Wyatt Hendrickson of Air Force is flying along (well below the Hodge radar)

[Jim L]

Hodge voters seems to loosely follow the criteria and bend it where it makes sense. To not give it to Gable becasue he was not a pinner would be wrong. He was the best college wrestler and the most dominnat Heavy that I have ever seen.

The award is largely known as wrestling's Heisman and that is how the voters seem to treat it. In general, it seems to work

[TylerDurden]

6 hours ago, SocraTease said:

There are lots of problems with the Hodge voting.

A guy can take an early or unusual loss and, yes, actually still be the best NCAA wrestler.  Guys get caught or have a bad day or are sick or injured.  That should be considered.  If, for example, Brooks took an early loss in the season but came back to dominate should he be excluded from consideration? I say "no".

The Hodge voting, like most of America, has this terrible tendency toward "purity" -- no losses with close wins and a weak division or schedule is construed as better than complete dominance over an entire season against great opponents ... with the possible exception of, say, one loss against a good opponent (or even moving up a weight for the team).

The Hodge voting committee should clarify whether All Star matches count or not.   A decision might affect ome of the best wrestlers who might elect not to wrestle those matches if they aren't ready or fear a loss.   It can encourage avoidance.  And is bad for the sport.

The current Hodge procedures seem to discourage guys and teams from moving up a weight during a dual to win.  That used to be an exciting element of wrestling.  

The long and short: take into consideration the important variables.  Yes, criteria for the Hodge matter greatly, but make them (a) as clear as possible (prioritize the order or make them weighted as a percentage) and (b) make them reflect the reality of the sport  "on the ground" so as to encourage competition rather than reflect narrow statistical goals or largely subjective, popular, fan-based voting. 

If this is simply about awarding the Hodge to the best wrestler, then this thread is pointless. Hendrickson isn't the best NCAA wrestler. 

[TylerDurden]

13 hours ago, SocraTease said:

I'm curious why Wyatt Hendrickson isn't being talked about and isn't even included in some of the Hodge rankings (e.g., FLO).  

 

Here are the Hodge criteria from the NCAA wrestling website:

 

Originally created to celebrate the pin in college wrestling, the Dan Hodge Trophy is based on seven criteria including record, number of pins, dominance, past credentials, quality of competition, sportsmanship/citizenship and heart. The trophy is based primarily on the results of a single season, but past accomplishments are considered as well, particularly in years where the competition is tighter. 

 

Hendrickson is 19-0.  

 

He has an 89% bonus rate. 

 

He leads the NCAA Division I in pins again this year. It's something like 15 and counting.  He's also won the Schalles Award for most pins the last two years, and he will likely win it again.  None of the other Hodge candidates are even close to those number of pins. He was the most dominant wrestler statistically the last two years and will probably be so this year.

 

He won the U23 Worlds at 125K in fall 2023. Last season, he was 31-2 and only lost to the NCAA champ and runner up.  The prior seasons he was 26-2.

 

Yes, he was hammered by Kerkviliet at the All Star match (while likely injured), but I don't believe that counts for Hodge.  

 

On sheer statistical evidence, a case could even be made that he should be ranked first.

 

And, no I don't expect him to win 285, but the guy's numbers are impressive.  If somehow he would win out he has to be in the Hodge conversation.

He's in the conversation. I'm not sure why you keep acting like he's not. 

[bnwtwg]

 If you look at the U23 worlds thread I believe I said something to the effect of "Hendrickson is going to win NCAAs. All aboard the Hendrickson train choo choo!"

Then it came out that his knee was ripped up winning that world gold. Then he decided to let the VA take care of his knee later in life. Then Kerk went full-on Hulk Smash at the all star event.

Is Hendrickson dominating even on a bum knee? Yes. Do I want him to win because he is the smoothest technician heavyweight has seen since Gwiz? Yes. Does he have a snowflake's chance in hell of winning a Hodge? Absolutely not.

[1032004]

21 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

 If you look at the U23 worlds thread I believe I said something to the effect of "Hendrickson is going to win NCAAs. All aboard the Hendrickson train choo choo!"

