That’s egregious…

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

2 hours ago, Greenwave said:

The problem is there is really no avenue to hold the refs accountable and work to improve.

Actually, there is.

[BuckyBadger]

@PacMan
 

No excuses here, he lost fair and square. But hitting your head like that is obviously going to have an impact on performance.

I think the third place match proved that.

Edited March 23 by BuckyBadger

[Perry]

The officials hosed edman of mizzou in the blood round last night. They took close to 15 minutes to "figure things out". 

[PacMan]

17 minutes ago, BuckyBadger said:

@PacMan
 

No excuses here, he lost fair and square. But hitting your head like that is obviously going to have an impact on performance.

I think the third place match proved that.

Fair enough.  Looks like these two will be going at it for years to come.

[Doublehalf]

14 hours ago, ugarles said:

See you in the third place match if you make it. I feel good about Shapiro's chances.

This aged very well

[1032004]

14 hours ago, TampaRyley said:

Seeing a pin get overturned is one of the most egregious decisions I’ve seen. The video of it doesn’t help. At the very least it should’ve been a takedown and backs.

Lewis kicked Coleman Scott I believe sitting in the chair on the next mat over.  Technically it is the right call to call that OOB.  I could have seen at least giving Pasiuk the TD though.

[1032004]

19 hours ago, forkemaz said:

The challenge of the challenge that helped ngaou advance against chlebov. Is it even legal to challenge a challenge or is that some penn st special type shit?

Wait what happened with that?

[pokemonster]

11 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Lewis kicked Coleman Scott I believe sitting in the chair on the next mat over.  Technically it is the right call to call that OOB.  I could have seen at least giving Pasiuk the TD though.

He kicked Chris Pendleton but point remains the same. Still absolutely sucks. 

[Crotalus]

The no TD for O'Toole in the first period against Carr. Not really an egregious call but perhaps the rules need a little clarification or adjustment (like after JO/Steiber). KOT had the leg hooked and was behind both arms with Carr just barely clinging on to a leg. At worst that was 99% of a TD. Like with the Dean Heil rule, we shouldn't be rewarding guys for being able to stalemate from a hugely disadvantaged situation.

[jross]

19 hours ago, ugarles said:

Thought the stall call against Shapiro in the third period against Cardenas was incredibly premature. It cost him, in the end because with a 3-1 lead and Cardenas holding RT a second stall call would lead to OT. Shapiro's attempt at a shot led to the go-behind that gave Cardenas the win. I think he survives getting his bell rung if he doesn't have the stall looming over him. (Especially when Cardenas spent the entire second period just laying on top of him without trying to turn or getting a stall on top though that also would have been a tetchy stall call).

+1 What cost Shapiro was shooting sloppy at the end of the match while holding the lead.

[jross]

KOT came out hotter than normal at the start of the match and worked very hard for that no take down call.  I thought KOT was the better wrestler throughout.  It was a surreal sight, witnessing KOT break the spirit of CARR but ultimately succumb to the physical strain in the same moment.

[CHROMEBIRD]

I just couldn't believe KOT gassed. Very insightful comment from JB early in the match about recognizing your own strengths, with O'Toole being the better wrestler/scrambler and Carr being the better athlete/physically stronger.

[TampaRyley]

1 hour ago, 1032004 said:

Lewis kicked Coleman Scott I believe sitting in the chair on the next mat over.  Technically it is the right call to call that OOB.  I could have seen at least giving Pasiuk the TD though.

Yeah you’re right, I was fired up last night watching it. Just rubs me the wrong way that it had no real impact on the outcome of the situation.

Edited March 23 by TampaRyley

[wrestle87]

The only answer here is Pasiuk.  That was so egregious.  That was the definition of "adults" getting in the way when something amazing happens.  Lewis had mailed it in, and Pasiuk was rolling.  

That rule also needs to be changed. The rule made sense 20 years ago when most wrestlers were angry and inflexible, but that has changed. 

Every dude in a D1 singlet come NCAA's can do a full split.  Wrestling mats for conferences and certainly the NCAA tournament need to be bigger for the now very plebeian defense of "do a split" defense.  The "oh no my foot's off the mat" defense is so commonplace that O'Toole got hit for stalling for extending his split a bit further to get off the mat.  

That to me, is a broken rule.  The "off the mat" rule is meant to protect wrestlers from injury, but if it is so available for manipulation that a ref views your foot LEAVING THE COMPETITION AREA as strategy, that needs to be fixed.  Make bigger mats.  

