Top Programs... that are gone

[gimpeltf]

11 minutes ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Switzerland is where the IOC makes it's decisions.  FILA HQ was a relatively quick trip to Switzerland, but FILA leadership didn't even bother showing up to the meeting where IOC dropped wrestling. 

I think most people would agree that Lausanne Switzerland (Corsier-sur-Vevey) would be a relatively quick trip to Switzerland.

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

3 minutes ago, gimpeltf said:

I think most people would agree that Lausanne Switzerland (Corsier-sur-Vevey) would be a relatively quick trip to Switzerland.

Exactly!

Actually both FILA and the IOC were based in Lausanne.  (as were a lot of other Olympic sports, I would guess)

Edited August 22, 2023 by Interviewed_at_Weehawken

[Smsu150]

On 8/18/2023 at 11:00 PM, MPhillips said:

You're not wrong.  Especially for Toledo. They hosted more World Cup tourneys than anyone.  Close to two decades.

Dayton also had a team at one time. 

[Smsu150]

In regards to the SEC...

LSU had a really good team at one time.  Kevin Jackson transferred to Iowa State because they dropped the program.  

I want to say Tennessee (mid-80's) had a national champ and dropped the same year.  Kentucky was also a solid program.

Auburn was a top 10 (if not a top 5) program when they dropped. 

Outside the SEC, Notre Dame has a solid program.  When they dropped, JJ McGrew transferred to Okie State where he won a national title.  ND was a privately financed program.  Its still  tough to take that they dropped it. Rumor at the time they would bring it right back once the heat passed, but here were are 30 plus years later. 

Marquette was also privately funded, but still dropped.  

 

[Wrestleknownothing]

3 hours ago, Smsu150 said:

In regards to the SEC...

LSU had a really good team at one time.  Kevin Jackson transferred to Iowa State because they dropped the program.  

I want to say Tennessee (mid-80's) had a national champ and dropped the same year.  Kentucky was also a solid program.

Auburn was a top 10 (if not a top 5) program when they dropped. 

Outside the SEC, Notre Dame has a solid program.  When they dropped, JJ McGrew transferred to Okie State where he won a national title.  ND was a privately financed program.  Its still  tough to take that they dropped it. Rumor at the time they would bring it right back once the heat passed, but here were are 30 plus years later. 

Marquette was also privately funded, but still dropped.  

 

Good memory.

1985 Chris Edmonds 167 - Tennessee's only national champ and highest team finish (8th).

http://www.wrestlingstats.com/ncaa/pdf/brackets/NCAA 1985.pdf

1986 - Tennessee's last season.

Auburn finished 9th the year they got dropped (1981).

http://www.wrestlingstats.com/ncaa/pdf/brackets/NCAA 1981.pdf

But I couldn't find anything about Dayton wrestling. Any idea when that would have been?

I do see Akron, though, from 1937 to 1981.

Edited August 23, 2023 by Wrestleknownothing

[BigRedFan]

On 8/16/2023 at 10:49 PM, AgaveMaria said:

 

What are the others you guys see as top programs we have lost?

Lehigh?

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

19 minutes ago, BigRedFan said:

Lehigh?

Not funny!

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

1 hour ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Good memory.

1985 Chris Edmonds 167 - Tennessee's only national champ and highest team finish (8th).

http://www.wrestlingstats.com/ncaa/pdf/brackets/NCAA 1985.pdf

1986 - Tennessee's last season.

Auburn finished 9th the year they got dropped (1981).

http://www.wrestlingstats.com/ncaa/pdf/brackets/NCAA 1981.pdf

But I couldn't find anything about Dayton wrestling. Any idea when that would have been?

I do see Akron, though, from 1937 to 1981.

Worked a camp with Chris Edmonds.  Super good guy, at least in my experience.

One of my college coaches was an LSU stud.  Placed at another school...

 

[Tripnsweep]

On 8/16/2023 at 7:49 PM, AgaveMaria said:

What are the others you guys see as top programs we have lost?

Oklahoma

[Smsu150]

11 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Good memory.

1985 Chris Edmonds 167 - Tennessee's only national champ and highest team finish (8th).

http://www.wrestlingstats.com/ncaa/pdf/brackets/NCAA 1985.pdf

1986 - Tennessee's last season.

