Gable Steveson

[GrandOlm]

This general sports transferability theory is nonsense. It only holds some truth in sports to the extent that the sport overlaps in the types of movements and actions performed. The only positions that correlate to a notable degree with wrestling are linemen (for heavyweights). Gable is short for a lineman, that's the only position he would be going for. Coon failed at it, why exactly would Gable be better? Just because he's a better wrestler?  

Karelin was unexceptional at multiple sports that he tried as a kid (and this is among just among normal local peers who were never on a pro track ) and I think he turned out to be pretty good at one sport in particular. 

[billyhoyle]

On 5/17/2024 at 10:07 AM, WrestlingRash said:

he would do great in MMA, but has no charisma. 

This is the real problem.  UFC has become an extension of WWE, so he may be forced to fight in Bellator for an extended period of time. 

[MadMardigain]

46 minutes ago, billyhoyle said:

This is the real problem.  UFC has become an extension of WWE, so he may be forced to fight in Bellator for an extended period of time. 

Same ownership group but ran separately. WWE executives likely made a decision to dropped him without any input from the ownership group.   

[headshuck]

If Michael Jordan struggled playing baseball…

[billyhoyle]

3 hours ago, MadMardigain said:

Same ownership group but ran separately. WWE executives likely made a decision to dropped him without any input from the ownership group.   

Why would they drop him without input from the UFC? If they thought he could be a star in UFC, they would have promoted him and not refused to put him on television for two years.  The reality is that UFC is no longer a sport in the same way it was 10-15 years ago-it's now more of a spectacle that is very close to WWE in how they promote fighters.  

[scourge165]

19 hours ago, headshuck said:

If Michael Jordan struggled playing baseball…

Jordan did struggle playing Baseball. No question about that. It was still pretty amazing what he did. The guy hadn't swung a bat in 15 years(lost his eligibility as a Sr because he played in the McDonalds AA game)...and he jumped in at AA, the level with the most talent and he was much better than I think most people would expect. He actually started to figure it out and hit over .250 in the Arizona Fall League(for those who aren't Baseball fans, that is a league for really good prospects to get more work...it's become watered down, but was even better when MJ played).

 

For perspective though, AA would be more like the SEC for Football and Jordan grew up playing the game. I didn't think Gable had played HS Football. 

 

He IS young enough that maybe he could learn all the intricacies of the game that we take for granted. The technique, working on the hands(Wrestling would help a great deal here). But he's just so short. I'm curious how long his arms are though. They look pretty long. It'd be fun to see IF he went for it IF he could play at Minnesota...provided he was granted a year of eligibility, but the chances of him becoming an NFL-caliber DL are tiny.

 

I'd like to see it though.

[billyhoyle]

26 minutes ago, scourge165 said:

Jordan did struggle playing Baseball. No question about that. It was still pretty amazing what he did. The guy hadn't swung a bat in 15 years(lost his eligibility as a Sr because he played in the McDonalds AA game)...and he jumped in at AA, the level with the most talent and he was much better than I think most people would expect. He actually started to figure it out and hit over .250 in the Arizona Fall League(for those who aren't Baseball fans, that is a league for really good prospects to get more work...it's become watered down, but was even better when MJ played).

 

For perspective though, AA would be more like the SEC for Football and Jordan grew up playing the game. I didn't think Gable had played HS Football. 

 

He IS young enough that maybe he could learn all the intricacies of the game that we take for granted. The technique, working on the hands(Wrestling would help a great deal here). But he's just so short. I'm curious how long his arms are though. They look pretty long. It'd be fun to see IF he went for it IF he could play at Minnesota...provided he was granted a year of eligibility, but the chances of him becoming an NFL-caliber DL are tiny.

 

I'd like to see it though.

Jordan is one of the greatest athletes of all time regardless of sport.  I would say it's surprising that he did not transition better to baseball than Tim Tebow did. 

[lisa morales]

Jordan was an awful baseball player.  The only reason he played for the White Sox minor league team was Jerry Reinsdorf owned the Bulls and White Sox.  Awkward doesn't begin to describe how he looked and played.

