Updated Poll: Who wins the 2025 Hodge?

[peanut]

Who do you think it will be?

[GimJustafan]

Mesenbrink IMO wins it 

 if Keckeisen can win tile over staroci it could go to him 

Steveson uber impressive but he finishes 3rd 

 

[CHROMEBIRD]

Follow-up poll: Will the most deserving wrestler win it?

Should the criteria be suggested guidelines?

[okokzach]

165 is one of the weakest weights. Not MM's fault, but it should go to someone in a tougher weight 

[bnwtwg]

1 hour ago, okokzach said:

165 is one of the weakest weights. Not MM's fault, but it should go to someone in a tougher weight 

The only weights with multiple returning champions are 141, 174, and 285. Are you implying that the Hodge winner must come from one of those weights?

Edited 22 hours ago by bnwtwg
sp

[Konquest]

10 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

The only weights with multiple returning champions are 141, 174, and 285. Are you implying that the Hodge winner must come from one of those weights?

184

[ionel]

It can't be Steveson because he now has to overcome the dreaded Jimmy Curse.  

[pokemonster]

Keck when he beats CStall.

[AZ_wrestling]

2 hours ago, okokzach said:

165 is one of the weakest weights. Not MM's fault, but it should go to someone in a tougher weight 

Based on what? Not sure how you can make a case for Ramirez, Hall, Barraclough, and Caliendo being inferior p4p wrestlers to Kerk, Wyatt, Trumble, and Shultz, etc. Based on the size of the talent pool alone, HW is a considerably weaker division than the lighter weight classes. 

[Gus]

8 minutes ago, AZ_wrestling said:

Based on what? Not sure how you can make a case for Ramirez, Hall, Barraclough, and Caliendo being inferior p4p wrestlers to Kerk, Wyatt, Trumble, and Shultz, etc. Based on the size of the talent pool alone, HW is a considerably weaker division than the lighter weight classes. 

Huh? Hendrickson is an age level world champ. Kerk is a returning undefeated NCAA champion. Shultz is a former finalist, Feldman and Slav are returning AA's. 

[bnwtwg]

2 hours ago, Konquest said:

184

Honestly it slipped my mind after the all-star match, which is crazy because any other year and Keck would rightfully be a front-runner the way he is wrecking people. Crappy timing running into the potential only 5 timer who is an absolute beast.

The earlier loss probably also knocks him out of the running because it will split votes. Historic win if he beats the grave pisser on Saturday night, but that means they split matches and who knows how that will go if MM and Steveson continue their run.

[timmcnaughton3294]

Keck when he beats CStall.

One of them just may not make the finals.

Sent from my SM-A516V using Tapatalk

[SocraTease]

I find it hard to believe that Hodge voters wouldn't support an unprecedented five-timer who has not yet received the award if he wins out and continues to bonus most of his matches, though the vote may be close with Steveson, who has won the award previously and is on low match count.  

Has there ever been a 4 timer besides C-Star who never won the Hodge?  Yianni I guess ... perhaps because he lost in his senior year.  

Btw: is Yianni still competing in freestyle?  I see he is one of the coach heading to the upcoming ranking series, but that he isn't wrestling.

[Wrestleknownothing]

43 minutes ago, SocraTease said:

I find it hard to believe that Hodge voters wouldn't support an unprecedented five-timer who has not yet received the award if he wins out and continues to bonus most of his matches, though the vote may be close with Steveson, who has won the award previously and is on low match count.  

Has there ever been a 4 timer besides C-Star who never won the Hodge?  Yianni I guess ... perhaps because he lost in his senior year.  

Btw: is Yianni still competing in freestyle?  I see he is one of the coach heading to the upcoming ranking series, but that he isn't wrestling.

Yianni Diakomihalis is one of only two three time Hodge finalist to not win.

• In 2019 Diakomihalis finished fourth behind just two other wrestlers (huh?). Bo Nickal got 37 first place votes, Jason Nolf got 10 first place votes, Nolf/Nickal got 4 first place votes and Diakomihalis and Anthony Ashnault got the other two (not sure who got them or if they were one each).
• In 2022 Diakomihalis finished second behind Gable Steveson, finishing with 5 first place votes to Steveson's 49.
• In 2023 Diakomihalis (6 first place votes) finished third behind Mason Parris (33), and Carter Starocci (14).

If Starocci is a finalist this year and does not win he will be the only four time finalist to never win (also the only four time finalist). He finished T-4th, 2nd, 3rd in 2022, 2023, and 2024.

[dragit]

Steveson should and will win unless Keck beats Starocci.  Mesenbrink can win next year when he wins all 30 matches by 20-5 in a total of 100 minutes.

[headshuck]

I find it hard to believe that Hodge voters wouldn't support an unprecedented five-timer who has not yet received the award if he wins out and continues to bonus most of his matches, though the vote may be close with Steveson, who has won the award previously and is on low match count.  
Has there ever been a 4 timer besides C-Star who never won the Hodge?  Yianni I guess ... perhaps because he lost in his senior year.  
Btw: is Yianni still competing in freestyle?  I see he is one of the coach heading to the upcoming ranking series, but that he isn't wrestling.

