The Iowa Grinders, not a good look at all

[AgaveMaria]

Watched Iowa at Penn. One Iowa wrestler showed well at 165. Transfer from NoDak State. Good attacks and finishing and then kept it up.

Most others were score and stall, or close things by preventing scoring while on the edge of stalling.

Woods looked tough but should have been called for stalling with his 'whap the head and keep away' stall tactics.

Iowa won. Did not put out all its best so that factors in. But the "Iowa Style" is an embarassing example from a once dominant program.

The idea that they can be good with NitLion and Cowboy transfers is hopeless.

Yes, they are good.., but nowhere near Good Enough.

Edited December 8, 2023 by AgaveMaria

[Jimmy Cinnabon]

Iowa is one Penn State injury away from making it a real race at NCAAs...

Edited December 8, 2023 by Jimmy Cinnabon

[Wrestleknownothing]

3 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Iowa is one Penn State injury away from making it a real race at NCAAs...

Right now they are one NC State and one Missouri injury away from challenging for second. They are still that plus three or four more Penn State injuries away from challenging for first.

[Jimmy Cinnabon]

6 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Right now they are one NC State and one Missouri injury away from challenging for second. They are still that plus three or four more Penn State injuries away from challenging for first.

Depends on who...but say Starocci or Brooks is lost for the year.  And Iowa gets all the Ferraris in the garage plus Keuter...

[MLB9]

37 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Depends on who...but say Starocci or Brooks is lost for the year.  And Iowa gets all the Ferraris in the garage plus Keuter...

Oh so one injury AND a number of hopeful hypotheticals? What else would they need? Keep going.

[KLCarnegieTech_1969]

THE IOWA GRINDERS: Penn is tough.  They draw kids from Central PA, Eastern PA, Delbarton, Blair and elsewhere.    As far as Iowa goes, if they weren't getting portal transfers and previous blue chip recruits from Western PA (Spenser Lee, Austin De Santo, Michael Kemerer, Max Murin  and Kaleb Young),  I'm not sure they are competing for a team trophy at NCAAs.

Edited December 8, 2023 by KLCarnegieTech_1969
Amending contribution

[ionel]

39 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Depends on who...but say Starocci or Brooks is lost for the year.  And Iowa gets all the Ferraris in the garage plus Keuter...

... and they blowup the program early March?  

[Wrestleknownothing]

9 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Depends on who...but say Starocci or Brooks is lost for the year.  And Iowa gets all the Ferraris in the garage plus Keuter...

So what you meant to say was one Penn State injury plus 30% of Iowa being replaced, which is different than Iowa. 

OK, let's say we replace 30% of Iowa. Right now Iowa is looking at a 58 point deficit to Penn State if you assume Penn State scores zero at 149 (maybe, maybe not). 

What is realistic for Anthony Ferrari? Probably low AA at the highest. Call it 6th to 8th. Why? He was 23rd on the 2022 Big Board. Between 2013 and 2021 there were 45 guys between 21 and 25 on the Big Board, and in their 165 cumulative seasons they have 22 AA's. So call it a 13% to AA (and that is generous given that most of the 22 AAs happened after their first season). So, roughly 7 or 8 points max. The deficit is now 50.

What is realistic for AJ? On the plus side, he has a title under his belt. On the minus side, he has not wrestled in years, he is not enrolled, and he is reported to be much heavier than 197. So call him 0 to 20 points. Who knows? Now the deficit is 30 with some very rosy assumptions.

What is realistic for Kueter? Kueter comes in as a top 10 BB (#6), and these guys tend to have monster careers. Among these 90 athletes there are 9 who won it as freshmen. Of course, none of them skipped first semester in the room, but whatever. Let's say he has a 10% chance to win it all, he also has a 30% chance of never AAing (as has happened with 18 of the 60 who have finished their career). Is third a realistic ceiling? Not likely, but sure. That cuts the deficit to 17.

With a Brooks or Starocci injury now we are even.

All it took was to assume three wrestlers who are not currently part of the team (two not even enrolled in school), one of whom is actually practicing a different sport, to maximize their potential ALL AT THE SAME TIME (which is? an Iowa trait at NCAA's), and an injury to one of two specific wrestlers.

Well, you have me convinced.

[Idaho]

53 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Depends on who...but say Starocci or Brooks is lost for the year.  And Iowa gets all the Ferraris in the garage plus Keuter...

Last I heard they had good backups as well. 

[ionel]

7 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

 

What is realistic for Kueter? Kueter comes in as a top 10 BB (#6), and these guys tend to have monster careers.

But at HWT?  Fr HWTs rarely do well, sure there have been a couple exception but those guys were very special. 

[Wrestleknownothing]

5 minutes ago, ionel said:

But at HWT?  Fr HWTs rarely do well, sure there have been a couple exception but those guys were very special. 

None of the freshmen heavies won their freshman year, but you have guys like Steveson, Snyder, Parris, and Coon in the group. That is why I assumed a ceiling of third.

[Hammerlock3]

I feel like the iowa style was born of an era when  not everyone was in shape. nowadays it seems like you break people with scoring not fatigue.

