scourge165

LOL...probably accidentally accurate!

Quite a long and then VERY quick recovery all in one...

Vito was a World Champ and an NCAA Champ and he was...like 25 years old Wrestling a Freshmen. The insecurity here is...strange. He was hurt the first tournament of the year, he was hurt at the conference two weeks prior, but NOW he's healthy when he beat him here? This was more about what Crookham did than what Vito didn't...but making excuses for Vito is...beneath him(or should be).

And...neither was exactly a fluke. I don't remember exactly how each match went, but I thought he started the matches with TDs and then kinda put them away with TDs. 10-4 type matches. One I thought he was near a major and Vito scored late. My memory may be off(I'm sure it is) but not a...Zain beating Stieber type of match where it came down to RT or something. And that's Vito coming off one of the most impressive NCAA runs I've seen in a while just blowing Fix and RBY out of the Gym.

I stand corrected and I guess...correct! I just didn't realize he was Wrestling with the pushout and most of the videos I've seen(I'd just watched the Smith match, but there were a lot) guys were able to get to the leg, but not finish. So...I guess you need not speculate that he'd have solved that as well since he did.

Yeah, this one really hit me as I went back and watched some of his matches...and it seemed like guys got in on his legs fairly easily...relatively speaking. Compared to other GREAT MFS Wrestlers and they struggled to finish with that leg in the air, but I thought, 'well, now they'd just be able to walk him out,' and then I kinda caught myself like...'no, of course that's not how it'd go. He went out of bounds there because it wasn't a point. It probably just causes more cartwheels and even more insane scrambles, I think of the scramble Sadulaev had vs the Bulgarian...which was one of the most impressive scramble and defense to offensive exchanges I've ever seen, but Saitiev had so many.

I don't think people ignore Medved. He comes in #2 or #3 on all the all-time great lists I see. ...seriously? We're just talking about their physique....that's all. I was simply replying to Did this somehow get translated to 100 of 100 people think Dake and Burroughs(just two guys I picked, Joe Wiliams could easily have been one or...most Wrestlers at that level) were actually better?

Sure. This hardly feels like a point worth arguing. That physically he wasn't imposing but he was still one of, if not the greatest ever. Yes, as @MPhillipsquote from Fried points out, this was really all I was saying. He won a world title at 85 KGs weighing about 80s. That's weighing in over 10 pounds under...with guys cutting weight and still winning a world title. So...I feel like most people just looking at him would not have him pegged as the greatest ever.

'I won't comment on this anymore as this is one of the wrestling forums, but I still decided to bump a post from December 2023 and then claim that Trump(Tim Apple) and his daily rambling gaffes...only has 1 gaffe! Then why the hell are you bringing it up? Because I laughed at the idea that idea that Biden gets a pass? When did he ever get a pass? Again, Biden LITERALLY brought up something Trump had said about the Airports in the Revolutionary War. That was "disqualifying" as they both agreed...until it was Trump, the guy who thought Jackson was alive during the Civil War, the guy who's "hearing very good things about Andrew Jackson," and the same MFer who talked about INJECTING a "disinfectant" into your lungs! Oh, you remember the horrible event at 7/11? Trump does(perhaps why he has to flush 10-15 times? I don't know...can't say). At least he went to Puerto Rico, the Virgin Islands and had a very good meeting with the President(I don't think anyone has told him...that is him). Lets just remember the "Oranges" of what I said about the Trump economy. Wasn't it nice when we had 3.2% GDP growth and inflation was coming down after the previous POTUS? Then we went back to the very thing that caused the great depresion and the markets are crashing. Hope you ignored my advice to go cash as it was inevitable he was going to blow up this economy with his tariffs(that he STILL somehow believe the other Country pays). LOL, anyway...I just remember why I had you on ignore. It was nice seeing as many of your posts as Iowa Champs the last couple years. We'll go back to that...

Well...then Carter has already pulled off one helluva upset this year, hasn't he?

Yeah, that seems like a silly controversy. Just aiming for perfection when wrestling. I don't even need the translation. He's training to be...as close to perfect as he can. You always fall short, that's his goal. Maybe that's wrong...I don't know. Who cares though!

This is what I said. Any team you're a fan of had 23-24 year olds competing the last couple years. Would it be better if Bo was Mormon and did a mission and then came back? People have done that.

It is a sad day...but your description of him...is accurate. Now I never saw him Wrestle in person, but you take Kyle Dake or Jordan Burroughs and you take Saitiev and you line all three up and say, "who is the better Wrestler, take a guess." 100 of 100 people are taking Saitiev 3rd. But watching him was like watching art. The cartwheels defending shots, the grip that had to be preternatural given how he hung onto that leg and sucked it in and finished. All of it...he was amazing.

If you want to be the greatest ever...and I've argued I think Sadulaev can become the greatest ever yet, this is the guy you've got to pass up. This is the standard...(and his Brother was pretty damn good as well).

