uncle bernard

some levity lol

who on here is supporting hamas?

i’m not. i’ve explicitly condemned hamas. see, when you maintain consistent values, these gotcha attempts don’t work. you can be anti-hamas while saying israel’s military policies are wrong. the world isn’t black or white. if hamas had carried out an identical strike, we know what you would have said about it, and you’d have been right!

so close! but the correct answer was “yes”

do you condemn the relief organization strike that killed an american citizen and several others?

fine, they are targeting civilians. they know they are killing civilians. we know that because they tell us that! they consciously make the choice to kill them. who cares if they also say they’re killing someone else at the same time. they’re still pulling the trigger knowing that they’re going to kill an innocent child. look at the food workers a couple weeks. they knew those were international volunteers. they were approved and in communication with the IDF. they say they “thought” they saw a militant join the caravan. they could not confirm he was a militant or that he was even there but decided to strike the caravan (three times while victims tried to crawl to safety btw) anyway on the off chance he was. there was no militant among the dead. can you condemn that? playing rhetorical games about my use of “indiscriminate ” doesn’t change 30k+ dead civilians.

i don’t feel strongly about the second amendment. i’d prefer if we had much stronger regulations and licensing to make it harder for mentally ill, criminals, domestic abusers, etc…to get them. i’m not a take away the guns guy and if we’re being real, nobody in the current scene has a position even close to that. banning assault weapons, maybe, but nobody is coming for your handgun or hunting rifle. let’s just be real about that.

biden (and obama) certainly perpetuate this system, but i think we should also recognize the modern spy state exploded under bush and trump did nothing to roll it back either.

that’s not always what happens but if the civilians don’t leave then yes. i know this is hard to accept but the other side cheating doesn’t make it okay to mass kill civilians. if they want our tax dollars and our guns, they should follow the rules of war they agreed to.

“good faith” from the guy who says the soldiers who are killing thousands of civilians has no responsibility for their deaths. by this reasoning there is no amount of civilians that could die that would make you change your mind because it’s hamas’ fault. either their are rules of war or there aren’t. osama didn’t follow them. hamas doesn’t follow them. and neither does israel. the only difference is we acknowledge that osama and hamas are wrong.

civilians die in war. but that doesn’t mean you can indiscriminately target them. two years ago our government (correctly) was apoplectic over the Russian invasion and killing of civilians. israel killed more civilians in one month than russia did in 2 years. to be fair to you, maybe you just don’t appreciate the scale of the civilian casualties? to act like this level of casualties was unavoidable is insane. it’s a conscious choice from Israel.

2) so you simply don’t believe in the concept of war crimes? if evil people can do something, that means everyone can? i guess you and bin laden agree about 9/11. the ends always justify the means. 3) i’m sorry the country that does the actual killing of the human shields does bear responsibility. and the human shield argument itself is dubious because there are 2 million people packed into a tiny strip of land. where are they supposed to go? israel’s bombed every “safe zone” it told them to go to. and anybody who wants to be intellectually honest knows they aren’t trying to avoid civilian casualties. as you all always scream “hamas is in the tunnels!” yes, and israel knows that. so who do they think they’re killing when they strike residential buildings? civilians. children. all while minimally hurting hamas. because the goal is to destroy Palestine, not just hamas. hamas is israel’s best friend (which is why they funded them in the first place). as long as they have a bogeyman to point to, they can keep slowly strangling Palestine, expanding illegal settlements until eventually they’ll have ethnically cleansed the whole place.

2) no that’s the standard every country should be held to. and the only reason it’s not is because the US has veto power in the UN and is the global superpower. two wrongs don’t make a right. and yes, hamas also commits war crimes! but we’re not funding and supporting hamas. i would hope we agree we should hold our allies to a higher standard than a terrorist group. i constantly have to say i don’t support hamas, but none of you ever admit that israel has done *anything* wrong in this conflict. so who is the fundamentalist here?

she was an old lady man. don’t debase yourself. our police are the most violent in the developed world. it doesn’t have to be like that. we can hold them to a higher standard. slamming an unarmed old lady on the concrete is not acceptable.

didn't see your last post. i responded. even *if* she touched one of the cops (which we can't actually see on video), do you think that was a reasonable response from officer farva? can we have some common sense about what constitutes battery or assaulting an officer?

1) Yes you got confused. The video you replied to is of the same guy willie was talking about. 2) Disagree. Following the catastrophe of the world wars, we came together as a civilized world to set down rules of war. Killing the human shields is a violation of those rules. It is a war crime. I believe in the rule of law, even when it's inconvenient. Levelling buildings you think might contain Hamas while you know they for sure contain civilians is a war crime. And it's wrong to portray that as their only option. They have one of the best funded, best equipped militaries in the world. They could be far more precise if they wanted to be. They just don't want to be. And they'll also be pretty open about that if you just listen to them. Hit translate on Hebrew tweets from Israeli politicians and generals. Far different tone than what they say in English for their Western audience. 3) Good. That's one of many reasons I don't support Hamas. Is that your only red line for Israel? Is there a civilian casualty number that you would find unacceptable, for example?

You're literally supporting a #1A violation! Somebody was arrested and charged for asking a question. How do you not see that?

Are you concerned about a peaceful protestor being slammed to the ground or not? Where's the outrage over free speech and freedom that you think makes this the greatest country in the world? Show some consistency and integrity.

She didn't touch anybody. She only asked what they were doing? That is not a crime nor interference. You have fascist tendencies. Like most conservative Americans you pontificate about the importance of "freedom" and get hard every time you see it trampled on.

hopefully we can find some common ground and agree this is bullshit. right?

i will never vote for joe biden. i know that probably breaks your simple brain.

1) what are you talking about? the video you replied to is of Mohamad Safa, the same guy willie called a fundamentalist. 2) the response to human shields isn’t to kill the shields. 3) name them.

The first guy and the second guy are the same guy. That's why I posted it. To show he's not an Islamic Fundamentalist like Willie accused him of being. And everybody on here knows Willie didn't think through the way that your two "fundamentalists" might be similar. He saw a Muslim supporting Palestine and cried fundamentalist which is obviously racist. According to your definition of fundamentalism, @Offthemat @Scouts Honor and @Husker_Du are all hardcore fundamentalists as they've been clear that there's nothing Israel can do to make them not support it. I don't have a problem with Israel killing all of Hamas' fighters. That's war. I do have a problem with levelling apartment buildings, hospitals, and universities because there *might* be some Hamas fighters inside when they *know* that there are tons of civilians. That's how you get a genocide charge. It was just a week or two ago that they did an air strike on international food workers because they thought they saw a Hamas fighter join the caravan even though they admitted they couldn't confirm it. That *suspicion* was justification enough for them to kill 7 international volunteers, including an American citizen, who they knew were innocent. That's not an acceptable way to carry out a just war. The "fundamentalists" on this forum don't want to engage in any nuance on the subject. They don't want to acknowledge that there is a way for Israel to carry out this war that would get far less criticism and kill far less people. They don't want to acknowledge that Israel isn't just doing this from self-defense and that they have ulterior motives *as any country would!*

most of the people dying are not in hamas. half of them are children. can you really not understand how someone could have empathy for innocent civilians caught in the middle of an awful conflict?