scourge165

I'm not a "Carter was robber," person, I knew Hendrickson would win it when he beat Gable. I did say I thought based on this year Mesenbrink was the most dominant. There was a wider gap between him and every other '65 all year. I would have give it to Carter because he's never won it, he won 5 Titles, he beat Keck twice(I think taking him on in the All-Star Classic took balls) and I think he's underrated...somehow. But I would have given it to both. I think Wyatt deserved it with Stevenson, but...I just thought it should have been split.

The HWT won because he beat Gable...I don't think he wins it if his opponent is Connor Medberry or Greg Kerkvliet. Stevenson had 3 pins this year and...10 techs. Are we saying if Gable doesn't get taken down in the last 15 seconds he loses the Hodge this year as a result of fewer pins? Maybe the biggest upset of all-time determined this award...pretending otherwise is...kinda silly.

I didn't envision Rob Rohn, I...visioned him with my actual eyes. I also didn't envision Mendez and Hardy. Did Tony Ramos dominate Spencer Lee, or was it a big move at the end of the match? I don't know how to make this any simpler. Taking someone down repeatedly...against their will...is more dominant than a pin. That's my take. I "contended" with your argument, I've made mine. What exactly do you suppose we'll gain if we keep going in circles here? And I KNOW you're playing dumb because...you can obviously make a lot of stupid arguments. Why didn't Tony Ramos just CHOOSE to be up by 12 points going into the 3rd period vs Lee, or with did Rohn CHOOSE to get down in the match? This choice thing is nonsense. I think beating someone by 15 points or more...is more dominant than a pin. That's it. That's the end of my entire opinion on this. You can accept it or not, you can't say I didn't "contend" with your argument or point or that I ignored it.

I did "contend" with your arugment then. You just didn't like it.

Please show me where I said ANYTHING about his pins "not being dominant?" I think Tech's show more dominance. That you have now made me aware they're not worth as much in a duel or tournament as a pin is...truly shocking and new information to me! LOL.... This isn't a difficult concept. A pin can be one sequence in which you come out ahead on a guy. It's hard to get a 15 point lead without dominating someone. It's NOT nearly as hard to end up with a fall in a close match.

Rob Rohn already settled the "techs are more dominant than pins" debate. You can get pinned without getting dominated. Hard to get teched without getting dominated. Bo Nickal is...insufferable though. I thought given the times they split it...they should have split it this year. But Wyatt winning it hardly means it's "meaningless." He WAS undefeated and he...did earn it. And who was the HWT they "gave" it to a few years ago? Is he talking about Gable still? Because he kinda earned it(though...not a ton of pins IIRC).

I'm sure they'll make him earn the job, but I'd be surprised if he wasn't on the two deep. Iowa gets very few recruits of his caliber and he was the #1 in his class, but...they have had a couple other good LB recruits come in...and I suppose it's possible he was a bit over-hyped because of his track and Wrestling background...I guess we'll have to see.

Yeah...the arrogance of youth. I was trying to scratch the middle of my back the other day and my shoulder popped out. These kids are more flexible, but when you stretch a rubber band enough, over and over...it's going to loosen it's elasticity and then it's going to tear. Some of these really are on the athlete though. And Askren's guys...I'm sure he's had guys injured, but he did seem to have a few things going for him. He would go out there vs Jake Herbert who looked like Drago from Rocky and Askren...did not. But he was like Gumby, his knees and shoulders bent in ways they shouldn't have and he had preternatural grip strength. I remember he and Herbert Wrestled and Askren would be on his belly, Herbert on his hip, full heavy hips, pulling Askren's arms up so he's reaching back...and he wasn't able to break his lock. It was insane. Nobody else holds on, Herbert scores on anyone else. But, I would imagine that's a bit part of the "play wrestling," as well.

What happen to Robbie Howard? Is he trying to rebuild his shoulder and come back for one more run?

I feel like the injuries just come from the modern style of Wrestling. What are MOST of the injuries? Knees, ankles. Occasionally a shoulder when someone gets extended. Certainly you can overtrain and get injured. The NFL has been studying that to try and limit the hammy and groin pulls, but...when you're putting your knee in a position where it's being bent up and away from it's natural range of motions...well, injuries are going to happen. Penn State, Iowa, Ohio State. One school can just make up for it more.

Throw a healthy Sasso in at '65 or...'57 and Cannon in at '65 and then Welsh probably Wrestles '84. You get Sasso healthy, that's another potential(likely) finalist, Welsh...top 4, healthy Feldman...maybe Davino. And now you start to pick up that momentum that Nebraska got, you start wrestling for each other as much as yourself and I feel like it's a snowball effect. Senseless gun shots. Instead the momentum went the other way... But hey, Sasso was back on the mat, he was a solid Wrestler and...that's a helluva lot more important than anything elee that's happened with any OSU teams this year.

