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15 minutes ago, Formally140 said:

It really is becoming the wild Wild West. Especially after hearing that mid tier guys are being offered 20,000 or more to transfer

Without asking you disclose details that would get you in trouble, could you give more broad clues to help us understand your statement?  For example - does mid-tier refer to national qualifier but not AA level type guys?

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Just now, flyingcement said:

Without asking you disclose details that would get you in trouble, could you give more broad clues to help us understand your statement?  For example - does mid-tier refer to national qualifier but not AA level type guys?

Yup. I trust who I heard it from. I understand the poaching before coaching is the norm now. And it's about to be the norm in hs, at least in some states.  But it's really hard for me to see how it's sustainable.

It's also contributing to brain drain in the amount of quality coaches willing to coach at mid tier programs.. because., what's the point if anything you build is poached by people with more resources*. ITT was already happening but it's happening more and more. 
 

 

*im well aware why kids transfer and all the other stuff.. that's irrelevant to what this stuff is doing big picture. 

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It's tough for coaches in some sense, but my goodness is it liberating for athletes.  It's so incredible that wrestling can be a legit career, dudes can do well, save money, and legit be well on their way towards a down payment or an investment portfolio before they're done with college.

That is unprecedented progress by leaps and bounds for wrestling.  No longer being a poor man's sport only loved by the spartan monks of the hinterlands is real progress.

It does make it tough for coaches...but it also forces coaches and schools to be competitive, and will incentivize longer term relationship building from an earlier age, similar to the Asken Mizzou pipeline (and now...PSU potential pipeline).

Mainly, I relish how much this defangs the NCAA.  Because, pardon my language, f*@k those people.

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29 minutes ago, jackwebster said:

Re $$$: I can't believe that there's that much cash on the table. I just assumed all the stories (e.g. Wood) were fantasies like the "full ride." 

haha... 30 guys on a roster at 9.9....but 7 of them are getting "full-rides" for wrestling. What could possibly be wrong with those numbers? 

 

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8 hours ago, wrestle87 said:

It does make it tough for coaches...but it also forces coaches and schools to be competitive, and will incentivize longer term relationship building from an earlier age, similar to the Asken Mizzou pipeline (and now...PSU potential pipeline).

I don't think you fully understand how tough this is on 90%  of the coaches and  programs that don't have the money to stay in the thick of things. Say all you want about "forcing coaches to be competitive"....it's harder than you think to fundraise for the operating cost of your program, recruit, find NIL money, and by the way, coach and run a program for success.  But when you do, you don't have the NIL to keep a kid that you developed. Serious question - who is your team? 

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I might have missed it, but I didn't see an updated one with Parco in it, my man?

As an aside for the rest of the gents...

What about the smoke (I believe it was even mentioned in this thread) of Teemer going in the portal, too?

Who do we think are the major players for Parco, Teemer, Endene (who is a get, mind you), and the rest of the top 33 (or so)?

I imagine Michigan is alive for Flynn.

Ulrey and Brady for VTech are absolutely 'gets' if they can get to the right room.  They are NQ type guys, they just need to be at their optimal weight(s).

Slav?  Where is he going?

If Michigan isn't throwing a bag at Flynn, I imagine they are with Babin or Comacho or even Rini(?) to allow Horvath another year in the room.

I hope we see Derracott at UNC.  He is a 'get' as well, just been behind Cardenas at Stanford.

Janzer is a NQ type talent at 184 or 197, if it is the right room for him.

I was hoping to see Indiana's Gilcher in the portal.  I wanted him to be able to wrestle with his brother, but Michigan has now gotten Saldate at 157lbs (I was actually hoping to see Saldate venture up to 165lbs, but it appears not).