Then it came out that his knee was ripped up winning that world gold. Then he decided to let the VA take care of his knee later in life. Then Kerk went full-on Hulk Smash at the all star event.

Is Hendrickson dominating even on a bum knee? Yes. Do I want him to win because he is the smoothest technician heavyweight has seen since Gwiz? Yes. Does he have a snowflake's chance in hell of winning a Hodge? Absolutely not.

Are you really just saying he “doesn’t have a snowflake’s chance in hell” of beating Kerk? 

I’d give him a “snowflake’s chance” of doing that.  Which if so, would give him a slightly bigger (but still small, due to the presence of Brooks & Kerk) chance of winning the Hodge

Edited February 21 by 1032004

[bnwtwg]

30 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Are you really just saying he “doesn’t have a snowflake’s chance in hell” of beating Kerk? 

I’d give him a “snowflake’s chance” of doing that.  Which if so, would give him a slightly bigger (but still small, due to the presence of Brooks & Kerk) chance of winning the Hodge

Of beating Kerk? Yes. Did you not read the part that says

52 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

Does he have a snowflake's chance in hell of winning a Hodge? Absolutely not.

 

[1032004]

3 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

Of beating Kerk? Yes. Did you not read the part that says

 

That’s different than the OP though, which seems to be complaining about “Hodge rankings” which shouldn’t factor in their likelihood of finishing the season undefeated.

My earlier comment was if those are Flo’s Hodge rankings, they may be considering the All-Star as a loss for Hendrickson

[bnwtwg]

5 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

That’s different than the OP though, which seems to be complaining about “Hodge rankings” which shouldn’t factor in their likelihood of finishing the season undefeated.

My earlier comment was if those are Flo’s Hodge rankings, they may be considering the All-Star as a loss for Hendrickson

Ahh got it, I was just answering your direct question. OP is technically correct but wrong in practicallity. Hendrickson would have to pin/tech everyone including Kerk to have even been considered this year, and at that point he still would have been a finalist at best. Brand value and strength of competition means something in Hodge voter's eyes and this year's 285 crop + Air Force schedule doesn't carry enough weight, though that is no fault of Hendrickson's other than choosing to enlist in the first place.

[Wrestleknownothing]

14 hours ago, SocraTease said:

I'm curious why Wyatt Hendrickson isn't being talked about and isn't even included in some of the Hodge rankings (e.g., FLO).  

 

Here are the Hodge criteria from the NCAA wrestling website:

 

Originally created to celebrate the pin in college wrestling, the Dan Hodge Trophy is based on seven criteria including record, number of pins, dominance, past credentials, quality of competition, sportsmanship/citizenship and heart. The trophy is based primarily on the results of a single season, but past accomplishments are considered as well, particularly in years where the competition is tighter. 

 

Hendrickson is 19-0.  

 

He has an 89% bonus rate. 

 

He leads the NCAA Division I in pins again this year. It's something like 15 and counting.  He's also won the Schalles Award for most pins the last two years, and he will likely win it again.  None of the other Hodge candidates are even close to those number of pins. He was the most dominant wrestler statistically the last two years and will probably be so this year.

 

He won the U23 Worlds at 125K in fall 2023. Last season, he was 31-2 and only lost to the NCAA champ and runner up.  The prior seasons he was 26-2.

 

Yes, he was hammered by Kerkviliet at the All Star match (while likely injured), but I don't believe that counts for Hodge.  

 

On sheer statistical evidence, a case could even be made that he should be ranked first.

 

And, no I don't expect him to win 285, but the guy's numbers are impressive.  If somehow he would win out he has to be in the Hodge conversation.

BTW, SocraTease does make an excellent point about Flo's Hodge watch list. It is absurd that Hendrickson is not on the list. But is it?

Record is a factor and officially Hendrickson is undefeated. But as Rader points out in his article, since the Hodge is now based on a broad vote, voters have a tendency to not ignore the results of the All-Star Classic. So, strike one.

