Non GOAT best ever

[Room Guy]

There are a few guys that can be argued are the GOATS of Wrestling for around their weight classes (B. Satiev, Smith, Sadulaev, Karelin,  etc.) Who are the guys that at their absolute best, could have beaten anyone at any time including those GOATS? Here are a few that at their best would've been hard to beat by anyone. Who are some others?

Jordan Burroughs-(only career better is B. Satiev)

Tom Brands

Adam Saitiev

Karam Gaber

Omid Noroozi

Les Gutches

Saghid Sajidov

Gable Steveson

Toghrul Asgarov

Reza Yazdani

Lee Kemp

Daniel Igali

 

 

[mspart]

Les Gutches is a good add here.   He was good for a long time.   But at one point, he was the best.  

Daniel Igali was incredible.   I saw him lose to  McIlravy at the Pan Ams in Winnipeg, only to beat him at the Olympics.   He was really good that year.  

Adam Saitiev I would put at the top of the list.   He moved up a weight and dominated.   He was an incredible talent. 

mspart

[wrestlingshoe]

2 hours ago, mspart said:

Daniel Igali was incredible.   I saw him lose to  McIlravy at the Pan Ams in Winnipeg, only to beat him at the Olympics.   He was really good that year.

Igali was amazing, both world and Olympic champ. 

[Lleynor]

Not exactly what you’re asking, but I would have paid good money to see Karelin at his best vs. Lopez at his best. Firmly believe Karelin would win, but would love to find out. 
 

If Adam Saitiev had a different brother, who knows what he could be at 74. He was so damn undersized and yet won. Those brothers were the definition of what a technician in Wrestling is. 

[Elevator]

at the time when the Moscow Olympics were boycotted, I thought mean Gene could beat anyone and perhaps by fall

 

But it was not a studied understanding - just my impression and way before there was so much data to review

[GrandOlm]

Two wrestler stand out to me. 

Ivan Yarygin. It's not just the name of a tournament. A great siberian wrestler, extremely strong, and built like a greek god. Pinned everyone at runs at the Europeans, Worlds, and Olympics. He doesn't have the medal haul of other wrestlers, but he was so special. 

The other one is Tomov. Best wrestler to never win an Olympic Gold. Three times silver medalist and was number one in the world for 15 years. He was so talented that he beat a giant like Rostorotsky, after a 5 year lay off at his first tourney back. Choked terribly at the Olympics each time. If it wasn't for politics, I think he would have finally won at the 84 games. 

[Room Guy]

Great examples! I like the Mean Gene one. The boycott really crushed guys.

[Gene Mills Fan]

8 hours ago, Elevator said:

at the time when the Moscow Olympics were boycotted, I thought mean Gene could beat anyone and perhaps by fall

 

But it was not a studied understanding - just my impression and way before there was so much data to review

He pinned everyone in the Tublisi following the 80 Olympics. Only American to be Most Outstanding Wrestler

[Gene Mills Fan]

1 minute ago, Gene Mills Fan said:

He pinned everyone in the Tublisi following the 80 Olympics. Only American to be Most Outstanding Wrestler

Then at beat the 80 Olympic gold Russian after cutting 10 pounds in a day because he couldn't train because of  some skin rash.  

[Eagle26]

I would think Dan Gable and Cael Sanderson have to be on this list domestically. 
 

Also Kolat was the best in the world for several years in row but was robbed of the hardware to prove it. 

Edited May 8 by Eagle26

[Bigbrog]

Dave Schultz

[WrestlingRasta]

3 hours ago, Bigbrog said:

Dave Schultz

End thread 

[Tripnsweep]

A guy who gets overlooked a lot is Abdollah Movahed. 5x world champion and 68 Olympic champion. He got injured in the preliminary round in Munich so he didn't get a chance to wrestle Gable. 

Another guy who was a good as they come was Gogi Kougashvili. Won worlds 5x and an Olympic bronze but never won an Olympic gold. 

[Lucho]

Rasoul Khadem can also be in the conversation for this as well. He had a pretty good record against one of the GOATs Makharbek Khadartsev. He got gold and bronze at the olympics and is a 2x world champ. 