[ionel]

4 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

None of the freshmen heavies won their freshman year, but you have guys like Steveson, Snyder, Parris, and Coon in the group. That is why I assumed a ceiling of third.

I think 3rd is a major reach for Fr football player,  just AA/r12 maybe reasonable for an untested Fr.   Don't give Jimmy points he can't earn. 

[flyingcement]

1 hour ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

Depends on who...but say Starocci or Brooks is lost for the year.  And Iowa gets all the Ferraris in the garage plus Keuter...

Even then, Penn State expects to win by more than double.  In fact many are saying that if Penn State does not at least have double the points of the second place team, it will be considered a major disappointment, and Cael could be on the hot seat.

[Le duke]

Depends on who...but say Starocci or Brooks is lost for the year.  And Iowa gets all the Ferraris in the garage plus Keuter...

The youngest is a senior in high school who would be curb stomped by the top 10 guys at 165.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Hammerlock3]

6 minutes ago, flyingcement said:

Even then, Penn State expects to win by more than double.  In fact many are saying that if Penn State does not at least have double the points of the second place team, it will be considered a major disappointment, and Cael could be on the hot seat.

this post makes me imagine cinnabon ultimate mightmare, waking up dystopian world where he has to wonder around like patrick swayze in ghost because everyone is idiot PSU Homer.

[Hammerlock3]

2 minutes ago, Le duke said:

The youngest is a senior in high school who would be curb stomped by the top 10 guys at 165.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

no he's really good. took me awhile to notice because of the BS posturing and drama. If it was purely about skill PSU would be all over angelo.

Edited December 8, 2023 by Hammerlock3

[Offthemat]

7 minutes ago, Hammerlock3 said:

this post makes me imagine cinnabon ultimate mightmare, waking up dystopian world where he has to wonder around like patrick swayze in ghost because everyone is idiot PSU Homer.

We could use you over on the Crooham thread. 

[ionel]

16 minutes ago, flyingcement said:

Even then, Penn State expects to win by more than double.  In fact many are saying that if Penn State does not at least have double the points of the second place team, it will be considered a major disappointment, and Cael could be on the hot seat.

Fly has already guaranteed the double, no need to fear the underdog!

[Dogbone]

5 minutes ago, Hammerlock3 said:

I feel like the iowa style was born of an era when  not everyone was in shape. nowadays it seems like you break people with scoring not fatigue.

The Iowa Style was fatiguing and scoring on guys with a high offensive pace.  Guys didn't just get fatigued because they were pushed to the edge of the mat while the crown yelled "Stalling".

No one, including Iowa, really wrestles like that any more. Better defense and scrambling have made points more of a premium so guys are more reluctant to be overly aggressive. 

I don't think its a failure of a certain style but more the evolution of the sport.

[Dogbone]

PSU is still closer to breaking the scoring record than Iowa is to beating PSU at NCAAs. 

[jchapman]

29 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

None of the freshmen heavies won their freshman year, but you have guys like Steveson, Snyder, Parris, and Coon in the group. That is why I assumed a ceiling of third.

Dick Hutton won Heavyweight as a true freshman.

[Gus]

47 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

So what you meant to say was one Penn State injury plus 30% of Iowa being replaced, which is different than Iowa. 

OK, let's say we replace 30% of Iowa. Right now Iowa is looking at a 58 point deficit to Penn State if you assume Penn State scores zero at 149 (maybe, maybe not). 

What is realistic for Anthony Ferrari? Probably low AA at the highest. Call it 6th to 8th. Why? He was 23rd on the 2022 Big Board. Between 2013 and 2021 there were 45 guys between 21 and 25 on the Big Board, and in their 165 cumulative seasons they have 22 AA's. So call it a 13% to AA (and that is generous given that most of the 22 AAs happened after their first season). So, roughly 7 or 8 points max. The deficit is now 50.

What is realistic for AJ? On the plus side, he has a title under his belt. On the minus side, he has not wrestled in years, he is not enrolled, and he is reported to be much heavier than 197. So call him 0 to 20 points. Who knows? Now the deficit is 30 with some very rosy assumptions.

What is realistic for Kueter? Kueter comes in as a top 10 BB (#6), and these guys tend to have monster careers. Among these 90 athletes there are 9 who won it as freshmen. Of course, none of them skipped first semester in the room, but whatever. Let's say he has a 10% chance to win it all, he also has a 30% chance of never AAing (as has happened with 18 of the 60 who have finished their career). Is third a realistic ceiling? Not likely, but sure. That cuts the deficit to 17.

With a Brooks or Starocci injury now we are even.

All it took was to assume three wrestlers who are not currently part of the team (two not even enrolled in school), one of whom is actually practicing a different sport, to maximize their potential ALL AT THE SAME TIME (which is? an Iowa trait at NCAA's), and an injury to one of two specific wrestlers.

Well, you have me convinced.

So you are saying there's a chance!?

[ionel]

1 minute ago, jchapman said:

Dick Hutton won Heavyweight as a true freshman.

and he should've been the first 4x undefeated if not for a RD, he was a stud in his era. 

[Wrestleknownothing]

4 minutes ago, jchapman said:

Dick Hutton won Heavyweight as a true freshman.

Where was he on the Big Board? And how old is Willie, anyway?