Eh, I just think it's simpler than it's being made out to be(and if there is some "presser" then link it or tell me what it says or...don't say anything). But again, Keuter, great FB recruit...at a school where good LBs generally make it to the NFL. He said he's coming back. Ferentz was asked probably in response a day or two fafter Keuter said that and he said he's not back yet. That doesn't change the statement that he's COMING back. But he simply added the weight class opens up. I never said he wouldn't Wrestle, only that it'll be more difficult AND that he's at the point that if he has a big year on the FB field, he'll be in mock drafts. But if there's something I'm missing, I wish someone would tell me what was in the "Presser." It feels like people really WANT Keuter on the Wrestling team...and I'm not saying he won't be on it, I'm saying...if he's playing Football, he's going to be missing a lot of the year.

I did, but it's a cipher. HUGE news. Just need to decode it.

Fair enough(though...it's not really theory, I take your point). It's just when I see a special brand of stupid, I feel compelled to address it. Anyway...Ohio State, Chittum is good. I'd Wrestle him at '65, make he and Paddy figure it out and Cannon at '74. I don't know if there's a kid I'm pulling for more. All the stuff he's gone through and he was still a stud as a Freshmen. Steep curve with this kid it'd seem. How a kid like that misses 22 months of HS, then comes back and this horribly aggressive and exceedingly rare form of cancer comes back and you miss more time...and then you get on the Mat and are in the B1G Finals as a Freshmen, it's beyond me.

Holy Christ is this moronic! You know...you don't have to watch the news, you can just look at CPI and the GDP. The ACTUAL numbers...which is not surprisingly why Trump is dismantling the CBO. He doesn't want a 3rd party to provide the numbers. He wants to tell us what the unemployment is. Remember in 2016 when he was running and he was "hearing," the "real number" was "as high as 10%, 15%, 20%, I've even heard 40%." Just makes things up. Here are the facts; 1-Inflation is a lagging indicator. When a President takes over an economy that just had 15T dollars wiped out, supply chains decimated and then they ADDED another 6T to the deficit, THAT causes inflation. So Biden inherited that. 2-GDP WAS GROWING AT OVER 3%. It's not CONTRACTING. Do you really need help understanding why that's bad? Smaller Economy=bad. Bigger economy=Good. 3-Inflation-Again, dropping. Down to 2.7%. ~2 months into office, it's going back up and nobody seems to care. So GDP growth going down, inflation going back up, the Stock Market NEARING a crash and....we have people dumb enough to say this is on BIDEN? What a special brand of stupid that takes! We tried Smoot-Hawley. The effects? Anyone? Anyone? It led to the great depression. The great depression was good or bad for Americans? Anyone? Anyone? It was bad. Should we do the thing that caused the great depression and just pretend we don't live in a global economy? Everyone who understands economics-No. MAGA-Urr...Trump say say good, Musk give money! Yay! (Just imagine oversized foreheads, tongues and lots of wrist clapping. Oh, and LOTS of John Cena fans among the groups of people who thinks bringing back Herbert Hoover economics is a GOOD move). I'd also ask how the corporate tax rate gets pushed "100% onto the consumer," but you think THIS type of tax...doesn't. Just...blissful ignorance. ALL of this ignoring you don't put tariffs on your allies and IT'S NOT THE PRESIDENT'S PLACE TO PUT TARIFFS ON COUNTRIES. That is SUPPOSED to be an act of Congress. But since we have a guy who is openly talking about running for a 3rd term, the laws seem to be of little consequence. Oh, and AGAIN, Trump JUST a few years ago negotiated the "greatest trade deal ever, a perfect trade deal, a much better deal than NAFTA...which was terrible." They were the same agreements, but as part of his LAST agreement with Canada and Mexico is that you CANNOT IMPOSE TARIFFS. That was TRUMP who wanted that. There's a reason our allies can no longer trust us. Because we lie to them...with Trump, it's a constant. Anyone who thinks doing a good job...that sucks for you...because everyone else sees it when they look at the market and how he's decimating 401Ks and people's Retirements.

LOL...it's so cute you think THAT'S what he's trying to do. First, look at who created the MAJORITY of that debt. Second, look at what his plan is. To then cut taxes AGAIN. So ANY money saved(and DOGE is the biggest scam there is, it's "cancelling" contracts that have already been executed so they can pretend it's more than it is and counting the same expenditure 3X). If you want to look at America's MOST prosperous Decade and when we had a similar debt, look at the 1950s. Look at the taxes rates. Ya know what the DUMBEST possible thing you can do for the debt is though? It's take a GDP that's GROWING and through Policies that have PROVEN to be disastrous, implement them so GDP actually contracts. Growing GDP-GOOD for paying down debt. Contracting GDP-BAD for paying down debt. We want to go back to the 1950s in every way EXCEPT the way that actually got us out of debt. Higher marginal tax rates for the wealthy under...Eisenhower. But that's the part of the 1950s we DON'T want to go back to apparently.