Depends on what you mean. There are a shockingly number of undiagnosed heart issues. I know a guy, he said he used to ask people if it was normal for your heart to start beating really fast for like 30 seconds a minute and then slow down. It'd happened to me. He had a heart attack in his mid 30s. He had some...irregular heart beat that didn't get picked up when they were just doing routine tests. He was fine, but...it wasn't good. I went in after that, had a stress test that...I had to push for and about 15 minutes in and they're just light jogging, but it started going WILD for about 10-15 seconds. But that's how long it took for them to find it to give me something to prevent that from happening. I've seen family members smoke 2 packs a day, eat like *I poop my pants, don't laugh at me*, live into their late 80s, 90s. Other people I know, they ran everyday, they were in great shape and they died at 48 of a heart attack.

And...you somehow think this proves what? You had Bo Nickal and Joe Rogan BOTH say talking about taking the airports during the Revolutionary War was immediately disqualifying for President when they thought Biden said it. They found out Trump said it and it was, "well, when you're giving that many speeches, ya know, sometimes your words get mixed up." But sure, Biden got passes on all his Gaffes and...a book you didn't read somehow disproves that. FOH dude...

I think that's a pretty good bet. Or maybe Kasak is going for 4. Well, no, clearly not as the OP was confused about Bassetts age, but is that really why you think Bassett and Ferrari aren't capable of being 4X Champs? Because Ayala, Woods and Lee didn't win titles the last two years? If they had would you think they had a chance? Both of those guys should absolutely be competitive next year and then the following unless Bassett RSs. The last two individual performances at the NCAAs for Iowa has no bearing on that.

Well...I'd disagree if that were true, but which WC was Sadulaev banned from Wrestling when Snyder won a Gold? Was Snyder's top competition a...Canadian(and again, I don't recall this happening).

Yeah, I wouldn't be that happy at that stage(well, I would, but I'm assuming I'm good enough to win an Olympic Gold here)... It's fine to be beaten up, take a beat and then walk out, head held high(as I think Lee did in the last Olympics). It's the process to get you there. Just a stupid little anecdote, but I was Wrestling a tournaments with some Minnesota kids in it. I tech falled this guy I'd grown up Wrestling. I'd always beaten him and I knew him. Marty Morgan is over talking to my Dad, I don't know why, but whatever. I'm in the finals. I've got another Minnesota kid. I get hammed like 7-3(but not that close)or something. Not competitive. Morgan goes up to my Dad and asks if something was wrong, was I hurt, he asks me and I shake my head, I was fine. It was actually a closer match than my last with him. I'd grown up losing to one and beating the other. The one I'd grown up beating had already won his 2nd state title and the one I got worked by had taken a 5th or a 6th. That was a hurdle I had for a long time and it's mental weakness, but if I know I can get to my shots and finish, I'm just Wrestling free, taking shots, not worried about getting scored on and it doesn't feel tough. When I'm in my head thinking how good this guy is, I'm not Wrestling free, I'm planning a shot and...you aren't as quick if you're thinking 'now shoot!' I believe the mentality I have is more the norm than the exception. LOTS of guys at all levels have these issues. What Cael has done and what these guys seem to do is just get out of these head and let it fly...and when you do that and lose...it takes the sting out...the few times I can remember Wrestling like that vs a good guy and losing. Not all of it. Still hurts, but it is easier to accept. I did everything I could. (Long way of both making it about me and saying...yup, I totally agree)

Yeah, and I probably wouldn't. But I sure as hell wouldn't judge you or your kid for doing so. Bo had an advantage as a Freshmen maybe, but that's it. When you start Wrestling College National Champs and AAs and winning Super 32, Ironman and age level World Titles, I don't care anymore. Pretty much whoever you're a team of, they've had a guy who was 23-24 Wrestling in the last few years. If you weren't upset then, don't worry about Bassetts age.

