Is Iowa City still the wrestling epicenter of America?

[flyingcement]

Lehigh Valley has always been the capital of the wrestling world

[PortaJohn]

4 hours ago, Jason Bryant said:

Who is going to be the ones to pressure their CVBs and Sports Commissions to at least raise their hand and say "Hey, how about us?" State chapters? State chairs. There hasn't been an answer to the riddle. I know MN/USAW and Wisconsin have two of the best organizations in terms of volume of people to work and staff events from tappers to table workers. Madison drew OK for Trials in the past. I'd love something up here in the Twin Cities but you've got TWO venues of ample size (Xcel and Target). I'm working on putting an event in 3,500-seat Roy Wilkins Auditorium (got bumped in 2023 for roller derby). 

Personally, I think New Jersey has a lot of options that make sense. Costs are considerably higher in NY/NJ and other union towns. Newark's Prudential Center is AWESOME, but it's Newark. Ain't much around the arena that doesn't scream at people from outside of the tri-state area. 

Perhaps the new Mullett Arena in Tempe might work. It seats 5,000. Home to the Coyotes (for the time being) and Arizona State wrestling and ice hockey. 

From the Iowa question asked originally ... Iowa Hawkeye wrestling fans show out, for Iowa Hawkeye Wrestling. 

What about the Palestra in Philly.  I know it's old and dingy but man does it have an aura about it.   

[ionel]

14 minutes ago, PortaJohn said:

What about the Palestra in Philly.  I know it's old and dingy but man does it have an aura about it.   

Well sure but a portajohn has a certain aura about it, doesn't mean we want to hang out in one all day.  

[CementMixer]

On 12/14/2022 at 9:15 AM, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Factoring in college wrestling (both men and women's), freestyle and greco?

It never was in the first place. Pennsylvania is the Mecca of wrestling and always has been...

[Wrestleknownothing]

26 minutes ago, CementMixer said:

It never was in the first place. Pennsylvania is the Mecca of wrestling and always has been...

And yet IL has more than double the number of starters in the B1G than PA though they have the same population.

And IN has more starters in the B1G than PA though they have just over half the population.

[wrestlingphish]

On 12/14/2022 at 4:50 PM, Jason Bryant said:

 

From the Iowa question asked originally ... Iowa Hawkeye wrestling fans show out, for Iowa Hawkeye Wrestling. 

As someone who lives in Iowa this is absolutely true but to call what USA wrestling does to promote these events as 'marketing' is a big ole LOL. Throw a sign up, throw some social media ads out there, and then complain when the fans don't open their wallets and spend another $1000 on a weekend of wrestling. 

Regardless of location and terrible marketing strategy, USA Wrestling shouldn't be bitching about fans not showing up when our top athletes don't even care to compete domestically outside of OTT/WTT.

PS, the format of the World Cup is terrible. 8 hours of duals for two days straight isn't a format to draw crowds.

[bnwtwg]

16 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

And IN has more starters in the B1G than PA though they have just over half the population.

*Northwest Chicago has more starters in the B1G than PA though they have just over half the population

[bnwtwg]

Just now, bnwtwg said:

*Northwest Chicago has more starters in the B1G than PA though they have just over half the population

And anyone want to take a guess where Gable Steveson is from and his original kids club? I'll give a hint: 3 brothers/5 NCAA titles/1 world medal

[Gus]

41 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

And anyone want to take a guess where Gable Steveson is from and his original kids club? I'll give a hint: 3 brothers/5 NCAA titles/1 world medal

Illinois - Williams brothers?

[Cherkov]

On 12/14/2022 at 1:37 PM, Jason Bryant said:

Doesn't matter where you put this. No one will show up. The bid thing is about 90% legitimate. You don't just show up and put something someplace that doesn't want it. I'm trying to host an event and the sports commission here in St. Paul has moving parts, moving dates, other tenants and also adminstrative changover. That's in addition to the issues we have in the sport. Can you put something in a place where the CVB and sports commission doesn't bid? Sure, if you can find a venue that will take you, but you'll lose even more money. Iowa City's CVB puts effort into these events. But in the U.S., we are ALWAYS going to find an excuse not to show up. 

@BAC, your points are valid, but we STILL have to contend with ourselves. We are the most excuse-filled, complaint-ridden fanbase when it comes to these types of things.  We show up to ONE event. I mean, there's only been 102 dual meets in the history of collegiate wrestling that have drawn over 10,000 people and of those 102, 77 have been in either Iowa City, Ames or Cedar Falls. What will WE finally do to show up? Every date one of us picks, another will have a problem with it. The 80 D1 coaches can't get on the same page about anything, so how do we expect thousands of fans from around the country. 

Let's also not confuse the fact Penn State wrestling fans are Penn State wrestling fans and not necessarily wrestling fans first. Iowa Hawkeye wrestling fans show out for Iowa Hawkeye wrestling, they don't for much of anything else. 