 

On 4/15/2024 at 6:31 PM, flyingcement said:

 

Weight WS Rank Athlete 2024-25 Year Hometown Transferring From Transferring To
197 1 Massoma Endene Junior Arlington, TX Wartburg  
197 2 Jacob Cardenas Graduate Kearny, NJ Cornell Michigan
174 3 Dean Hamiti Senior Joliet, IL Wisconsin Oklahoma State
174 6 Lennox Wolak Graduate Columbus, OH Columbia Virginia Tech
285 6 Yaraslau Slavikouski Graduate Rechitsa, BY Rutgers  
157 10 Tommy Askey Graduate Pine Bush, NY App State Minnesota
165 10 Caleb Fish Graduate Eaton Rapids, MI Michigan State Oklahoma State
133 11 Connor McGonagle Graduate Danville, NH Lehigh Virginia Tech
157 15 Chase Saldate Senior Gilroy, CA Michigan State Michigan
125 17 Cooper Flynn Junior Seymour, TN Virginia Tech  
285 17 Dorian Crosby Graduate Erie, PA Bucknell Gannon
133 21 Ethan Oakley Junior Trinity, NC App State North Carolina
184 21 Brock Delsignore Junior Ballston Lake, NY NC State Little Rock
197 22 Evan Bockman Graduate Anchorage, AK Utah Valley Iowa State
174 26 Josh Ogunsanya Graduate River Forest, IL Columbia North Carolina
149 26 Jaivon Jones Graduate Shaker Heights, OH Northern Illinois  
165 27 Kyle Mosher Graduate Rockville Centre, NY Columbia  
125 27 Ramazan Attasauov Junior Nalchik, RU Iowa State Illinois
157 30 Jason Kraisser Graduate Ellicott City, MD Iowa State  
184 31 Maximus Hale Graduate West Chester, PA Penn  
157 31 Jared Hill Junior Broken Arrow, OK Oklahoma  
149 32 Sammy Alvarez Graduate Garfield, NJ Oklahoma State Rider
133 34 Sydney Flores Graduate West Covina, CA Air Force  
157 34 Clayton Ulrey Graduate Grantville, PA Virginia Tech  
125 34 Colton Camacho Graduate Delmont, PA Pitt  
125 37 Nick Babin Graduate Westwood, NJ Columbia  
197 37 Spencer Mooberry Junior Osage, IA NDSU  
157 37 Nick Stampoulos Sophomore Newark, NJ Buffalo Lock Haven
184 38 Rylan Rogers Sophomore Coeur d'Alene, ID Michigan  
133 38 Angelo Rini Senior Mayfield Heights, OH Columbia  
165 39 Charlie Darracott Graduate Flowery Branch, GA Stanford  
197 39 Sam Mitchell Graduate Marshfield, WI Buffalo  
141 42 Nathan Higley Sophomore Sullivan County, PA George Mason  
157 44 Brock McMillen Junior Coalport, PA Pitt  
125 46 Markel Baker Sophomore Freeport, IL George Mason  
197 47 Carter Blough Sophomore Lowell, MI Michigan State  
184 48 James Lledo Graduate Lower Merrion, PA Pitt  
133 49 Logan Frazier Freshman Crown Point, IN Virginia Tech  
125 49 Evan Tallmadge Freshman Brick NJ Navy Pitt
149 52 Justin Rivera Graduate Orlando, FL Campbell  
184 55 Chase Kranitz Sophomore Irwin, PA Buffalo Pitt
165 57 Carter Schubert Freshman Marion, NY Cal Baptist  
174 59 Jay Nivison Graduate Davison, MI Buffalo  
285 60 Xavier Doolin Junior Kansas City, MO Northern Colorado  
285 61 Ryan Boersma Sophomore Channahon, IL Missouri  
157 61 Jeremy Paradice Sophomore Moultrie, GA Chattanooga  
157 63 Carter Martinson Sophomore Altoona, IA Iowa  
197 63 Billy Janzer Junior Elk Township, NJ Rutgers  
141 64 Sam Ewing Freshman Pleasant Hills, MO Buffalo  