The lack of respect for Snyder...drives me nuts. He won an Olympic Gold, 3 WCs and then he wrestled much of his career with...IMO, the greatest Wrestler ever, but...conservatively, a top 5 in MFS...and his career is talked about as though he's..Dustin Schlatter or someone. And that is NOT a knock on Schlatter, that dude last just TWO matches his first two years and won...I think 85, won it as a True Fresh and took a 3rd, then injuries mounted. He did make a World Team in College and his only loss was to the Bronze Medalist. So I'm not picking some guy who did nothing, but the's talked about A-like a guy who is done and he's not. Bruce is a legend, but...is Snyder's Gold and Silver really less impressive than Bruce winning a Gold in 1984 when MOST of the talent in that field was out of it and then a Gold when he was older than Snyder is now(meaning both it's impressive what he did, but we're closing the book on Snyder too early). I HATE these discussions when you detract from what someone else did, but...C'mon, winning it in '84 is not the same as any other year. He lost to the Russian the year before, the Russian had won the WC surrounding '80, another Russian won it in '80. He beat a Canadian. And now...I respect our 51st state, but...not quite the same as the Russians. It's just...the tone in which we talk about him, like a disappointment. And yet, David Taylor...who deserves ALL the accolades and "flowers" as they say, he couldn't beat the top 2 guys in front of him and had to change weight and then accomplished what Snyder did, but we talk about him like he was untouchable. No...do people not remember I think one year he lost to Howe before getting to Dake and Burroughs(or maybe had had an epic match he beat Howe, either way). Nobody has even challenged Snyder at 97KG. And not for nothing, but the guy who has stopped Snyder from winning a few more of the San Francisco-ie Medals, he did Wrestle Taylor. It was a dominating win for Sadulaev. Which is just worth noting. But Snyder can't gut Sadualev? Oh my...let me show him how it's done AND...I'm going to mention that there are 6 weights now and 10 when he Wrestled. I think it's likely we talk about a dream matchup with Sadulaev and Snyder if 92KG was still an Olympic weight as I think that's where Sadulaev Wrestles. He's where he looks the best and then Snyder has another Olympic Gold and a couple more World Titles. If THAT happens, then Taylor(all of 29 years old now) would have dominated the weight for 7 years with two Olympic Titles and 5 WCs. That's all hypothetical though. What I KNOW is Kyle Snyder came into Ohio State as one of the most high touted prep recruits, he got to campus as a True Freshmen and probably joins Logan Stieber as a 4X National Champ, but Ohio State needed him THAT YEAR to win a team Title...and Snyder, Wrestling J'Den Cox, the #1 seed and defending National Champ, he pulled off the upset over a Mizzou team that was RIGHT there with Ohio State, helps them bring home the team title. Then wins 3 more title and in the process, becomes the first College Wrestle to win an Olympic Gold and then come back and Wrestle in the NCAAs again beating a guy going for his 3rd title giving up 40 pounds before winning his 3 title giving up the most weight a HWT had given up in I thought it was like 50 years. Snyder peaked just fine, he's had a GREAT career, one of the most accomplished Americans ever and he's not done yet. Anyway, that Ono is something special, but I was impressed with Lee in that match. I actually feel better about his chances to win a Gold AFTER that match. (I wanted to stay on topic and not get into some off-topic tangent!)

If Bo was a Sr this year, he'd be in a normal age range. Haines was younger than average. I was 17 when I graduated and I was younger than half the Jr class. I probably should have been held back, but what I think is kinda silly is that your growth as a Wrestler is impacted THAT significantly by age vs development. Spending an extra year in HS isn't NEARLY as helpful as spending a year at the Collegiate level, grinding it out. Lets just stop with this age nonsense. I don't care. Kyle Snyder or Levi Haines...they were younger and their accomplishments INCREDIBLY impressive. But you take that year of training they had as Sr's away and...Haines is probably on the podium, not on the raised stage and Snyder, who knows, he was a freak, but that year led to tremendous growth for both. These are also just kids who happen to be the best in a sport that we all love watching, but still, the old guy we're talking about here and people keep taking jabs at? That's an 18 year old Jr in HS. The kid is a year younger than average. Also, like it or not(and most do not) he's doing quite a bit to grow the sport.

I almost want to root for Ono...the kid is so happy. I also loved seeing Lee look...laid back and mellow during weigh-ins. I think he'd benefit from dumping that "winning is life, losing is death," mentality...and I shouldn't quote that as I'm not sure that's exactly what he said, but it was close. (Or maybe he wouldn't...the hell do I know...he's a 3X Champ with a Silver at the Olympics, his way only failed relative to the INSANE standards set for him).

I would say Sinclair is physically a notch or 2 behind those guys. Technically, I think he's the best of that group. He needs to spend a year developing into a full '84. I wouldn't be surprised if he was a '65 pounder if he cut weight like most guys. He just doesn't cut. He probably got down to '84 by skipping a meal. So a year of lifting, working on building up to 200 walking around(which is probably not easy if he's working out regularly) and then go '84? I think he can be a 4Xer. To be clear though, I see...probably 6-7 kids a year coming in that I CAN envision being 4X Champs in a given year. I don't think they actually will. This year I guess I have just Lillendahl, Barr and then most other weights are still so stacked, but I'd say McEnally if not for 2 of the best Wrestlers at '84 in a while. But down the road, Knox, Blaze, Bo, Jax, Ross, Sinclair, Ferrari, Duke, Lockett, Arnold(maybe)...I'm tired, but not one would shock me if they won it as a Freshmen which means...potential 4X Champs. I tend to just look at the potential rather than the realistic outcome. I had Haines and Mesenbrink a full year before either stepped on the mat for PSU...and sure, I was wrong, but...close. I'm still curious how we're going to rank Mesenbrink when he goes through his career with a 99.8% Bonus/TF rate with 1 loss and goes 2/1/1/1 with a RT confusion from being a 4X undefeated champ. I'll give Duke the best shot if they can figure out how he can go '57 or'65 as a Freshmen. I didn't mention Raney(s) or Zepeda HS kids are so much more ready now it's...silly.

He's undefeated. He's won 4 National Titles. The only NON-Major of the year was a guy who just beat the #3 ranked Wrestler, last years runner up and that Wrestler backed up the entire match. Your Starocci obsession is amusing at this point. Iowa has the best stallers vs him. That's...about the extent of the bragging rights you've got right now.