scourge165

Amine is a big '65. I think he could have similar success at '74. Or maybe Griffith wants to suck down to 157. Gonna have to add another 0 to that check UM! As for paying them...good for the athletes. I think it's a little silly, but...if rich people want to invest in watching a year of a College Wrestler and they get a nice chunk of cash to start their life out, great.

You don't think Dake avenged his loss with an emphatic NCAA Title as a Freshmen?

My bad. So twice then he wasn't even the best Wrestler in his own conference. Edit-To be clear, I think that's a ridiculous argument and it should be obvious I was being sarcastic. Taking a loss to someone in your own conference(which Brooks has done twice, not three times as you pointed out) doesn't matter if you win a National Championship. He's lost to Ventz and Amine.

Dustin Schlatter was an outstanding Wrestler. Also, not sure he "stomped him." He lost 3-2, 9-6 and 2-1. And Schlatter was one of the top prospects to come out in a LOONG time. And at least one of those, the 2-1 win was not Schlatter's Freshmen year. Incidentally, this was also Burroughs Freshmen year. He also came back in 2008, lost to Brent Metcalf in the Semi's(another guy with ONE loss in his career and someone who likely would have won a 3rd Title with today's transfer rules) and Wrestled back to 3rd. Dustin Schlatter took 7th in that weight. Justin Burroughs didn't really...develop until his Jr year though, so...with respect, so what? He was also winning World Titles while he was in College. You're not going to make a strong argument with any of these guys by trying to trash another guy...and exaggerating their "failures," only looks weaker.

Well...Aaron Brooks wasn't even the best 184 in his own conference this year. He lost to Marcus Coleman. Hell, for that matter, he wasn't the best last year either. Christ...now that I think about it, Aaron Brooks has only been the best in his conference ONE TIME!!! 3 of 4 years, the 3X NATIONAL CHAMP hasn't been the best in the B1G! Or, maybe that's just kinda silly and winning the NC is more important than losing a conference match. Who's really to say which Wrestlers value more? Conference Titles or National Titles. It's like Sophies Choice. Impossible decision!

Well...an arm vet is gonna have a hard time playing a "young Robles." Bunch of dirty ableists.

Agreed. He was a tweener who Wrestled HWT because he was more focused on Wrestling Freestyle. Imagine having to cut down to ~212 while wrestling HWT? I don't think it was a big cut, but at the same time, he'd probably have gained weight instead of having to stay at the lowest range for HWT...whereas if he wasn't Wrestling Freestyle, he likely cuts down to 197. So yeah, I'll put him at 197 and Cael at 184...and calling it "capital 'S' Stoopid," is just...silly. Again, we're not voting for the HOF or some quantifiable award. These are just simply the best 10 Wrestlers at weights people wrestled. I'm pretty confident Snyder could have Wrestled 197 3 more years and dominated the way he dominated...the WORLD while he was in College(moreso as arguably the greatest Wrestler ever in Freestyle moved up to his weight class).

I agree...completely. It's just fun to make lists. And I put Snyder at '97...a weight he wrestled 1 year and the year he didn't win it. But it's about getting the 10 best guys into the lineup for me. It's really just fun bullshitting, it's not like any of these guys are diminished because Scourge or 11986 don't list him!

You...are kidding about Bouzakis, right?

I just watched a couple of his matches from this year. It's hard to tell from just a handful, but it kinda looked like he was going through the motions out there. Vs Stanford, he hits that incredible drag to a double and finishes, but the first period he's just kinda hanging. He certainly looked like he could turn it up a could of notches and make a big jump, but that may be a bit colored from how I remember him in HS.

Eh, he's a Russia. He didn't want to take the easy way out just to have success in another sport...

ASU makes sense as they're losing their best Wrestler...a 133(Arguably). McGee was a stud. Just SUCH a loaded weight class this year. It'd be fun to see ASU put it all together. They just seem to have some bad luck or something(though I do realize they had back to back team trophies prior to this year). But with Teemer coming back, Schultz, Parco, Teemer could make for 4 potential contenders. Vazquez and Figeruora could both be AAs. I have no clue what to expect from Valencia, but he could certainly take a big jump this year. They're not going to challenge PSU or anything....

This is effectively saying having Dake or Taylor on the list is nonsense. JB is an all-time great. You really think he was not only better than Taylor/Dake, but SO much so that it's ridiculous to put the other two on the team? Burroughs was great. I'm not sure I'd argue that he was that far superior to the rest of the field.

LOL...is that how he put it? That's kinda like the crazy girlfriend or boyfriend, "If I can't have you, nobody can!" I thought he just moved up so his brother could Wrestle 167(and of course stop Banach as that's always a nice feather in your hat).

Fair enough. I HATE how these threads invariably turn into why someone SHOULDN'T be on the list when we're talking about the all-time greats. Lee Kemp? Cool. He was an incredible Wrestler. If you make it how Pat Smith won weak weight classes and wouldn't be able to touch Lee Kemp...that's just insulting to these Wrestlers...the best of the best(obviously YOU'RE not doing that). People who think Askren belongs on there? I get that. I don't personally agree, but it's impossible to question what he did. It's more impressive to me HOW he did it. He knew he wasn't naturally gifted like Ed Ruth. He outworked people to get there, he was a Wrestling savant. He was creative. He was sticking people with cradles and with arm bars. So people started stalling. So he went to that(and I'm loathed to use these terms for moves) but the "assassin" because guys couldn't defend that as well. I still like your choice of Schultz, but different fan bases and people are going to have different lists. I don't get up on a soap box often...but if I ever were to, it'd be on this one, pointing out Ed Ruth's failings to advocate for another Wrestler. I have the same issue in other sports.