184 65 Connor Strong Senior Bel Air, MD Penn  
133 65 Tommy Maddox Graduate Washingtonville, NY Buffalo  
157 68 Danny Nini Sophomore Orlando, FL North Carolina  
125 70 Tristan Daugherty Graduate Peoria, IL Buffalo  
184 71 Devin Wasley Sophomore Hammond, WI Minnesota  
125 71 Dominic Chavez Junior Arlington, TX Presbyterian Texas Wesleyan
174 72 Sean Harman Graduate West Linn, OR Missouri Oregon State
174 73 Darrien Roberts Graduate Bethlehem, PA Oklahoma Morgan State
141 77 Benjamin Lunn Graduate Shakopee, MN Minnesota  
184 79 Branson Britten Junior Amarillo, TX Northern Colorado  
149 79 Joel Jesuroga Sophomore Pleasant Hill, IA Iowa  
285 82 Billy Brosko Freshman Newtown Square, PA Drexel  
125 85 Zachary Espalin Junior GIlbert, AZ Navy  
165 85 Luke Odom Graduate Edwardsville, IL Illinois SIEU
285 86 Andrew Blackburn-Forst Sophomore Lockport, IL Northern Colorado  
149 86 Kaleb Burgess Junior Mohawk, NY Buffalo  
125 87 Tristan Mascarenas Graduate Rio Rancho, NM Arizona State  
197 87 Brad Morrison Junior Landisburg, PA Lock Haven  
149 88 Ty Linsenbigler Junior Landisville, PA Lock Haven  
141 89 Caleb Brooks Graduate Canal Winchester, OH Buffalo  
197 92 Lathan Duda Junior Broken Bow, NE NDSU  
157 92 Nick Delp Graduate New Kensington, PA Bucknell  
165 94 Bryce Sanderlin Graduate Chesapeake, VA Davidson  
149 96 Ryan Michaels Graduate McKeesport, PA Pitt  
165 97 Carson Miller Freshman Granville, OH Pitt  
285 99 Gage Cook Sophomore Granger, WA Army  
149 99 Gabe Onorato Junior Gibbstown, NJ Drexel  
197 99 Ruben Karapetyan Freshman Bethesda, MD George Mason  
285 105 Lonnell Owens-Pabon Sophomore Crofton, MD Buffalo  
165 105 Mateo de la Pena Sophomore Federal Way, WA Cal Baptist  
125 108 Logan Sallot Freshman Erie, PA Lock Haven Gannon
157 111 Tyler Badgett Graduate San Diego, CA Pitt  
125 112 Aedyn Concepcion Senior Anchorage, AK Gardner-Webb  
174 112 Braden Welch Sophomore Ashland, OH App State  
125 114 Max Elton Sophomore Hammonton, NJ Buffalo  
165 116 Andrew Huddleston Graduate Hallsville, MO Iowa State  
149 116 Bretli Reyna Junior Homestead, FL Iowa  
165 117 Hunter Shaut Graduate Mohawk, NY Buffalo  
133 118 Gio Diaz Graduate Valparaiso, IN Franklin & Marshall  
141 120 Chris Rivera Graduate Orlando, FL Campbell  
125 120 Caleb Coyle Junior Omaha, NE Oregon State Nebraska-Kearney
197 121 Coen Grimm Freshman Wadsworth, OH Buffalo  
133 121 Korbin Shepherd Junior Blue Springs, MO Missouri  
133 122 TJ England Graduate Southampton, PA Clarion  
197 123 Cameo Blankenship Graduate McRae, GA Davidson  
184 124 Damen Pape Junior Hastings, NE Northern Colorado  
157 126 Lorenzo Rajaonarivelo Graduate Arlington, VA George Mason  
174 127 Ryan Bolletino Graduate Haddonfield, NJ Sacred Heart  
165 131 Brant Whitaker Junior Boonville, MO Missouri  
133 132 Kyle Rowan Graduate Perry, OH Stanford  
174 134 Zachary Wells Graduate Sterling Heights, IM Presbyterian  
157 134 Paolo Salminen Freshman Billings, MT Wyoming  
