Who beat the most ncaa champs - all time?

[PortaJohn]

46 minutes ago, Lipdrag said:

Agree. Metcalf beat quite a few.  Especially those who graduated after he did who eventually won at 157 or 165 I think.  Going only with my faulty memory:  Schlatter, Caldwell, Burroughs? Jenkins? Gillespie?  Did the tOSU guy ever win NCAA?  

Gillespie was on the other side of the bracket in '09.  Don't know if they ever wrestled that season.  Lance Palmer never won a title and can't recall if Metcalf ever wrestled O'Connor

[PortaJohn]

@Lipdrag Metcalf beat Gillespie in the '10 tournament and he also beat Frank Molinaro that year.  Can add those two to his list 

Edited November 16 by PortaJohn

[fishbane]

1 hour ago, PortaJohn said:

I'm guessing one of the studs from the 2008 149lb group might have the most; Brent Metcalf, Bubba Jenkins, Jordan Burroughs, Darrion Caldwell, J.P. O'Connor, & Dustin Schlatter 

Unlikely.  And also unlikely to be exactly what Starocci had in mind.  Many of those guys would later win NCAAs, but in 2008 I think only three had titles.  Schlatter won in 2006, Gillespie in 2007 (but he moved up), and Metcalf in 2008. It wasn't until 2009 that Burroughs and Caldwell would win NCAAs with JP O'Connor winning in 2010 and Jenkins the following year (2011). I suspect Starocci is talking about beating guys who have already won NCAAs. 

[Gantry]

Steiber beat 4 and possibly 6+ - Oliver, Ramos, Maple and Retherford for sure.

Could have beaten Brewer and Dean Heil. 

[D3 for LU]

Did anyone ever think about LEHIGH's Mike Frick?

Pat Milkovich Mich State 

Jim Bennett Yale

Beat some champs in the Midlands as well... what's his name from Michigan? MARK CHURELLA!

There's more, but I can't think of them... Denny Diehl (RIP, sir!) rattle them off regularly, as I recall.

(ANY of you old timers know of ones that I missed?)

D3

[PortaJohn]

4 minutes ago, D3 for LU said:

Did anyone ever think about LEHIGH's Mike Frick?

Pat Milkovich Mich State 

Jim Bennett Yale

Beat some champs in the Midlands as well... what's his name from Michigan? MARK CHURELLA!

There's more, but I can't think of them... Denny Diehl (RIP, sir!) rattle them off regularly, as I recall.

(ANY of you old timers know of ones that I missed?)

D3

This is the perfect phone a friend for @gimpeltf and @cowcards

From NWHOF, "one of his other significant accomplishments was defeating 7 past or future NCAA Champions at five different weight classes."

Edited November 16 by PortaJohn

[Hammerlock3]

48 minutes ago, Gantry said:

Steiber beat 4 and possibly 6+ - Oliver, Ramos, Maple and Retherford for sure.

Could have beaten Brewer and Dean Heil. 

hey! 

....Heil don't count.

[gimpeltf]

1 hour ago, PortaJohn said:

This is the perfect phone a friend for @gimpeltf and @cowcards

From NWHOF, "one of his other significant accomplishments was defeating 7 past or future NCAA Champions at five different weight classes."

If we're talking people who became champs or were at the time

Frick-

Dan Sherman (IA), Milkovich, Breece (OK), Bennett, Churella, Yagla

 

Close behind Mike Brown-

Bohna UCLA, Mann Ia St, Loban Clemson, Harris Ore St, L Banach Ia, 

[cowcards]

If I was trying to answer this I would only count wins AFTER a wrestler won NCAAs. Beating Mike Macchiavello was way different as a SR than a FR. 

OR

2 separate categories.

I can't answer this because I haven't started working on individual match results. If anyone wants to start compiling to be able to answer that in the future, let me know. 

[scourge165]

8 hours ago, Hammerlock3 said:

related question, did Bruce Baumgartner ever beat an NCAA champ? A troll friend says he sucks because he never beat anyone who won NCAAs.

Carlton Hasselrig

Edited November 16 by scourge165

[Alces Alces Gigas]

Beating a future champ is not beating a champ !   

[AZ_wrestling]

17 hours ago, Mr. PeanutButter said:

Are we only counting wins against college guys during college career? 

If not, Burroughs is probably in the lead? From recent guys, Yianni and Spencer Lee stand out with 5 scalps each off the top of my head

I think Dake has beaten 8 multiple time national champions, which is just insane. 
 

Valencia, Imar, Nolf, Taylor, Cox, Burroughs, Dieringer, Cenzo, 

 

 

[D3 for LU]

1 hour ago, AZ_wrestling said:

I think Dake has beaten 8 multiple time national champions, which is just insane. 
 

Valencia, Imar, Nolf, Taylor, Cox, Burroughs, Dieringer, Cenzo, 

 

 

To be clear.

We're talking folkstyle, NOT freestyle... right?

