Iowa just does not have the talent

[CHROMEBIRD]

11 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

Yes, everyone knows if *checks notes* Carter Starocci and Spencer freaking Lee can do it, so can can everybody.

+Nolf. You know, everyday talent. 

[Rassling2]

46 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

Sammy Alvirez from Rutgers/OSU/Rider?

Sorry winner, I spelled his name wrong, I meant to say Alirez from Northern Colorado. 

[Wrestleknownothing]

4 hours ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Ha! (good math joke)

Zain was supposed to retire, but I think that is now "taking a year off."

I was ready to see Nick lee retire, and wouldn't be surprised if he does, but have not seen anything other than him saying he was still going to compete after being hired to coach.  I would almost say that him wrestling more as a coach than as a competitor is a bad sign for him to return to competition.  Now his wrestling is focused on helping others, instead of himself.

 

Most of my jokes are math jokes. Not sure why no one finds me funny.

On an unrelated note, why was 6 afraid of 7? Because 7, 8, 9.

[dragit]

47 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Lugo got robbed by the NCAA. He was the #1 seed when the 2020 tournament was cancelled and they didn't give him and other seniors the year back.

Him and Pletcher and Moore really got a bad deal.  It was particularly harsh for them, unlike, say, Mark Hall, who had already won, because they had all improved year by year and that last year was their one chance to win a championship, and they had all stepped up big time and were primed to finally break through at NCAAs, and then there careers were summarily terminated (unlike, say, Rivera, who got another chance). 

[dragit]

Just now, Wrestleknownothing said:

Most of my jokes are math jokes. Not sure why no one finds me funny.

On an unrelated note, why was 6 afraid of 7? Because 7, 8, 9.

It's because they were sane enough not to go to U of C if I remember one of your prior posts correctly.

[KennyEBHS]

7 hours ago, wrestle87 said:

This is a nice rally around Iowa, but that is not the message that anybody is sending about Iowa and is mot the point.

We all know Penn State is a preposterous machine.  What we also know and have watched is that Iowa is now buying more and more on the market, and they are not putting guys out there who show any sort of technical evolution, at least to what is relevant in modern wrestling.

The guys who show up at Iowa need to already have an arsenal, and whatever they have in high school is all they’ll have their senior year.

Hard collar tie, elbow post, high crotch is middle school technique.  It worked for the brands in the 90’s, but the point of coaching is to help wrestlers evolve and get better.

That is something they have not done for a long time, and it is why people are critical of them.  Iowa wrestlers flow like a bag of rocks, and their on the mat style has been surpassed.  

Amen

[wrestle87]

9 hours ago, VakAttack said:

Then why do they consistently beat everybody else? 

Uh…they have purchased technical ability up and down the roster this year so, I dunno…do they? How much of their homegrown talent regularly “beats everybody” anymore?

[Spencerlee]

Just now, wrestle87 said:

Uh…they have purchased technical ability up and down the roster this year so, I dunno…do they? How much of their homegrown talent regularly “beats everybody” anymore?

Other teams should get their money up I guess.

[wrestle87]

7 hours ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Snyder yes. 

Zain: not currently competing.

Nick Lee- no.  (Eierman has won a senior Pan Am; Nick Lee not so much...)

Nick Lee made a world team did he not?

[wrestle87]

3 minutes ago, Spencerlee said:

Other teams should get their money up I guess.

I mean it would be great if they could.  This is the distinction between coach of athletes vs manager of program.  

I think the brands are amazing program managers, I think they are still the most important figureheads in the sport of wrestling. 

But they leave a lot to be desired in terms of actual conveyance of technical skill.  It’s almost unheard of that a coach can teach a technique they themselves couldn’t hit as an athlete.  The brands had a brutally rudimentary skillset, they just delivered it with immense force.

But that’s not where wrestling is anymore.  The sport is three revisions beyond that time period at least.  To be a successful college wrestler, you have to be able to do the splits, and you need robust literacy with the roll through ankle scramble positions.  They basically are half the sport at this point.

Iowa’s not exactly bringing the funk to their arsenal in an overly big way.

[VakAttack]

1 hour ago, wrestle87 said:

Uh…they have purchased technical ability up and down the roster this year so, I dunno…do they? How much of their homegrown talent regularly “beats everybody” anymore?

Their team beats the other teams...except one.  As to the purchased line,  every top team has transfers.