That said, based on just D1 official matches he would probably be top of their list. He is currently fourth on Wrestlestat's list (which uses completely different criteria).

But, all Hendrickson needs to do, apparently, is win a title to become a Hodge finalist. Last year all 10 titlists were finalists, even though three of them had a loss (Diakomihalis, Arujau, Brooks) and one of them had two losses (O'Toole).

[1032004]

43 minutes ago, bnwtwg said:

Ahh got it, I was just answering your direct question. OP is technically correct but wrong in practicallity. Hendrickson would have to pin/tech everyone including Kerk to have even been considered this year, and at that point he still would have been a finalist at best. Brand value and strength of competition means something in Hodge voter's eyes and this year's 285 crop + Air Force schedule doesn't carry enough weight, though that is no fault of Hendrickson's other than choosing to enlist in the first place.

I think this is pretty much the same as the Hidlay thread.  “People aren’t talking about” them potentially winning the Hodge, because they are huge underdogs to even win their weight, which is a prerequisite for winning the Hodge

[bnwtwg]

9 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

I think this is pretty much the same as the Hidlay thread.  “People aren’t talking about” them potentially winning the Hodge, because they are huge underdogs to even win their weight, which is a prerequisite for winning the Hodge

Correct. I appreciate the shine on people outside of Penn State athletes, but it's just not realistic. Great for shooting the breeze in between rounds at the bar though!

[JimmyCinnabon]

If Hendrickson goes undefeated and wins the title then he will certainly be in the conversation for Hodge. I don't think he can beat Kerk but if he does then he will get his due.

[VakAttack]

This is really simple.  Why isn't Wyatt Hendrickson getting buzz for the Hodge?

We all saw him get shoved in a locker.  Even if he avenges that loss, it happened, and is likely disqualifying, unless the other dominant guys eventually lose.

[Idaho]

5 hours ago, TylerDurden said:

He's in the conversation. I'm not sure why you keep acting like he's not. 

Because Flo says so.... but Wrestlestat has him #4. That's in the conversation. 

[VakAttack]

16 minutes ago, Idaho said:

Because Flo says so.... but Wrestlestat has him #4. That's in the conversation. 

WrestleStat doesn't include the All-Star, but there's nothing precluding Hodge voters from considering it (and they should).

[PotentiallyDan]

Do we know what the extent of the knee injury was/is?  Is Wyatt now healthy?  I do believe at 100% he has greater than a snowflakes chance in hell of beating Kerk.  

[Iwrite]

Some backgorund on the Div. 3 wrestler with losses. And by the way, Dan Hodge himself was 100 pecent in favor of honorirng Nick Ackerman in this fashion, as was Olympic champion Randy Lewis (read his comments below)::

BUT WHILE SANDERSON was destroying the record books in Ames, 60 miles to the south, a story of equal impact was taking place. On the campus of Simpson College, in Indianola, another wrestler was also making history….in a far different fashion and with staggering emotional impact.
Nick Ackerman was inflicted with spinal meningitis as a young boy and both legs had to be amputated below the knees to save his life. Yet by showing determination and courage which outstrips anything ever seen before in the 73-year history of NCAA wrestling, he won the 174-pound national championship at the Division III tournament in Waterloo, IA. And he did it by defeating defending national champion Nick Slack of Augsburg, who was riding a 60-match winning streak of his own!
The 3,000 fans in Young Arena responded by a prolonged two-minute standing ovation to show their respect for what had just been accomplished.
Ackerman finished his senior season with a 38-4 record, 13 of which were pins.
“The story of Nick Ackerman has uplifted the entire sport,” said Randy Lewis, 1984 Olympic champion. “When I read about it, I got emotional. I started calling people and saying, ‘Have you read this story?’ What other sport could do this for an athlete? Wrestling should be so proud of this guy. I’ve never seen anything like it. It’s the best story of the year…of the decade…maybe ever….in wrestling history. Someone should make a movie of it!”
“I never even dreamed about winning the Hodge Trophy. I don’t put myself in that class. It’s so overwhelming that I can’t put it into words,” said Ackerman when told of the award. “This has been the most unbelievable year of my life.”