Auburn finished 9th the year they got dropped (1981).

http://www.wrestlingstats.com/ncaa/pdf/brackets/NCAA 1981.pdf

But I couldn't find anything about Dayton wrestling. Any idea when that would have been?

I do see Akron, though, from 1937 to 1981.

I know we wrestled a dual against Dayton in 1994.  Not sure how much longer the program survived after that.  That being said, Dayton wasn't very good at the time, as we shut them out. 

Edited August 23, 2023 by Smsu150

[Wrestleknownothing]

3 hours ago, Smsu150 said:

I know we wrestled a dual against Dayton in 1994.  Not sure how much longer the program survived after that.  That being said, Dayton wasn't very good at the time, as we shut them out. 

This was really bugging me. I could not find any mention of Dayton via internet searches. They did not ever send a wrestler to NCAAs either (I checked the brackets). But lo and behold, I found them mentioned in the 1981 NCAA Wrestling Guide as members of the Eastern Regional Wrestling Association.

They finished the 1980 season with a 5-11 record under coach Will Place. However, the did not heed their coach's name, coming in last place with a whopping 1.75 points in the conference tournament. Other teams in the ERWA in 1980 were Slippery Rock, Virginia Tech, East Carolina, Rutgers, Shippensburg State, Old Dominion, James Madison, George Washington, Virginia, Commonwealth, Campbell, Farleigh Dickinson, Richmond, Indiana (PA), George Mason, and Wagner.

[11986]

1 minute ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

This was really bugging me. I could not find any mention of Dayton via internet searches. They did not ever send a wrestler to NCAAs either (I checked the brackets). But lo and behold, I found them mentioned in the 1981 NCAA Wrestling Guide as members of the Eastern Regional Wrestling Association.

They finished the 1980 season with a 5-11 record under coach Will Place. However, the did not heed their coach's name, coming in last place with a whopping 1.75 points in the conference tournament. Other teams in the ERWA in 1980 were Slippery Rock, Virginia Tech, East Carolina, Rutgers, Shippensburg State, Old Dominion, James Madison, George Washington, Virginia, Commonwealth, Campbell, Farleigh Dickinson, Richmond, Indiana (PA), George Mason, and Wagner.

the good ole Eastern Regional. Look at those teams listed from 1980 and how many are gone, sad. 

 

[Wrestleknownothing]

2 minutes ago, 11986 said:

the good ole Eastern Regional. Look at those teams listed from 1980 and how many are gone, sad. 

 

My thought exactly.

It looks like 1980 was the last year for the ERWA. In 1981 VT, ODU, James Madison, George Mason, VCU, and Richmond are all in the Virginia Intercollegiate Wrestling Championships. Then VCU and East Carolina dropped after 1981.

[11986]

12 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

My thought exactly.

It looks like 1980 was the last year for the ERWA. In 1981 VT, ODU, James Madison, George Mason, VCU, and Richmond are all in the Virginia Intercollegiate Wrestling Championships. Then VCU and East Carolina dropped after 1981.

I think the Eastern regional went on for a few more years. Pretty sure that's how guys like Bowyer and Kurlander from JMU qualified for NCAAs. Think Edinboro was in it as well at soem point.

The Virginia Intercollegiate was in an in season tournament, not a national qualifier.  

Edited August 23, 2023 by 11986
left something out

[Wrestleknownothing]

9 minutes ago, 11986 said:

I think the Eastern regional went on for a few more years. Pretty sure that's how guys like Bowyer and Kurlander from JMU qualified for NCAAs. Think Edinboro was in it as well at soem point.

The Virginia Intercollegiate was in an in season tournament, not a national qualifier.  

Yes, the East Regional as a qualifier continued to exist. But the way I read the 1981 guide was that the the Eastern Regional Wrestling Association was a conference separate and distinct from the East Regional qualifier. It is listed among the other conferences in the results section. None of the regional qualifying tournaments are listed among those results.