285 141 Max Acciardi Freshman Woodcliff Lake, NJ Cal Baptist  
141 141 Walker Bents Sophomore Glenwood, MN NDSU  
149 141 Theo Cha Graduate Anchorage, AK Minnesota  
174 144 Hayden Pummel Junior Indian Lake, OH Northern Illinois  
125 149 Jacob Houpt Freshman Canonsburg, PA Kent State  
157 152 Kaiden Wagner Sophomore Lewisburg, PA Lock Haven  
141 153 Cam Soda Junior Burlington, MA Edinboro  
184 157 Anthony DeRosa Junior MIlford, NJ Bloomsburg  
141 157 Chandler Ho Junior DuBois, PA Clarion  
133 159 Santino Sanchez Sophomore Whittier, CA CSU Bakersfield  
174 162 Mason Gode Junior Browerville, MN NDSU  
133 163 Braxton Appello Sophomore Easton, PA Ohio State  
165 164 Carson Martinson Sophomore Altoona, IA Iowa  
133 169 Dominic DiTomasso Sophomore Hahira, GA Chattanooga  
125 174 Zachary Jacaruso Freshman Milford, PA George Mason  
125 174 Jacob Joyce Freshman Ponaganset, RI Stanford  
125 174 Keegan Schlabach Freshman Lagrange, IN Clarion  
165 184 Cole Zoller Graduate Medford, OR Oregon State  
141 185 Peyton Moore Sophomore Fulton, MO Missouri  
133 186 Amantee Mills Freshman Fort Pierce, FL NDSU  
285 187 Carson Hatch Senior Hughson, CA CSU Bakersfield  
285 187 Zach Evans Freshman Chambersburg, PA Buffalo  
141 188 Freddy Junko Graduate Wexford, PA VMI  
133 191 Drew Cooper Freshman Omaha, NE Nebraska  
157 194 Ethan Stiles Freshman Chicago, IL Nebraska  
141 204 Drew Woodley Graduate Northfield, MN Iowa State  
184 206 Mahkyi Smith Freshman Lehi, UT Cal Baptist  
197 214 Macray Klohs Freshman Plymouth, MN NDSU  
197 222 Brett Wittman Senior Appleton, WI Clarion  
157 223 Brayden Shelton Freshman Centralia, MO Northern Illinois  
157 226 Jamisen Colongione Sophomore Sayerville, NY LIU  
157 230 Aiden Smith Sophomore Brighton, MI Northern Illinois  
149 235 Hunter Hockensmith Graduate Spofford, NH Franklin & Marshall  
157 237 Dagen Condomitti Freshman Northampton, PA Oregon State  
157 237 Frankie McNeary Sophomore Cliffside Park, NJ Rider  
141 245 Hunter Sloan Freshman Doylestown, PA Bucknell  
285 256 PJ Casale Sophomore Little Falls, NJ Rutgers  
174 264 Jacob Yawn Graduate Shreveport, LA Cornell  
165 265 Miles Bassett Graduate St. Louis, MO Bucknell  
165 267 Griffin Ray Freshman Hillsboro, MO Nebraska  
165 268 Zane Licht Freshman Prairie du Sac, WI NDSU  
165 269 Sam Beckett Sophomore Harleysville, PA Stanford  
133 274 Spencer Von Savoye Freshman Oakdale, CA Cal Baptist  
165 275 Jack Pickersgill Freshman Holtsville, NY LIU  
165 278 Brady Conlin Freshman Williamstown, NJ Rider  
165 283 Tyler Martinez Freshman Plano, IL Northern Illinois  
141 292 Toby Billerman Freshman Indianapolis, IN SIEU  
141 297 Brayden Sonnentag Freshman Boyd, WI Wyoming  
174 300 Ryder Dearborn Freshman Santee, CA CSU Bakersfield  
141 301 Kaiser Simpson Freshman Cushing, OK Cal Baptist  
141 305 Tanner Frothinger Freshman Eagle, ID Nebraska  
141 310 Eyan Chavez Sophomore Antonito, CO Northern Colorado  
157 310 Michael Duggan Freshman Boiling Springs, PA Bloomsburg  