[wrestle87]

Bruce Baumgartner never gets taken seriously in the GOAT conversation, I think he wins this hands down.

[AgaveMaria]

"Who are the guys that at their absolute best, could have beaten anyone at any time including those GOATS?"

No one on the list would have taken John Smith when Gold was on the line.

Many tried for years but when he was going for Gold at Worlds and Olympic games he always got it done. Some hard fought matches along the way but he had another gear no one could touch.

[OMW]

as Karelin, Gaber and Noroozi are listed in the thread starter, Hamza Yerlikaya is definitely someone to be considered!

[Room Guy]

Baumgartner and Yerlikaya can be argued for greatest ever at their sizes. They don’t qualify. Too accomplished.

[Fadzaev2]

Can't believe not one person has mentioned these "greats"........Sergei Belaglozov, Valentine Jordanov and then there is the great Arsen Fadzaev........

[Husker_Du]

anyone old enough to know how skilled Medved was? 

[Caveira]

On 5/11/2025 at 5:14 PM, AgaveMaria said:

"Who are the guys that at their absolute best, could have beaten anyone at any time including those GOATS?"

No one on the list would have taken John Smith when Gold was on the line.

Many tried for years but when he was going for Gold at Worlds and Olympic games he always got it done. Some hard fought matches along the way but he had another gear no one could touch.

https://www.wrestlingstats.com/ncaa/pdf/brackets/NCAA 1985.pdf

[Wrasslin]

5 hours ago, Fadzaev2 said:

Can't believe not one person has mentioned these "greats"........Sergei Belaglozov, Valentine Jordanov and then there is the great Arsen Fadzaev........

Agreed. But in my mind, these three are GOATS, along with Medved. I'd also make the case for Mustafa Dagistanli, Yasar Dogu, Ivan Yarygin, Anatoly Roschin, Mavlet Batirov, Besik Kudukhov, Bruce Baumgartner, and Kurt Angle. There's so many great ones! 

[GrandOlm]

On 5/15/2025 at 1:49 PM, Room Guy said:

Baumgartner and Yerlikaya can be argued for greatest ever at their sizes. They don’t qualify. Too accomplished.

Bruce only defended a world level title once. Bruce had amazing longevity and was highly decorated over his career, but there are much stronger candidates than him. 

Medved (who is in a tier of his own among heavies), Ivanitsky, and Soslan are at least a level above Bruce. 

I think Bruce belongs in this thread. I think of Bruce as in that Khalimov (who was 6-0 against Bruce h2h), Akgul, and Taymazov tier of wrestlers. 

[Fadzaev2]

12 hours ago, Husker_Du said:

anyone old enough to know how skilled Medved was? 

I am, and he's one of the first Russian greats.....10 Olympic and World Gold and a silver and bronze (12 in all)  Jordanov  (Bulgaria has 12)  Baumgartner has 13!

[Fadzaev2]

8 hours ago, GrandOlm said:

Bruce only defended a world level title once. Bruce had amazing longevity and was highly decorated over his career, but there are much stronger candidates than him. 

Medved (who is in a tier of his own among heavies), Ivanitsky, and Soslan are at least a level above Bruce. 

I think Bruce belongs in this thread. I think of Bruce as in that Khalimov (who was 6-0 against Bruce h2h), Akgul, and Taymazov tier of wrestlers. 

Well, Andiev (that's the Soslan you are referring to) has 2 olympic gold, So does Bruce, and keep in mind, we didn't go to Moscow, Andiev has 4 world gold, and Bruce has 3 world gold, Andiev has one world silver, and Bruce has 3 world silver, as well as 3 world bronze.....oh I almost forgot.....throw in an Olympic silver and bronze for Bruce as well giving him world record 13 world and Olympic Medals.......you can't put Andiev (Soslan) a "tier" above Bruce!!!!  I'm old enough, I watched Andiev....he's in my "film" library (World Cups) in Toledo...he was really good, but NOT a tier above Bruce.  Medved was in a different era ......watched him too.....but I won't argue him.....12 world and Olympic medals ....10 gold.  Fadz