Edited 12 hours ago by VakAttack

[wrestle87]

2 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

Their team bears the other teams...except one.  As to the purchased line,  every top team has transfers.

False equivalency while also actively not engaging with the crux of the discussion.

The focus on Iowa’s transfers is because their non-transfers by and large show very lackluster development.  Other top teams are doing a great job developing their athletes from the ground up.

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

10 hours ago, wrestle87 said:

Nick Lee made a world team did he not?

Yes! I had a bad lunch break yesterday! Lots of fake news !

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

15 hours ago, Winners Circle said:

•  
• Starocci won a title on a blown knee. Same with Spencer. So the 'blew his knee out' excuse is played out in my opinion. Eierman finished 2nd at B1Gs and was the 2 seed at NCAAs. We can't pick and choose when results count. If you take the mat, you're good to go.

How"blown out" was Carter's knee actually?  Obviously hurt, no question about it.  No surgery ? We have never heard anything.

Still quite an accomplishment, but I am certainly curious as to the extent of the injury.

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

16 hours ago, Winners Circle said:

These three all finished lower their senior years than junior years. I am not sure on Lugo. Too lazy to look. Caliendo's story is still being written. 

Now do Truax, Dean, and Nagao.  While your at it, maybe Kerk as well.

[Winners Circle]

1 hour ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Now do Truax, Dean, and Nagao.  While your at it, maybe Kerk as well.

What does Penn State have to do with Iowa's athletes regressing over their careers at Iowa?

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

6 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

What does Penn State have to do with Iowa's athletes regressing over their careers at Iowa?

Now do the regressions of Truax, Dean, and Nagao.  Add Kerk while you're at it.

[Winners Circle]

1 minute ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Now do the regressions of Truax, Dean, and Nagao.  Add Kerk while you're at it.

Yea you're right about that. I'm not denying it. But Cael isn't on the hot seat, while Brands is on the hot seat by HIS OWN FANS. If you're an Iowa fan and don't want Brands gone I'm sorry for getting you worked up. I have no dog in the fight. I'm an Okie State fan. I am just friends with some Hawk fans who are ready to see Brands go for the reasons I said. 

[Dogbone]

People need to stop with the Iowa can't get past Gable nonsense.  Tom and Terry's style is not the exclusive "Iowa Style" under Gable.

Look at all of the other coaches from the Gable tree.  Schwab, Ryan, etc (so so many more), none of them coach the same style the Brands do.    The Brands style resembles their own style. 

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

13 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

What does Penn State have to do with Iowa's athletes regressing over their careers at Iowa?

Other than probably Mesenbrink, which current PSU transfers have a chance at performing better in their final year?

Is it an Iowa thing, or a 5th/6th/7th year thing?  Any chance of you answering the question?

OK, looks like you sort of did as I was posting.

I think a big problem is that the older guys get beat up.

Edited 1 hour ago by Interviewed_at_Weehawken

[Winners Circle]

1 minute ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Other than probably Mesenbrink, which current PSU transfers have a chance at performing better in their final year?

Is it an Iowa thing, or a 5th/6th/7th year thing?  Any chance of you answering the question?

I think this is more likely the case. And Iowa just happens to have built their recent teams off those kind of guys. Which was kind of my point.

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

33 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

I think this is more likely the case. And Iowa just happens to have built their recent teams off those kind of guys. Which was kind of my point.

Ok, but PSU have had their fair share as well.  Most have had great success (not all) but a lot have performed worse in their later years.  I think people forget how many transfers PSU has had.

[Winners Circle]

Just now, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Ok, but PSU have had their fair share as well.  Most have had great success (not all) but a lot have performed worse in their later years.  I think people forget how many transfers PSU has had.

No doubt. But Cael's teams have been able to win titles, despite his 5th-7th year guys underperforming their last years. That's the difference between the two situations.

[Gene Mills Fan]

22 hours ago, Konquest said:

I can say with absolute certainty that there is a room in Wisconsin that has highly ranked wrestlers from Mizzou, Minnesota, UNI, and Penn State all wrestling with each other in the offseason.

right! you would think a week or so would be encouraged.  As an Iowa fan I think this is a bit of TNT paranoia and thin skin from guys leaving, they're just to emotional.  And they need more assistants coming from different styles, get over the loyalty bravado.

But replying to the 'topic sentence' they are not getting the talent PSU gets.