 

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"I know actually nothing.  It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me

 

 

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13 hours ago, flyingcement said:

we've seen more portal entrants from NDSU.  First is Fernando Barreto, a sophomore at 133 whose best win last year was over SDSU's Derrick Cardinal.  Next from NDSU is Devon Dawson - ranked 31st at heavyweight by wrestlestat.  He spent his first two years at Pratt Community College and only one year and NDSU.  

Another heavyweight that entered the portal was Peter Ming of Stanford.  

He was tough in high school. I watched him at Super 32, as I had an athlete in the same weight and we were on the same mat the match after him, and I was impressed. He's a good athlete. Gritty.

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2 hours ago, nhs67 said:

I might have missed it, but I didn't see an updated one with Parco in it, my man?

As an aside for the rest of the gents...

What about the smoke (I believe it was even mentioned in this thread) of Teemer going in the portal, too?

Who do we think are the major players for Parco, Teemer, Endene (who is a get, mind you), and the rest of the top 33 (or so)?

I imagine Michigan is alive for Flynn.

Ulrey and Brady for VTech are absolutely 'gets' if they can get to the right room.  They are NQ type guys, they just need to be at their optimal weight(s).

Slav?  Where is he going?

If Michigan isn't throwing a bag at Flynn, I imagine they are with Babin or Comacho or even Rini(?) to allow Horvath another year in the room.

I hope we see Derracott at UNC.  He is a 'get' as well, just been behind Cardenas at Stanford.

Janzer is a NQ type talent at 184 or 197, if it is the right room for him.

I was hoping to see Indiana's Gilcher in the portal.  I wanted him to be able to wrestle with his brother, but Michigan has now gotten Saldate at 157lbs (I was actually hoping to see Saldate venture up to 165lbs, but it appears not).

 

 

I've got Michigan for Parco to work out with his California buddies. Are they also in play for A HWT or are they sticking with the roster?  I could see Teemer heading East closer to home as that seems to be what a lot of guys do for their grad transfer. Derracott to UNC makes sense.  9 days left for the portal - could still see a lot of names jump in.

 

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2 hours ago, nhs67 said:

I might have missed it, but I didn't see an updated one with Parco in it, my man?

As an aside for the rest of the gents...

What about the smoke (I believe it was even mentioned in this thread) of Teemer going in the portal, too?

Who do we think are the major players for Parco, Teemer, Endene (who is a get, mind you), and the rest of the top 33 (or so)?

I imagine Michigan is alive for Flynn.

Ulrey and Brady for VTech are absolutely 'gets' if they can get to the right room.  They are NQ type guys, they just need to be at their optimal weight(s).

Slav?  Where is he going?

If Michigan isn't throwing a bag at Flynn, I imagine they are with Babin or Comacho or even Rini(?) to allow Horvath another year in the room.

I hope we see Derracott at UNC.  He is a 'get' as well, just been behind Cardenas at Stanford.

Janzer is a NQ type talent at 184 or 197, if it is the right room for him.

I was hoping to see Indiana's Gilcher in the portal.  I wanted him to be able to wrestle with his brother, but Michigan has now gotten Saldate at 157lbs (I was actually hoping to see Saldate venture up to 165lbs, but it appears not).

 

 

Could Teemer and Parco both go to Oklahoma State? Spratley, Hughes, Jamison/Williams (he made 143 last summer), Parco, Teemer, Fish, Hamiti, Plott, Carroll, Doucet. That could be a second place team.

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14 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

Could Teemer and Parco both go to Oklahoma State? Spratley, Hughes, Jamison/Williams (he made 143 last summer), Parco, Teemer, Fish, Hamiti, Plott, Carroll, Doucet. That could be a second place team.

I’d rather have Williams at 149 than Parco. Maybe if he went 157?  Does Fish have a RS left. If he does then Teemer could go 165. 

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15 minutes ago, TheJimReaper said:

I’d rather have Williams at 149 than Parco. Maybe if he went 157?  Does Fish have a RS left. If he does then Teemer could go 165. 

Fish and Hamiti both have a shirt available.

"I know actually nothing.  It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me

 

 

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39 minutes ago, Idaho said:

I've got Michigan for Parco to work out with his California buddies. Are they also in play for A HWT or are they sticking with the roster?  I could see Teemer heading East closer to home as that seems to be what a lot of guys do for their grad transfer. Derracott to UNC makes sense.  9 days left for the portal - could still see a lot of names jump in.

 

Right.

