Is this acceptable? Is this smart?

[uncle bernard]

Why are ICE agents allowed to do this. Unmarked vans. No badges. No uniform. Ski masks. Arresting people without displaying warrants. Is this an acceptable way to police in a free country?

Set that aside. Is this a smart way to police in a free country? How long before an ICE agent gets shot by someone thinking they're being kidnapped? Isn't that exactly what the 2nd amendment is for? If you legally carried a gun for protection, and an unmarked van pulled up next to you, four guys in plain clothes and ski masks jump out and try to grab you, would you not fight back? Next thing you know, you have bullets flying in the streets at any given time, putting civilians, officers, and arrestees at risk.

Set aside whether you support the deportations. Is this a good way to go about it? Does this not put innocent people in danger? Does it not erode trusts in law enforcement? Seems incredibly reckless to me.

 

 

[red viking]

The hypocrisy of the right continues to be laughable. They don't want protesters wearing masks in LA but if they're police - well that's perfectly fine. 

[uncle bernard]

@Husker_Du @jross @mspart 

I'd really love your guys' views on this. Again, set aside the deportation issue. For the sake of discussion, I will grant that all illegal immigrants should be deported.

Do you have any concerns about this kind of policing? Does it worry you at all? Do you think it's the most effective way to go about this?

[Bigbrog]

LOL...this topic cracks me up!!  FYI...this isn't a new law enforcement tactic.  Different agencies have used this approach on multiple occasions for many many years.  I believe the standard protocol is that a law enforcement agent, no matter how they are dressed, has to verbally identify themselves upon contact with suspect(s)...and once detained, as they seem fit given the situation and suspected crime, they then can notify as to the reason why they are being stopped and detained.

So the bigger question is why is this all of a sudden an issue with people??  I think we all know the answer to that.

I'd challenge any one of you on here that think you know better than law enforcement on what their policies and protocols should be, go do an actual ride along, or even just talk to a law enforcement agent.

[wrestlingguy]

44 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Why are ICE agents allowed to do this. Unmarked vans. No badges. No uniform. Ski masks. Arresting people without displaying warrants. Is this an acceptable way to police in a free country?

Set that aside. Is this a smart way to police in a free country? How long before an ICE agent gets shot by someone thinking they're being kidnapped? Isn't that exactly what the 2nd amendment is for? If you legally carried a gun for protection, and an unmarked van pulled up next to you, four guys in plain clothes and ski masks jump out and try to grab you, would you not fight back? Next thing you know, you have bullets flying in the streets at any given time, putting civilians, officers, and arrestees at risk.

Set aside whether you support the deportations. Is this a good way to go about it? Does this not put innocent people in danger? Does it not erode trusts in law enforcement? Seems incredibly reckless to me.

 

 

Your concern is valid. I sure as heck wouldn't want to be these guys because it is only a matter of time before they get shot. They could be anyone dressed like the above picture. That being said there must be a good reason why they aren't dressed in uniform with badges, etc.

[Caveira]

37 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

@Husker_Du @jross @mspart 

I'd really love your guys' views on this. Again, set aside the deportation issue. For the sake of discussion, I will grant that all illegal immigrants should be deported.

Do you have any concerns about this kind of policing? Does it worry you at all? Do you think it's the most effective way to go about this?

Do you have any sympathy when the left “cancels” officers by finding their pii info and publishing it online?   How do you suggest deportations take place when the locals riot and try to prevent it.  Or cities flagrantly do not intend and often interfere with enforcement of federal law.

[uncle bernard]

5 minutes ago, Caveira said:

Do you have any sympathy when the left “cancels” officers by finding their pii info and publishing it online?   How do you suggest deportations take place when the locals riot and try to prevent it.  Or cities flagrantly do not intend and often interfere with enforcement of federal law.

1) Yes, I have sympathy. Doxxing is wrong. No non-publicly available information should be revealed about those officers.

2) I suggest they do so according to the well-established norms of policing in this country, which means clearly identifiable uniforms, badge numbers, and faces. They should have to abide by court orders and habeas corpus rights. They should only be using force as an absolute last resort.

People have been deported from this country for decades and decades. Trump still hasn't deported as many people as Barack Obama.

Do you think it's possible that one reason there is such strong resistance to ICE right now is because they are behaving like an American Gestapo? This stuff scares people. We grow up learning about the evils of the SS and KGB. It's not surprising most of the public really dislikes the practices of an agency that, at the very least aesthetically, looks like those evils.

[mspart]

I think they should be in uniform, without names on the uniform, but identified as ICE etc.   Masks are ok to keep from creeps identifying them so they and their families are as safe from nefarious goons as possible.  