The Hodge for years was a pinner’s award. It morphed into a most dominant award. I hope it doesn’t become a career achievement award.

The first 5-timer deserves all the praise in the world, but not the Hodge IMHO.

[SocraTease]

30 minutes ago, headshuck said:

The Hodge for years was a pinner’s award. It morphed into a most dominant award. I hope it doesn’t become a career achievement award.

The first 5-timer deserves all the praise in the world, but not the Hodge IMHO.

Well, I think you are right about the point concerning pins.  I believe it was (or still is) written into the original Hodge award language that pins are the (or a) top criterion.  But voters seem to ignore that and translate it into "dominance" as you note.   Steveson rarely pins and Starocci isn't a big pinner either.  And neither is Mesenbrink, among others like Bartlett, Ramos, and KOT.

Someone Askren is nodding his head (formerly) full of tall hair.

 

[headshuck]

Yes… if the Hodge was still heavily weighted towards pins, we’d have a group of specialists from across the nation going for it. Who was that wrestler out east that had 20 some pins… Scott… name escapes me.

[scourge165]

2 hours ago, headshuck said:

The Hodge for years was a pinner’s award. It morphed into a most dominant award. I hope it doesn’t become a career achievement award.

The first 5-timer deserves all the praise in the world, but not the Hodge IMHO.

It's not like it'd just be handed to him. I did vote for Mesenbrink, but...he'll have to beat Parker in this scenario and he's pretty close to a 100% bonus rate for "csall." 

Kinda crazy a guy has that nickname and yet...he's got one match where he hasn't gotten bonus and like 3 more where it's only been a major. 

If you assume each of the three, Starr, Mesenbrink and Gable all win it and they're all dominant, It'd hardly be an outrage that the 5X Champ gets it over the 3X Champ(who should also be done with his eligibility) and the RS Soph who has 2 more years left but has an objectively easier weight. 

We've still got a month to go though. So, we'll see how it plays out. 

[Wrestleknownothing]

3 hours ago, SocraTease said:

Well, I think you are right about the point concerning pins.  I believe it was (or still is) written into the original Hodge award language that pins are the (or a) top criterion.  But voters seem to ignore that and translate it into "dominance" as you note.   Steveson rarely pins and Starocci isn't a big pinner either.  And neither is Mesenbrink, among others like Bartlett, Ramos, and KOT.

Someone Askren is nodding his head (formerly) full of tall hair.

 

Pinfalls were removed as a criteria in 2021 and replaced with dominance/bonus-point percentage. 2021 is also the year Steveson won with one single, solitary, lonely pinfall.

[ionel]

5 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Pinfalls were removed as a criteria in 2021 and replaced with dominance/bonus-point percentage. 2021 is also the year Steveson won with one single, solitary, lonely pinfall.

Reference? 

[headshuck]

And then they change the rules to give 3 for a takedown and the ultimate goal of the sport, to pin your opponent, is gone.

[Wrestleknownothing]

31 minutes ago, headshuck said:

And then they change the rules to give 3 for a takedown and the ultimate goal of the sport, to pin your opponent, is gone.

It has been gone for a while. See 2021 Steveson 1 pinfall.

[SocraTease]

2 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

It has been gone for a while. See 2021 Steveson 1 pinfall.

Can you give us a source for the claim that pins are eliminated as a criterion for the Hodge?  This is from an August, 2024 NCAA.com article, but maybe there is some document that is more official or supersedes it:

"Originally created to celebrate the pin in college wrestling, the Dan Hodge Trophy is based on seven criteria including record, number of pins, dominance, past credentials, quality of competition, sportsmanship/citizenship and heart. The trophy is based primarily on the results of a single season, but past accomplishments are considered as well, particularly in years where the competition is tighter."

https://www.ncaa.com/news/wrestling/article/2022-04-02/dan-hodge-trophy-history-winners-and-how-it-works

Edited 10 hours ago by SocraTease

[Wrestleknownothing]

6 hours ago, SocraTease said:

Can you give us a source for the claim that pins are eliminated as a criterion for the Hodge?  This is from an August, 2024 NCAA.com article, but maybe there is some document that is more official or supersedes it:

"Originally created to celebrate the pin in college wrestling, the Dan Hodge Trophy is based on seven criteria including record, number of pins, dominance, past credentials, quality of competition, sportsmanship/citizenship and heart. The trophy is based primarily on the results of a single season, but past accomplishments are considered as well, particularly in years where the competition is tighter."

https://www.ncaa.com/news/wrestling/article/2022-04-02/dan-hodge-trophy-history-winners-and-how-it-works

The NCAA article is an old article that they lightly update each year. Unfortunately they do not update it to correct the criteria.

As for the year the criteria was changed, I was off by a year. It was 2022 when the criteria became dominance/bonus-point percentage. 2022 was also the year Steveson won with 1 pinfall, the lowest total of the eight finalists.

Here is the 2020 WIN article with the old criteria: 2020

Here is the 2021 WIN article with the criteria only referenced, but not detailed: 2021

Here is the 2022 WIN article with the new criteria: 2022

Edited 3 hours ago by Wrestleknownothing