The Big Ten tournament gets good crowds, but that's again, tied to the best conference with the most success and the two most adoring fanbases from an attendance standpoint. 

There's zero team element in senior-level wrestling. No one "went" to Titan Mercury. If they aren't currently wearing the colors of said school, they might as well be sitting in the bar with the rest of us. 

Sorry, just venting - and it's not at you. I just get frustrated as much as everyone else does. I don't know the answer, but a lot of it is us. The diehards here aren't the issue. We want to go. We want to find ways to attend. Like many, I'm married with kids. I live and breathe this stuff, but I don't get to the U.S. Open in Vegas unless I'm hired to go. I lose money for a week-long event. Or even a weekend event. That's our reality too. Those who love this sport aren't flush with cash and we're usually in gyms locally. 

There's no perfect answer. I share your frustration. I also know from the other side of it - there is a lot of thought that goes into WHERE to host events. You take a chance by putting them in places you know wrestling fans ARE, but if they show up, that's another thing. 

... now I'm ranting and off topic ... and frustrated still! Baku for the Greco World Cup was a small venue, but the place was full, loud and boisterous. On Sunday, there should have been a full arena in Coralville. There is zero high school wrestling going on. 

Bah. 

People are more likely to attend things that they were either formerly involved in (college wrestling) or have a strong connection to like being alums of the same institution. 

No one wrestled at the senior level. And they're just individuals outside of the Olympics and maybe (maybe) Worlds where they take on a national representative function. 

Even in the greco Baku example that world cup field did not have close to world championship level strength, all star team or not. I doubt the in arena fans cared (or knew in many cases). More like, here's this event lets go and be patriotic, cheer, have some fun type of mindset. 

[CementMixer]

22 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

And yet IL has more than double the number of starters in the B1G than PA though they have the same population.

And IN has more starters in the B1G than PA though they have just over half the population.

And PA has more wrestlers in the NCAA tournament every year. 

[Wrestleknownothing]

6 minutes ago, CementMixer said:

And PA has more wrestlers in the NCAA tournament every year. 

I am going to guess you don't have the numbers to back that up or you would have shared them.

[PortaJohn]

28 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

I am going to guess you don't have the numbers to back that up or you would have shared them.

This may be true.  I know PA produces more All Americans than any other state and NCAA champs too.  Link from 2011 but nothing has changed.  Honestly, if you didn't already know what every wrestling fan has known for decades you truly know nothing.  Pennsylvania is the best.  

http://mwolverine.com/Top_Wrestling_States.html

Edited December 17, 2022 by PortaJohn

[GreatWhiteNorth]

On 12/14/2022 at 1:37 PM, Jason Bryant said:

... On Sunday, there should have been a full arena in Coralville. There is zero high school wrestling going on. 

High school wrestling / college wrestling / int'l wrestling - there is a tremendous disconnect between them.

 

 

 

[Wrestleknownothing]

36 minutes ago, PortaJohn said:

This may be true.  I know PA produces more All Americans than any other state and NCAA champs too.  Link from 2011 but nothing has changed.  Honestly, if you didn't already know what every wrestling fan has known for decades you truly know nothing.  Pennsylvania is the best.  

http://mwolverine.com/Top_Wrestling_States.html

How do you know nothing has changed? The data from 1928 to 1960 looks very different than the data from 1961 to 2011. Why can't things be different still 11 years later?

[Le duke]

How do you know nothing has changed? The data from 1928 to 1960 looks very different than the data from 1961 to 2011. Why can't things be different still 11 years later?

PA puts a beating on everyone in terms of NQs and AAs.


Flo does the numbers every year:

https://www.flowrestling.org/articles/7618849-2022-ncaa-championships-by-the-numbers

2022: PA most AAs and NQs
2021: PA most AAs and NQs


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[PortaJohn]

46 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

How do you know nothing has changed? The data from 1928 to 1960 looks very different than the data from 1961 to 2011. Why can't things be different still 11 years later?

Because for the last 11 years Pennsylvania and New Jersey have dominated NCAA's.  I dont know why this is even being debated.  Everyone knows this.  Did NJDan hijack your account?

Edited December 17, 2022 by PortaJohn

[Wrestleknownothing]

27 minutes ago, PortaJohn said:

Because for the last 11 years Pennsylvania and New Jersey have dominated NCAA's.  I dont know why this is even being debated.  Everyone knows this.  Did NJDan hijack your account?

Whoa, what is with the crap slinging? Oh, yeah.

I asked for data and when you provided it I said thanks. Dan would have said "if true".

[Jason Bryant]

8 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Whoa, what is with the crap slinging? Oh, yeah.

I asked for data and when you provided it I said thanks. Dan would have said "if true".

If true.