I believe they only have to enter, not have their school chosen, correct?

Also, Grad transfers don't have to respect the portal deadline, too?

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21 minutes ago, TheJimReaper said:

I’d rather have Williams at 149 than Parco. Maybe if he went 157?  Does Fish have a RS left. If he does then Teemer could go 165. 

I think you're on an island by yourself with this thought. A 4x AA vs a guy that went 2-2 at NCAAs this year (including a loss to Quinn Kinner). I understand Williams has a bright future. But, being an Okie State fan, I want to win (or at least get 2nd) now, not later. And I'm not alone there. 

Edited by Winners Circle
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5 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

I think you're on an island by yourself with this thought. A 4x AA vs a guy that went 2-2 at NCAAs this year (including a loss to Quinn Kinner). I understand Williams has a bright future. But, being an Okie State fan, I want to win (or at least get 2nd) now, not later. And I'm not alone there. 

I think where Parco ends up will be decided by ONE factor and ONE factor only- that being where he will get the best N.I.L. deal.  So assuming that deal will come from Oklahoma State is premature at best.   I saw yesterday where a group of 5 basketball player signed to play for U.S.C. with a N.I.L. deal worth $500,000.

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51 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

I think you're on an island by yourself with this thought. A 4x AA vs a guy that went 2-2 at NCAAs this year (including a loss to Quinn Kinner). I understand Williams has a bright future. But, being an Okie State fan, I want to win (or at least get 2nd) now, not later. And I'm not alone there. 

I mean I’m not alone either. I get where you’re coming from but Parco isn’t going to win us a title this year and if Williams makes a jump he could be as good or better than Parco. 

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5 minutes ago, TheJimReaper said:

I mean I’m not alone either. I get where you’re coming from but Parco isn’t going to win us a title this year and if Williams makes a jump he could be as good or better than Parco. 

This past season Parco had wins over:

  • Ridge Lovett (2x); who was heavy favorite to win it all season
  • Abas; 2021 AA
  • Swiderski; 2024 AA
  • D'Emilio (major dec.); 2023 AA

This past season Williams had wins over:

  • Swiderski; 2024 AA

So to say Parco can't win a title, meaning there's no chance, next year is crazy. And to say Willams will make a jump big enough to pass Parco also seems crazy. Could it happen, yes absolutely. But it seems like wishful thinking more than anything.

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8 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

This past season Parco had wins over:

  • Ridge Lovett (2x); who was heavy favorite to win it all season
  • Abas; 2021 AA
  • Swiderski; 2024 AA
  • D'Emilio (major dec.); 2023 AA

This past season Williams had wins over:

  • Swiderski; 2024 AA

So to say Parco can't win a title, meaning there's no chance, next year is crazy. And to say Willams will make a jump big enough to pass Parco also seems crazy. Could it happen, yes absolutely. But it seems like wishful thinking more than anything.

I think he meant, Parco won't win Okie St. the team title this year, but your points are valid.    And for someone to not take Parco because they can't make up 100+ team points is also shortsighted.  You have to start somewhere.  Get 2nd if you can, narrow the gap, then try and beat them.  

Williams may not like it but he would get better with Parco in the room, even if he has to sit a year.

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3 minutes ago, Dogbone said:

  Williams may not like it but he would get better with Parco in the room, even if he has to sit a year.

Yes he would.... but the portal $$$ would be calling. 

 

1 hour ago, nhs67 said:

Right.

I believe they only have to enter, not have their school chosen, correct?

Also, Grad transfers don't have to respect the portal deadline, too?

Correct.. Correct.... Last year there were undergrad guys that went in the portal at the very end, but we didn't hear about it until a couple weeks later and wondered how it happened.

Hendrickson to Michigan if I am him -  he would have the best room in the country to train in. 

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33 minutes ago, Idaho said:

Yes he would.... but the portal $$$ would be calling. 

 

Correct.. Correct.... Last year there were undergrad guys that went in the portal at the very end, but we didn't hear about it until a couple weeks later and wondered how it happened.

Hendrickson to Michigan if I am him -  he would have the best room in the country to train in. 

Best by what metric?

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