what I was thinking.......  We are commending someone for doing what they are expected to do. 

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

15 hours ago, BaldAt23 said:

 

Where does that statement say "injury default?" 

Hint: It doesn't.

It never happened.

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

9 hours ago, Jason Bryant said:

Not to sound crass, but that’s kinda what you’re supposed to do.

Exactly.  But there was speculation that he wasn't going to.

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

15 hours ago, scourge165 said:

I'm a bit skeptical of Lee's Olympic aspirations. 

He was taken down quite a bit early in matches for a Wrestler of his caliber. The way he dominated in College was with that tilt, but with world Class Wrestlers being able to just lay there and not have to bring their arms in...so he can work the tilt, he's gonna have a lot more trouble turning people.

I'm absolutely NOT saying I don't think he can adjust. I think just getting healthier and in better shape will do wonders for him...but I see problems that will make a transition from Folkstyle to Freestyle...despite his very impressive credentials already.

Has a great freestyle top game that served him well in age group tournaments and his one senior level tournament. The hope is that it translates at the senior world level.

[jmoney]

On 3/23/2023 at 4:06 AM, scribers said:

thanks for the reminder, I was going to make a myopic post

[Bigbrog]

Weird that people say they think Lee won't perform based on some perspective in their head of the style of Folkstyle wrestling he does...but then think it's ridiculous for someone to come back and say they think Lee will perform well in freestyle.  Especially when they are using past results as a reason for their opinion.  Can't make this crap up.

Anyway, I was and still am not a fan of Lee not finishing the NCAA's.  Doesn't diminish what he has accomplished, but it is disappointing.  I really hope he wrestles freestyle...he is a generational (if not once in a lifetime) talent and hope it translates to a lot of success on the international stage for the USA!

[Holtfan]

2 hours ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Exactly.  But there was speculation that he wasn't going to.

There was also speculation he left Tulsa and returned to Io_a.  And speculate that he kicked a puppy on this way out of the arena, and that he went to Hank's and ate 15 Big Okie Burgers, and couldn't make weight on Saturday. 

In short....rumors from the armchair wrestlers on the interweb should be take with a grain of salt.  

And my not so humble opinion---mental state of mind can and should be a viable reason for MFF.  After all, didn't the world cheer and say how brave a certain young tennis star was when she dropped out of a major tournament due to this reason or the Olympic Gymnast dropped out of the games siting mental fatigue as the reason?  We like to believe that elite wrestlers are the strongest athletes mentally---but in reality, they are no different than any other elite athlete.  

Just my view from the cheap seats.........

[Barracuda141]

15 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

Weird that people say they think Lee won't perform based on some perspective in their head of the style of Folkstyle wrestling he does...but then think it's ridiculous for someone to come back and say they think Lee will perform well in freestyle.  Especially when they are using past results as a reason for their opinion.  Can't make this crap up.

Anyway, I was and still am not a fan of Lee not finishing the NCAA's.  Doesn't diminish what he has accomplished, but it is disappointing.  I really hope he wrestles freestyle...he is a generational (if not once in a lifetime) talent and hope it translates to a lot of success on the international stage for the USA!

A 3x NCAA champ with no senior level success, yet, is not a generational talent. Going back 20-30 years there are literally 15-20 wrestlers with better resumes than Spencer. And how many times is he going to get pinned? Will he make senior level teams? Can he mentally recover from his knee injuries?

 

Right now, I'm not picking him to beat Gilman