[scourge165]

10 minutes ago, billyhoyle said:

Jordan is one of the greatest athletes of all time regardless of sport.  I would say it's surprising that he did not transition better to baseball than Tim Tebow did. 

He might have...if he'd given it 4 years. Jordan came in cold, went right to AA and then back to Basketball.

Tebow got the same shit that Jordan did. How he didn't deserve the spot, it was PR, etc...but he ended up being pretty respectable in AA.

[scourge165]

1 minute ago, lisa morales said:

Jordan was an awful baseball player.  The only reason he played for the White Sox minor league team was Jerry Reinsdorf owned the Bulls and White Sox.  Awkward doesn't begin to describe how he looked and played.

No...that is not the only reason. Every single team in the league would have been tripping over themselves to give Jordan a chance.

He got a chance because he was the most recognizable athlete in the world.

And again, by the time the AZFL came around...what he was doing was impressive...relatively speaking.

[ionel]

18 minutes ago, billyhoyle said:

Jordan is one of the greatest athletes of all time regardless of sport.  I would say it's surprising that he did not transition better to baseball than Tim Tebow did. 

"Greatest athlete" you gotta be good in at least 2 sports like Bo Jackson or Deion Sanders but I'd bet there might be a 3 sport example even better.

[scourge165]

1 minute ago, ionel said:

"Greatest athlete" you gotta be good in at least 2 sports like Bo Jackson or Deion Sanders but I'd bet there might be a 3 sport example even better.

Is this the rule?

Also, he said ONE OF...the greatest athletes. 

[ionel]

Just now, scourge165 said:

Is this the rule?

Also, he said ONE OF...the greatest athletes. 

Well I wouldn't put him in "the greatest athletes" group cause he was only great in basketball ball, where is Ban?  

[AgaveMaria]

37 minutes ago, billyhoyle said:

Jordan is one of the greatest athletes of all time regardless of sport.  I would say it's surprising that he did not transition better to baseball than Tim Tebow did. 

You should have seen Wilt Chamberlain. Track & field to basketball to Hank Stram trying to sign him to play football for the Kansas City Chiefs. He tested well and Stram wanted to sign him but Wilt decided not to do it.

He was an amazing athlete.

------------------

""Greatest athlete" you gotta be good in at least 2 sports like Bo Jackson or Deion Sanders but I'd bet there might be a 3 sport example even better."

Try Otto Graham. Won a title as a Player for the Rochester Royals in Basketball before becoming a Pro Football Quarterback.

In Football his team played in the Title Game for Ten straight seasons.

Edited May 20 by AgaveMaria

[flyingcement]

37 minutes ago, ionel said:

"Greatest athlete" you gotta be good in at least 2 sports like Bo Jackson or Deion Sanders but I'd bet there might be a 3 sport example even better.

Jordan is a romanticized overrated player.  Jim Thorpe is the greatest American athlete in my opinion 

[Hammerlock3]

3 minutes ago, flyingcement said:

Jordan is a romanticized overrated player.  Jim Thorpe is the greatest American athlete in my opinion 

your opinion implies a lot of important questions about what "greatest athlete" means, as well as how much their cultural significance impacted this should matter, as well as how we should weigh cultural significance today vs when they were active.

[scourge165]

26 minutes ago, AgaveMaria said:

You should have seen Wilt Chamberlain. Track & field to basketball to Hank Stram trying to sign him to play football for the Kansas City Chiefs. He tested well and Stram wanted to sign him but Wilt decided not to do it.

He was an amazing athlete.

------------------

""Greatest athlete" you gotta be good in at least 2 sports like Bo Jackson or Deion Sanders but I'd bet there might be a 3 sport example even better."

Try Otto Graham. Won a title as a Player for the Rochester Royals in Basketball before becoming a Pro Football Quarterback.

In Football his team played in the Title Game for Ten straight seasons.

I was going to mention Wilt. He was a freak(in more ways than one). But the wasn't he the NCAA Champ in the 400 High Hurdles...among other accomplishments?

The Volleyball league...

 

Otto Graham is a great one. Thorpe. 