If, and I mean if, this is really happening, then there is no doubt someone will get shot for their own protection.   By if, I mean I have not heard of this, but am not ruling it out as the law enforcement is trying to stay safe. 

mspart

 

 

[ionel]

1 hour ago, uncle bernard said:

Why are ICE agents allowed to do this. Unmarked vans. No badges. No uniform. Ski masks. Arresting people without displaying warrants. Is this an acceptable way to police in a free country?

Set that aside. Is this a smart way to police in a free country? How long before an ICE agent gets shot by someone thinking they're being kidnapped? Isn't that exactly what the 2nd amendment is for? If you legally carried a gun for protection, and an unmarked van pulled up next to you, four guys in plain clothes and ski masks jump out and try to grab you, would you not fight back? Next thing you know, you have bullets flying in the streets at any given time, putting civilians, officers, and arrestees at risk.

Set aside whether you support the deportations. Is this a good way to go about it? Does this not put innocent people in danger? Does it not erode trusts in law enforcement? Seems incredibly reckless to me.

 

 

I bet they have ID.  You probably have to ask them.  Have you ever seen FBI on a stake out?  Do you think they have FBI plastered all over their clothing and vehicles?  But if asked they will show ID.  

[Caveira]

6 minutes ago, ionel said:

I bet they have ID.  You probably have to ask them.  Have you ever seen FBI on a stake out?  Do you think they have FBI plastered all over their clothing and vehicles?  But if asked they will show ID.  

I said this on one of the other 500 threads pertaining to deportations.  The left will fight every single little detail regarding Trump deportations as they don’t like him or deportations in general.  They legitimately just want all the illegals to stay.  The complaint will change 50,000 more times between now and when Trump leaves office.  

[mspart]

Today, Homan reported that yesterday there were the smallest number of illegal entries ever, under 100.   He compared that to Biden time where thousands were allowed in everyday. 

Which is better UB, RV, Trip?

mspart

[uncle bernard]

1 hour ago, ionel said:

I bet they have ID.  You probably have to ask them.  Have you ever seen FBI on a stake out?  Do you think they have FBI plastered all over their clothing and vehicles?  But if asked they will show ID.  

They are being asked and are refusing to identify themselves. That's all over the news and a major reason why these protests kicked off.

[Caveira]

1 minute ago, uncle bernard said:

They are being asked and are refusing to identify themselves. That's all over the news and a major reason why these protests kicked off.

By whom.  Random strangers ?    Do the police need to identify themselves to random strangers?   

[uncle bernard]

1 hour ago, mspart said:

Today, Homan reported that yesterday there were the smallest number of illegal entries ever, under 100.   He compared that to Biden time where thousands were allowed in everyday. 

Which is better UB, RV, Trip?

mspart

1) Is that even true? Or are illegal immigrants simply returning to prior practices of evading entry points because the legal process of asylum seeking is not being respected, so there's no point in even trying to enter through a legal port? Also possible it's a straight up lie given this administration's willingness to play fast and loose with facts.

2) I would rather have tons of illegal immigrants enter than a masked goon squad roaming the streets arresting suspected illegal immigrants, and sometimes legal ones too, causing huge community disturbances in the process. They don't commit crimes at high rates, they play an important role in the economy, and most of all, deserve their shot at a better life wherever they deem that to be.

Come in, pay your taxes, be a good citizen, and you're A-okay in my book. If you break the law, off you go. Simple as that in my opinion.

[uncle bernard]

5 minutes ago, Caveira said:

By whom.  Random strangers ?    Do the police need to identify themselves to random strangers?   

YES JESUS CHRIST

There's a reason why most departments in this country have that as their policy (and it's actually the law in many places). It's good policy that builds trust with the public.

Edited Wednesday at 06:18 PM by uncle bernard

[Caveira]

4 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

YES JESUS CHRIST

There's a reason why most departments in this country have that as their policy (and it's actually the law in many places). It's good policy that builds trust with the public.

Google is fun 

Must officers identify themselves by name on scene?

• No federal requirement compels officers to give their name and badge number when asked 

• Some states or departments require uniforms with visible nameplates or badges and might have local rules for identifying themselves 

• For regular on‑scene arrests, unless local policy mandates it, officers are not legally obligated to verbally provide their name and badge on the spot

[uncle bernard]

A conservative writer stating the obvious: "Masked ICE Agents Are a Danger to Both the Public and Themselves"

https://reason.com/2025/06/13/masked-ice-agents-are-a-danger-to-both-the-public-and-themselves/

Allowing law enforcement agents to act with complete anonymity means allowing them to operate without effective oversight.