D3

[Fadzaev2]

I'm enterrtaining an early Thanksgiving today, so I can't check right now...I have an article on Randy Lewis and how many times he beat ncaa, world, and olympic champions.  Lewis could be in the running here.....If no one finds the answer, stay tuned, I may be able to dig it up later.  Fadz

[AZ_wrestling]

2 hours ago, D3 for LU said:

To be clear.

We're talking folkstyle, NOT freestyle... right?

D3

This thread seems to be geared towards that, yes. I was responding to a post that mentioned the inclusion of freestyle. 

[pokemonster]

22 hours ago, Lipdrag said:

Agree. Metcalf beat quite a few.  Especially those who graduated after he did who eventually won at 157 or 165 I think.  Going only with my faulty memory:  Schlatter, Caldwell, Burroughs? Jenkins? Gillespie?  Did the tOSU guy ever win NCAA?  

Put some RESPEK on Lance Palmer's name! But no, he beat Metcalf at Big Ten's then was runner up at NCAAs. 4 time AA. 

[Lipdrag]

23 minutes ago, pokemonster said:

Put some RESPEK on Lance Palmer's name! But no, he beat Metcalf at Big Ten's then was runner up at NCAAs. 4 time AA. 

Yeah, I deserve that.  I was just too lazy to look it up.  I can see Palmer in my mind's eye but could not come up with his name.  Before I came up with Gillespie's name I wrote "that kid from the east coast with a G name".

I carry photo ID not to vote or buy hooch but to keep as a reference whenever I forget my own name.

Edited November 16 by Lipdrag

[scourge165]

19 hours ago, Alces Alces Gigas said:

Beating a future champ is not beating a champ !   

Says who? You're arbitrary ruling? He beat him the year he won an NCAA Championship. 

In other words, he beat an NCAA Champ. 

[Kov88]

On 11/15/2024 at 7:19 PM, Lipdrag said:

Did the tOSU guy ever win NCAA?  

Lance Palmer. No, he got 4th, 8th, 4th, and runner up.

[BIGTENFANBOY]

Does it really count as "beating an NCAA Champ" if you beat them BEFORE they won their title? IMO I would say no..

[BIGTENFANBOY]

3 hours ago, scourge165 said:

Says who? You're arbitrary ruling? He beat him the year he won an NCAA Championship. 

In other words, he beat an NCAA Champ. 

Brandon Slay when 1-17 his first year of wrestling. I guess those 17 kids can say they beat an Olympic Gold Medalist.. 

[scourge165]

7 minutes ago, BIGTENFANBOY said:

Does it really count as "beating an NCAA Champ" if you beat them BEFORE they won their title? IMO I would say no..

It's not like this is being used for seeding. It's just a stupid list. But like anything, you can argue the veracity of each one. If you beat a guy the year he wins it...I think you can count that. 

It's kinda a meaningless award.

So Starocci doesn't have the most NCAA Champs beaten. He's got 4 of them himself! That's the determining factor. 

[BIGTENFANBOY]

4 minutes ago, scourge165 said:

It's not like this is being used for seeding. It's just a stupid list. But like anything, you can argue the veracity of each one. If you beat a guy the year he wins it...I think you can count that. 

It's kinda a meaningless award.

So Starocci doesn't have the most NCAA Champs beaten. He's got 4 of them himself! That's the determining factor. 

Sure, it's just a discussion. My point though is i don't consider Metcalf's wins over JB or Mollinaro as wins over NCAA champs. Where as Carter's wins over Nolf, Derringer, Lewis, Griffith, and Keck are undeniable.

I would never say Paul Jenn beat a 4x Undefeated NCAA Champ where as I would absolutely say Larry Owings beat a 2x NCAA champ..

Edited November 17 by BIGTENFANBOY

[scourge165]

2 hours ago, BIGTENFANBOY said:

Brandon Slay when 1-17 his first year of wrestling. I guess those 17 kids can say they beat an Olympic Gold Medalist.. 

Sure...they can. They can't say they beat an NCAA Champ though!

2 hours ago, BIGTENFANBOY said:

Sure, it's just a discussion. My point though is i don't consider Metcalf's wins over JB or Mollinaro as wins over NCAA champs. Where as Carter's wins over Nolf, Derringer, Lewis, Griffith, and Keck are undeniable.

I guess I'd assume we're talking about College Wrestling...not a guys first year in the sport.

 

This really felt like a throwaway line more than anything. And in HIS case(Starocci) he likely was talking about Nolf and Dieringer as well, but...I don't know...I'll count Mesenbrink as a NC that Carr beat. I'll count Haines as a NC that O'Connor beat. I don't count the guy who I wrestled as a School Boy who went on to be a 3X NC. So, again, make your own criteria! 

 

This definitely isn't a hill I care enough to die on! LOL...the answer, however, may be Marcus Blaze in the future. Not so distant future. Especially if you're counting Freestyle. 

[Tom formerly Tofurky]

My first thought was that Wade Schalles has laid claim to this distinction for ages now.