Oh C'mon...there's no slams in Freestyle, the higher amplitude the throw, the more points. I don't know how you can possibly even argue it's not more dangerous? It's common sense. And there's no "studies" to back up Freestyle Wrestling is more dangerous compared to Folkstyle(or Football) because WE DON'T WRESTLE FREESTYLE. Askren's camps, nothing would change there. Do you think if we specialized in Freestyle, people wouldn't still go to AWA? Of course they would. The Granby Camp? Yeah, I'm sure that'd just be replaced by more Freestyle camps. I agree on the first part. Folkstyle will never change, it will be what we Wrestle in High School and College. Our National team is competitive, but here again, 6 spots for the Olympics, 10 for the World Championships. You think that's worth changing the style of Wrestling that hundreds of thousands of kids participate in?

Yeah, he JUST said he was coming back. Spring Practices haven't started. You can't BE back with something that hasn't started yet. And of course it's a real challenge. That...is obvious and it all kinda proves my point. The Wrestling side is the one that's going to hurt from this. I doubt they're telling one of their top recruits he can't come back and join the team. Being able to Wrestle AND play Football was always part of the deal when he went to Iowa. Kerentz already signed off on this. You make exceptions for special talents. Keuter is one of the better FB prospects to come out of Iowa in a while. For context, Tristan Wirfs was a 3 star recruit. The prospect that Keuter was most closely compared to? Jack Campbell. So the fact that within a day or so of Keuter saying he's going back to Football, Ferentz saying he hadn't yet rejoined the team within days of the end of the NCAA tournament...I don't think it means anything. What's there to rejoin at this point? Strength and Conditioning? I'm pretty sure Keuter has been doing those...and he's gotta start to bulk up(that would help his Wrestling). But he goes into the Spring and is the best LBer they have...which is hardly a stretch given who they graduate, you think they're going to say, 'nah, we changed our mind because you Wrestled?'

It's not even about how good he actually is, it's about the fact that HE said he's going back to Football. What I disagree with was your premise that if he was actually good at Football, he wouldn't have taken a year off to Wrestle. Well, does that logic not follow that if he was that good at Wrestling, he wouldn't sacrifice a big chunk of his Wrestling season to go back to Football? MOST importantly, you nailed it right here; I think it's easier on the Football side to go back to Football after the Wrestling training and have success. I think it hurts the Wrestling side a WHOLE lot more than the Football side, especially if he's going to be with the FB team for the whole season. Even if he's not an NFL caliber player...the fact that he's going to be with the team is all that really matters. I haven't seen the kid play other than a few clips(and he sure as hell looks like an NFL type talent with that size, frame and athleticism). But lets say he's not good enough to be drafted. If you start at Iowa, you'll catch on with an NFL team and at least get a shot, but...lets say he's not. It's still time away from Wrestling.

And how douche bags stay douche bags. If you have some great insight or there has been some significant change in the past 6 days since Kueter said he was going back to Football full time, then share that. Don't direct me to a 'presser' by someone I've never heard of. If you have information...share it. Or don't...because that's always helpful.

Oh...well, it is. And no, Football is not 10X more dangerous. I'm not going real far into this, but take this and then apply it to kids who don't have the body control or strength to even bring them back to this type of control and tell me you're "not sure it's any more dangerous." This is a big more dangerous.

No...it's not. Our Freestyle team is...pretty competitive. To the last one...just...no. LOL...you think there's a big conspiracy because coaches are rolling in that sweet, sweet money teaching escapes? Strongly disagree. Look at the rules for Freestyle vs Folkstyle. You get a kid on a double on your shoulders in Folkstyle, what's the ref saying? "under control, under control." Not, "screw it, launch him, see where he lands." Yeah, I think you're wrong about not losing kids. But I agree with your last sentence. They are PRETTY similar. So lets stop whining about it and just...keep Wrestling.

Yes, this is the point I'm making. When I was in School, you played 3-4 sports. You did that at a school with 450 kids in my grade(and mine was a small one). Not...they don't. It's not because of the size of schools. It's because kids specialize in the sports they're the best at. When I'm talking about athletes specializing, I'm talking about the type who would be able to play whatever sport they wanted in most cases. If you're talking about kids who are average or worse in sports, well...that's not exactly the demographic we're talking about here. We're talking about guys like Aedon Sinclair types. Guys who are great at one sport and that's what they focus on and they go and get the best training available and they compete all season because they think(or just as often, their parents think) it's the only way their kid is going to be able to compete. Did AJ Ferrari play Football? I mean, it wouldn't surprise me either way, but I doubt it.

Respectfully, I don't care about raising the level of dominance for the tiny fraction of kids that will Wrestle it. I want to see kids going out for Wrestling. I don't think you'll see as many going out if it's Freestyle(and Greco...obviously we have to keep Greco since this is all about those 6 spots on the Olympic team and 10 spots on the world team)...and to be honest, I wouldn't let my kid Wrestle Freestyle when he was 7-8 years old. It's more dangerous. That's the "big picture" to me. Kids into HS then into College and then into the job market having competed and dealt with everything Wrestling teaches them. You say you're looking at the big picture, but you're not. You're looking at the smallest possible picture from which you could view American Wrestling.

No