Such cases clearly show why allowing officers—empowered to make arrests and potentially kill—to remain anonymous is injurious to both public safety and individual liberty. But masked agents also pose a danger to themselves.

It's one thing to be approached by a phalanx of police officers, decked out in identical SWAT gear with badges and their agency's acronym emblazoned across the front. It's something else entirely to be swarmed by a group of masked men in street clothes with guns drawn. One could easily mistake them for a criminal gang and might potentially take deadly defensive action.

Even if you support the mass arrest of undocumented immigrants, it's indefensible to deploy anonymous, unaccountable government agents to carry out that task. Worse, it carries the serious risk of an armed confrontation between law enforcement and well-meaning individuals.

It's crazy how you guys feel the need to defend literally everything Trump does. You treat him like he's infallible. If you read your Bibles, you'd know he's not.

[uncle bernard]

4 minutes ago, Caveira said:

Google is fun 

 

Must officers identify themselves by name on scene?

• No federal requirement compels officers to give their name and badge number when asked 

• Some states or departments require uniforms with visible nameplates or badges and might have local rules for identifying themselves 

• For regular on‑scene arrests, unless local policy mandates it, officers are not legally obligated to verbally provide their name and badge on the spot

If you knew how to read, you'd know that I acknowledged it's not federally required by law.

[mspart]

11 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Come in, pay your taxes, be a good citizen, and you're A-okay in my book. If you break the law, off you go. Simple as that in my opinion.

So you are saying the governments going after criminal illegal aliens is a good thing.   Glad we got that out of the way.   Assuming most feel like you, what is the issue with ICE protests? 

mspart

[Caveira]

3 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

If you knew how to read, you'd know that I acknowledged it's not federally required by law.

Ok.  I would lobby my congressman and ask to get it changed instead of whining about yet another law you don’t want to follow.  

[uncle bernard]

As I've said a million times on here, Conservatives LOVE authoritarianism. They yearn to see their cultural enemies get stomped by the state.

Their issue with Communist governments was never about the authoritarianism. It was that authoritarianism was being used to enforce leftist ideology, not *their own* conservative ideology.

That's why you never hear them mention guys like Pinochet when they refer to murderous authoritarian regimes. Pinochet was murdering people so he could enforce all the ideas they agree with. 

That's exactly what's happening here. In another context, they would obviously admit that this stuff is really evil. Hell, they say simply having children's books in schools that promote LGBTQ values is authoritarianism. But so long as the goons are doing this to enforce their own political desires, they not only turn a blind eye, they actively cheer them on.

[Caveira]

3 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

As I've said a million times on here, Conservatives LOVE authoritarianism. They yearn to see their cultural enemies get stomped by the state.

Their issue with Communist governments was never about the authoritarianism. It was that authoritarianism was being used to enforce leftist ideology, not *their own* conservative ideology.

That's why you never hear them mention guys like Pinochet when they refer to murderous authoritarian regimes. Pinochet was murdering people so he could enforce all the ideas they agree with. 

That's exactly what's happening here. In another context, they would obviously admit that this stuff is really evil. Hell, they say simply having children's books in schools that promote LGBTQ values is authoritarianism. But so long as the goons are doing this to enforce their own political desires, they not only turn a blind eye, they actively cheer them on.

Please don’t mention pol pot.  That other dude will go nutso.  
 

also soft reminder.  The gov wouldn’t be deporting illegals via ice if the local state city enforced federal law 

[uncle bernard]

3 minutes ago, mspart said:

So you are saying the governments going after criminal illegal aliens is a good thing.   Glad we got that out of the way.   Assuming most feel like you, what is the issue with ICE protests? 

mspart

Yes, that's totally acceptable. That's not what's happening here. The fact you'd make that claim shows how warped your worldview is. People are pissed because they are rounding up people who, though are not legal residents, are positively contributing to society and and not committing crimes. And they're tearing apart families in the process.

Entering the country illegally is a misdemeanor. Overstaying a VISA isn't even a criminal offense. It's as serious as a speeding ticket. If they commit an *actual crime,* something that millions of "law-abiding" Americans don't commit the equivalent of every single day, then deport them.

[uncle bernard]

3 minutes ago, Caveira said:

Please don’t mention pol pot.  That other dude will go nutso.  
 

also soft reminder.  The gov wouldn’t be deporting illegals via ice if the local state city enforced federal law 

Pol Pot was supported by the US against the Communists. We were his main source of power.

[Caveira]

6 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Pol Pot was supported by the US against the Communists. We were his main source of power.

Now you’re gonna get 45 posts from what’s his nuts.   Thanks.