Winners Circle

Don't you mean Hokey Pokey?

Glad to know I'm not the only one. Cheers boys.

Just like wrestling fans to make problems were there isn't a real one.

From a fan standpoint, NCAA wrestling has far more fans than UWW and USAW. I know there's a lot of variables there, but that is simply a fact. I'm a diehard wrestling fan (all styles), just like most of us on this forum, I've been to 8 straight NCAAs, never been to a single US Open/World Team Trials/Final X/World Championships/etc. I'm not saying the weight classes is the reason for this, obviously. But I'm not sure being like UWW or USAW would be a good thing for NCAA wrestling.

I give Haines the slightest of edges. Not because of the freestyle results, however. But because of Penn State's history in big matches. If it's a true toss up, those matches almost always go their way (especially in the NCAA finals).

Looks like a lot of 'bathroom/concessions' weights to me.

We sure he can beat Gallagher out for the spot? I'm not dogging on Sasso in any way. Rooting for him as much as the next guy. But let's be honest, his best win is Derek Fields (who's ranked #38 by WS) and he has not looked like his old self at any point this season.

Besides Penn State and Iowa (possibly), what 3+ teams do you see ahead of them?

You may be right. It'll be interesting to see. Yep. Duke stays 157 and beats Kasak in year 2. SVN stays at 149. That's my guess. Good point. Hadn't thought of that. That kicks in 2024-2025. Bubba and Suriano did not transfer out due to roster issues, which was the whole original discussion. Yes I mentioned Beard, Nevills, and Barraclough but Beard was the only AA at the time of leaving.

He also had losses to DeAug (x2), Matt Ramos, and Brandon Kaylor. All of whom did not AA. Agree with you on Hendrickson and Hamiti bonus being important.

Yea I understand your point. But I took all fours whole body of work into consideration when I wrote it up. I think you could argue that Spratley/Jamison's NCAA tournaments were outliers (negatively) same way Ayala's NCAA tournament was an outlier (positively). I think S/J both had AA caliber regular seasons and didn't place. Ayala had a mid-AA caliber season and made the finals. Parco is a different case. He has been 4th, 5th, 6th, 8th. So definitely not "high AA". Mid, yes. But not high. But I don't see a way he beats Henson/SVN. Which is why I listed him in the contributor category. Because I don't see a world he makes the finals. But none of this is a hill I'd die on.

But I would not be surprised if Parco placed higher than Ayala either. I think Parco has a higher floor, lower ceiling. Ayala has a lower floor but higher ceiling. Idk if it makes sense, but that's how I feel.

If you told me that Ayala beat Crookham, Nasir, Byrd, etc. I wouldn't be surprised. If Parco beat Henson or SVN I would be surprised.

Your opinion on the "duck" and your opinion on my fandom. All good.

He very clearly said he wasn't 100%. Which was evidence by him also not wrestling Michigan State two days later. He was not 100%, so he sat. Not a duck.

So you think fear doesn't need to be a part of ducking. But then your next sentence you say that the staff doesn't want their competition to be able to figure them out. Wouldn't that be because of fear of being figured out?

THE RESULT IS NOT WHAT IS IN QUESTION. It's whether or not Starocci ducked.

Before the match started I am sure they were 100% confident he would win, yes.

Yes I am sure they, in no way shape or form, saw him losing that match. Which is why it was a massive upset.

I am 100% sure that the PSU staff knew Starocci would beat Griffith. I am certain they are 100% sure he will win every time he takes the mat. Right, and he DID NOT duck Coleman in that match.

When/where did I say the higher ranked dude can't duck? I'm just saying the three examples given (Spencer Lee, Starocci, and Brooks) are inaccurate. Those three guys have never been scared to wrestle anyone.

Spencer Lee didn't duck anyone, and neither did Starocci. The result of the match is not what's in question here. It's whether or not a 4x NC ducks people.

That seems a bit generous for them...

I wouldn't fight you on that. My point with the floor guys is that I think they will make a difference because I think it'll be that close. If you're going straight champs I don't think OKST has any, but Hamiti has the best shot. Hendrickson will score champion type points though. I think Iowa has three realistic shots (Ayala, Teemer, and Buch), but I wouldn't pick any of them. I agree Keuter is very underrated. But to say he is a safe bet to AA, I need to see more. He's not beating Hendrickson, Kerk, or Gable. So there's only 5 spots left. He already lost to Yonger. If you told me he lost to: Ghadiali, Feldman, Trumble, Schultz, or Slav I wouldn't be surprised. Of course it's made up criteria. We're talking about NCAA's in December. Lmao. Intermat has Spratley ranked #3 and Jamison #4. Average rank #3.5. Ayala #5 and Parco #4. Average rank #4.5. You may be right here. I just hedged Block/Petersen seeing as how they both lost to Iowa State backups. Quality backups, but backups nonetheless.

Last year in the regular season Starocci wrestled Welsh & Kennedy (both of whom were ranked top 10). Teams they dualed that he did not wrestle against: Michigan, Michigan State (same road-trip), and Rutgers. Do you think he ducked DJ Shannon and Jackson Turley? That's a genuine question, no sarcasm.