 

BUT...I don't ascribe to the multi-sport participation to be considered great. Lets talk about the greatest Female athlete. Is anyone more athletic than Simone Biles? Does she really need to participate in track to prove that? 

Or sooo many Wrestlers?

[scourge165]

19 minutes ago, flyingcement said:

Jordan is a romanticized overrated player.  Jim Thorpe is the greatest American athlete in my opinion 

Ok...I get this isn't a Basketball Forum and there are plenty who think BB players need to be mortal enemies with Wrestlers...but in what world was MJ overrated? 

[flyingcement]

2 minutes ago, scourge165 said:

Ok...I get this isn't a Basketball Forum and there are plenty who think BB players need to be mortal enemies with Wrestlers...but in what world was MJ overrated? 

I think he benefitted from being the best player in the league at a time when the league was growing in terms of number of followers, revenue, and while advertising opportunities were becoming much more significant. Iverson had similar level of cultural significance as Jordan, perhaps more since Jordan has a bland personality.  

[Hammerlock3]

2 minutes ago, scourge165 said:

Ok...I get this isn't a Basketball Forum and there are plenty who think BB players need to be mortal enemies with Wrestlers...but in what world was MJ overrated? 

I assume the argument would start with pointing out that he had unbelievable support from his teammates and coaches. Sort of the opposite of how Walter Johnson would be regarded if he hadn't played for the senators.

in jordans defence, his importance isn't inflated heavily by what I referred to as cultural significance. By comparison Muhammad Ali was a great athlete whose remains an icon based on his time and place in history.

[scourge165]

Just now, flyingcement said:

I think he benefitted from being the best player in the league at a time when the league was growing in terms of number of followers, revenue, and while advertising opportunities were becoming much more significant. Iverson had similar level of cultural significance as Jordan, perhaps more since Jordan has a bland personality.  

Ok...I mean, there was a entire campaign "Be like Mike," and a shoe brand that's made tens of billions. He was also the biggest(as in most well known) athlete in the entire world.

But more importantly...he won. 

I guess we're talking about different metrics, but I can't see how AI had a bigger impact in any regard. He was great, but...I just don't see it. Not on the level of Mike.

He had a bland personality when he played. At least publicly. The Last Dance I thought took some of the blandness out of his personality, but I guess we'll agree to disagree. 

[ionel]

6 minutes ago, scourge165 said:

He was also the biggest(as in most well known) athlete in the entire world. 

You talking about Pele now?  

[billyhoyle]

1 hour ago, ionel said:

"Greatest athlete" you gotta be good in at least 2 sports like Bo Jackson or Deion Sanders but I'd bet there might be a 3 sport example even better.

I am sure Jordan could have been a great football player or world class high jumper.  Jordan was a better athlete than Deion Sanders.  I'd say Bo was more versatile since he was elite at two different sports, but was never as good at a single sport as Jordan was at basketball. 

1 hour ago, AgaveMaria said:

You should have seen Wilt Chamberlain. Track & field to basketball to Hank Stram trying to sign him to play football for the Kansas City Chiefs. He tested well and Stram wanted to sign him but Wilt decided not to do it.

He was an amazing athlete.

------------------

""Greatest athlete" you gotta be good in at least 2 sports like Bo Jackson or Deion Sanders but I'd bet there might be a 3 sport example even better."

Try Otto Graham. Won a title as a Player for the Rochester Royals in Basketball before becoming a Pro Football Quarterback.

In Football his team played in the Title Game for Ten straight seasons.

Yeah Chamberlain is great too.  

[scourge165]

1 hour ago, ionel said:

You talking about Pele now?  

No...if I was talking about Pele, I'd have at any point mentioned Pele.

I'm talking about Jordan. Particularly during the Dream Team era. 

Jordan was probably thee biggest reason why the NBA grew internationally the way it did. 

[RockLobster]

2 hours ago, ionel said:

Well I wouldn't put him in "the greatest athletes" group cause he was only great in basketball ball, where is Ban?  

Ban was banned from this forum... this time "permanent."

'Ban basketball' was a clever forum name. Showed his sense of humor. But in reality, he actually played basketball.