[jchapman]

4 minutes ago, Iwrite said:

Some backgorund on the Div. 3 wrestler with losses. And by the way, Dan Hodge himself was 100 pecent in favor of honorirng Nick Ackerman in this fashion, as was Olympic champion Randy Lewis (read his comments below)::

BUT WHILE SANDERSON was destroying the record books in Ames, 60 miles to the south, a story of equal impact was taking place. On the campus of Simpson College, in Indianola, another wrestler was also making history….in a far different fashion and with staggering emotional impact.
Nick Ackerman was inflicted with spinal meningitis as a young boy and both legs had to be amputated below the knees to save his life. Yet by showing determination and courage which outstrips anything ever seen before in the 73-year history of NCAA wrestling, he won the 174-pound national championship at the Division III tournament in Waterloo, IA. And he did it by defeating defending national champion Nick Slack of Augsburg, who was riding a 60-match winning streak of his own!
The 3,000 fans in Young Arena responded by a prolonged two-minute standing ovation to show their respect for what had just been accomplished.
Ackerman finished his senior season with a 38-4 record, 13 of which were pins.
“The story of Nick Ackerman has uplifted the entire sport,” said Randy Lewis, 1984 Olympic champion. “When I read about it, I got emotional. I started calling people and saying, ‘Have you read this story?’ What other sport could do this for an athlete? Wrestling should be so proud of this guy. I’ve never seen anything like it. It’s the best story of the year…of the decade…maybe ever….in wrestling history. Someone should make a movie of it!”
“I never even dreamed about winning the Hodge Trophy. I don’t put myself in that class. It’s so overwhelming that I can’t put it into words,” said Ackerman when told of the award. “This has been the most unbelievable year of my life.”

Nick Ackerman is an inspiration, I am glad he won the Hodge.  What he did borders on heroic. 

[SocraTease]

39 minutes ago, jchapman said:

Nick Ackerman is an inspiration, I am glad he won the Hodge.  What he did borders on heroic. 

Here's a video of Ackerman wrestling:

 

[Idaho]

2 hours ago, VakAttack said:

WrestleStat doesn't include the All-Star, but there's nothing precluding Hodge voters from considering it (and they should).

The good old "Does the All-Star Count? " discussion.  The real criteria should be if they can crush an apple in their hand. Let's separate the men from the boys. 

[Idaho]

1 hour ago, jchapman said:

Nick Ackerman is an inspiration, I am glad he won the Hodge.  What he did borders on heroic. 

So did Anthony Robles... he won a D1 title in dominating fashion... what's the difference here?  Just goes to show it's hard to get a leg up on the competition.  

I will see myself out now. 

[jchapman]

9 minutes ago, Idaho said:

So did Anthony Robles... he won a D1 title in dominating fashion... what's the difference here?  Just goes to show it's hard to get a leg up on the competition.  

I will see myself out now. 

I've wondered for years why Robles didn't win the Hodge.  He beat a returning (and future) Champ in the finals.

[Idaho]

25 minutes ago, jchapman said:

I've wondered for years why Robles didn't win the Hodge.  He beat a returning (and future) Champ in the finals.

I think Burroughs won it that year. I believe he finished around 3rd or 4th. Very well deserving and dominated in the finals. 

[MPhillips]

1 hour ago, Idaho said:

Just goes to show it's hard to get a leg up on the competition.  

[lu_alum]

2 hours ago, Idaho said:

The good old "Does the All-Star Count? " discussion.  The real criteria should be if they can crush an apple in their hand. Let's separate the men from the boys. 

Apple's... that's nothing.  Not a Hodge candidate... but it was a shame this guy's career was cut short.

https://www.flowrestling.org/video/5143566-strongest-high-school-wrestler

Opponents definitely wanted to stay away from his 3/4 Nelson.

Edited February 22 by lu_alum