Or, do what jiujitsu does and return to the center in the same position you went out of bounds in.  That would be amazing.  Would totally defang the OB line.  "You got yourself into this position, go ahead and get yourself out of it".

[1032004]

17 minutes ago, wrestle87 said:

The only answer here is Pasiuk.  That was so egregious.  That was the definition of "adults" getting in the way when something amazing happens.  Lewis had mailed it in, and Pasiuk was rolling.  

That rule also needs to be changed. The rule made sense 20 years ago when most wrestlers were angry and inflexible, but that has changed. 

Every dude in a D1 singlet come NCAA's can do a full split.  Wrestling mats for conferences and certainly the NCAA tournament need to be bigger for the now very plebeian defense of "do a split" defense.  The "oh no my foot's off the mat" defense is so commonplace that O'Toole got hit for stalling for extending his split a bit further to get off the mat.  

That to me, is a broken rule.  The "off the mat" rule is meant to protect wrestlers from injury, but if it is so available for manipulation that a ref views your foot LEAVING THE COMPETITION AREA as strategy, that needs to be fixed.  Make bigger mats.  

Or, do what jiujitsu does and return to the center in the same position you went out of bounds in.  That would be amazing.  Would totally defang the OB line.  "You got yourself into this position, go ahead and get yourself out of it".

Absolutely agree that we need bigger mats and that the rule gets manipulated by wrestlers, which is why guys get hit for stalling for doing it.

But it is the rule and it clearly wasn’t intentional in this case, so when it gets challenged you have to call it. 

[TampaRyley]

Link to the scramble in question.

https://twitter.com/ctw000/status/1771369534739693806/video/1

[larry_bird_enthusiast]

2 hours ago, Crotalus said:

The no TD for O'Toole in the first period against Carr. Not really an egregious call but perhaps the rules need a little clarification or adjustment (like after JO/Steiber). KOT had the leg hooked and was behind both arms with Carr just barely clinging on to a leg. At worst that was 99% of a TD. Like with the Dean Heil rule, we shouldn't be rewarding guys for being able to stalemate from a hugely disadvantaged situation.
 

I also couldn’t understand why this wasn’t a takedown…behind both arms with a leg hooked, is that not a takedown anymore?

Agree that the rule should be adjusted if it’s not…attacking wrestler is in complete control in this position, defensive guy is just holding on for dear life there, poor incentive to reward the stalemate.

[wrestle87]

48 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Absolutely agree that we need bigger mats and that the rule gets manipulated by wrestlers, which is why guys get hit for stalling for doing it.

But it is the rule and it clearly wasn’t intentional in this case, so when it gets challenged you have to call it. 

Yeah, you're right, really what should have happened is the ref should have blown it dead as soon as mekhi's foot hit pendleton. 

I think one of the real brutal parts of it is the adrenaline dump it put Pasiuk through.  There's a major performance difference between the thrill of getting the pin called and celebrating vs having it blown dead as it goes out of bounds.  

[VakAttack]

What doesn't make any sense is why the TD wasn't awarded.  When Lewis' foot hits Pendleton, it's after he's been cradled and flipped on his head

 

[lightweight]

56 minutes ago, TampaRyley said:

Link to the scramble in question.

https://twitter.com/ctw000/status/1771369534739693806/video/1

Thanks for posting.

Crazy that that was scored as zero points.

[Stockton]

Also, the mat configuration was in dog bone mode, so it moved the center mats closer to the action. 

[forkemaz]

4 hours ago, 1032004 said:

Wait what happened with that?

Ngaou was given 2 point danger and 3 point td. Asu challenges and gets the sequence reversed so the match is still 1 to 1. Cael challenges the challenge and the refs say oh sorry Mr cael we will undo what we have done and now give no danger but the td which essentially decides the match. 

 

I'm not even sure you can challenge a challenge unless you are PSU. But! I will eat crow if I'm wrong I already have some other crow to eat over this tourney.

Edited March 23 by forkemaz

[Dark Energy]

4 hours ago, CHROMEBIRD said:

I just couldn't believe KOT gassed. Very insightful comment from JB early in the match about recognizing your own strengths, with O'Toole being the better wrestler/scrambler and Carr being the better athlete/physically stronger.

@jackwebster - you going to call out Burroughs?  Making sure you stay consistent.  

[TampaRyley]

I can agree with the sentiment lol

[dragit]

3 minutes ago, TampaRyley said:

I can agree with the sentiment lol

A terrible terrible shame. Hard to even process. Could you imagine if that happened to you?