I like that list. It's GOTTA be the best against the competition you face, how you fared against your peers...otherwise you go back and look at...Banach for example and compare him to '97 pounders now and the technique just does not compare. But, 1/1/2/1 kinda says it all! I like Abas as 125. He was just incredible on his feet and I BELIEVE all of his losses were to Jurgens from Iowa(twice as a Freshmen in the NCAAs) and then to 3X Guerrero who he bumped up to Wrestle. It's impossible for me to have an educated opinion on Uetake as all I can do is read about his accomplishments(and they are incredible). IF this were my list, I might have Randy Lewis on the list. 2/1/1/7 and then a legit dislocated elbow his Sr year so he basically wrestled with one arm. If memory serves(from an old Coach) he dislocated it just a few weeks before the NCAAs. He was also missing a major pec muscle. You can see it in his freestyle Wrestling(where he battled John Smith). Though, again, pretty impossible to argue against a guy who won 3 titles in 3 tournaments and 2 Olympics, one his Soph year(his first year allowed to Wrestle). So won't argue with that. The only changes I'd make is put Gable in there at 141. He was dominant in College and there's a reason why people consider Larry Owings win as the biggest upset ever. Just one loss ever and then Snyder in there at 197. If we're trying to get the best ever into the lineup, I'd throw him in. He was a WC and an Olympic Champ while in College. Another thing I'd say...before they change the rules, dudes were just bigger. Now Schultz goes up a weight for this but looks like a massive '77(and again, that was him going up, he could have wrestled '67). He looks like a big '84. But Joe Williams wrestling 158, he'd be a '74 pounder now I think. At LEAST a '65. The stories about how much weight they cut are incredible(ly stupid). One reason the 2 hour weigh-ins...much as everyone participating hates them, very good for this sport. But watch this. Two all-time legends. The athleticism. They don't move like Aaron Brooks and they don't hit those shots and scramble, but it's like all sports. It evolves. Most started maybe wrestling a couple months in Middle School in HS for a year or two before going into HS, then HS(Schultz never won a Tournament before winning the California State Tournament as a Sr). Anyway, they certainly have the athleticism and are incredible to watch. Watch Schultz do that backflip after this match.

I mean, McGee is...and they do have similar color uniforms. There are other...minor differences in appearances, but I guess if you have no idea who Mckee is, you could make that mistake!

Well...lots easier to be a good sport when you get a pin in the finals...little tougher when you lose an award.

Well, they just made a movie about Jordan without actually making about Jordan. I suspect this one will focus more on the actual on mat achievements of Robles. It's gonna be a very difficult movie to make for Wrestling fans. 1-You're going to have to pick someone who's missing a leg. If you tried making the movie and used CGI to try and duplicate Robles, people are going to get all angry just like they do when...Bryan Cranston plays a quadriplegic because he's...not actually paralyzed(it's almost as if it's acting). So that could hurt the "young Robles" scenes unless there happens to be a young Latino Wrestler with one leg who excels at tilts, the Wrestling scenes will likely be underwhelming. 2-Getting anyone to try and make the wrestling look real is always difficult, but they really fail to get the culture of Wrestling right. Lets just hope there's not an overweight Wrestling coach wearing a singlet with a tee-shirt underneath it just randomly yelling at guys. Damon and Affleck have made some great movies...or really one in particular, but I'm generally a fan of their movies(save for Gigli...that was a crime against humanity).

I agree with this...to a point. If...for the sake of argument, he and David Carr each go undefeated next year, have similar records and Starocci acts like a douche, I'm gonna vote for Carr. Starocci didn't do anything to disqualify himself IMO. I'd prefer a guy get on the mat, run off the mat after kicking someone's ass without the contrived Metcalf like fake nonsense, but it's College Wrestling and emotions get involved. As long as it doesn't escalate past the "hold me back" bullshit, fine. But man, he'd do himself a LOT of favors by just shutting up.

I don't get why he wouldn't have been in the running, but to think it's funny that Parris won it? He needs to get out of his own way. Confidence is great. The way he's been talking shit is annoying.

Dieringer won in 2016

It's also a great way to make people really dislike Rutgers. Princeton in college athletics is at a major disadvantage. Why you'd revel in their struggles just because your team sucks is...weird. And then make a threat about it? Seems like you're just SUPER bitter about how your team didn't do shit this last year, didn't have a couple finalist and a NC.

HOW did it not resemble commotio cortis? He was hit by a 6'4 220LB WRer in the chest as he lunged forward. That is EXACTLY the scenario in which that occurs. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/damar-hamlin-updates-bills-gathering-medical-advice-on-safetys-future-playing-professional-football/ I have to ask...not being a cardiologist myself, and operating under the assumption that you MUST be one given your absolute certainty about what DIDN'T cause it(likely because you believe you know what DID...that'd be fair to say, right?)... This is pretty much the ONLY thing some people want to talk about and give their opinions on... However, I presume he's not a patient of yours correct? It seems like it'd be in bad taste to offer an opinion on his current health(that contradicts his own from months ago) or his future health in that case).

Well...when you make shit up...what are you supposed to do?