[11986]

1 minute ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Yes, the East Regional as a qualifier continued to exist. But the way I read the 1981 guide was that the the Eastern Regional Wrestling Association was a conference separate and distinct from the East Regional qualifier. It is listed among the other conferences in the results section. None of the regional qualifying tournaments are listed among those results.

got it

[HungusMungus]

On 8/17/2023 at 12:23 PM, PortaJohn said:

Has Syracuse been mentioned yet?  They're always mentioned in this conversation 

The Smashing Machine Mark Kerr was a monster at Syracuse 

 

Seton Hall was D1, Charlie & Russ Haas were alumni of that program 

[Ohio Elite]

Could you imagine if Bama had a wrestling team??

Just kidding they would suck....

[TitleIX is ripe for reform]

On 8/23/2023 at 2:54 PM, Ohio Elite said:

Could you imagine if Bama had a wrestling team??

Just kidding they would suck....

Did Alabama and Auburn suck when they were NCAA D1?   Doesn't seem like it, according to this:

http://johnnythompsonnum1.blogspot.com/2017/09/solving-mystery-that-was-sec.html 

I don't know what percentage of their line-up was actually from the Southeastern USA, though.   But hopefully more local recruits could participate nowadays if they reinstated their D1 programs.    That seems to be a recipe for survival and hopefully success, as well.  Admittedly a D1 team that I've watched closely over the years lost momentum when recruiting so many from the Southeastern USA nearly a decade ago.   Or maybe the cause of the decline was the loss of some on the coaching staff.   We need to engage the entire country if we want to have a better chance of keeping wrestling as an Olympic sport.

[Husker_Du]

According to several people, Temple was on the verge of adding wrestling back when Covid hit. there were one or two others that were very close to adding at that time, too.

the only catch, in regards to Temple, was that i was told it wasn't going to be fully funded. 

[Jason Bryant]

On 8/25/2023 at 1:07 AM, TitleIX is ripe for reform said:

Did Alabama and Auburn suck when they were NCAA D1?   Doesn't seem like it, according to this:
 

Alabama wasn't good. Never ranked. Never an All-American. Never finished higher than 37th at the NCAA championships. 

Auburn was showing promise when it was dropped in 1981. They finished 9th in 1981 with three All-Americans, including Clar Anderson who won an NCAA title two years later at Oklahoma State. Auburn was ranked in the Top 25 only three times in its history, those last two seasons. Historically, they weren't good. They had two good seasons at the end. 

 

[TitleIX is ripe for reform]

1 hour ago, Jason Bryant said:

Alabama wasn't good. Never ranked. Never an All-American. Never finished higher than 37th at the NCAA championships. 

The Crimson Tide apparently produced this eventual h.s. coach whose ripple effects continue mainly in Florida, but also beyond...

https://flasportshof.org/fshofmember/russ-cozart/

I do not see Alabama mentioned on that page but I think I read (a decade ago or so) that he's a Bama alum.  
    I didn't recall any major team accomplishments by Bama, though, so I merely asked (rhetorically) if they sucked.   Producing Coach Cozart is a remarkable accomplishment.   

     As for Auburn... some teams would be thrilled to have such a rankings history.  Perhaps someday wrestling will return there at the NCAA level.  I'm not holding my breath though, admittedly.

    

[TitleIX is ripe for reform]

It seems like he graduated from Bama in '76 with a degree in education.

 

Edited August 26, 2023 by TitleIX is ripe for reform

[Jason Bryant]

I didn’t say talented people and future coaches weren’t part of those programs but Kentucky, LSU and Tennessee saw more success when they were competing in the various qualifying regionals than in the SEC, where the qualifier system at the time was limiting.

The point to bring up here is how every program, no matter how big or how strong, can provide quality and dedicated mentors and coaches for the next generation of wrestlers.

[TexRef]

13 hours ago, Jason Bryant said:

I didn’t say talented people and future coaches weren’t part of those programs but Kentucky, LSU and Tennessee saw more success when they were competing in the various qualifying regionals than in the SEC, where the qualifier system at the time was limiting.

The point to bring up here is how every program, no matter how big or how strong, can provide quality and dedicated mentors and coaches for the next generation of wrestlers.

Kentucky's Rick Dellagatta had some epic battles with Iowa's Randy Lewis.