2024 President Candidate Discussion

[jross]

This discussion is to share your insights, opinions, and concerns about the candidates' policies, leadership qualities, and potential impact on our nation. Be respectful.

[jross]

CNN lays out policies that Trump says he would enact if elected for a second term.

• https://www.cnn.com/2023/07/08/politics/trump-campaign-promises/index.html
• https://www.c-span.org/video/?524197-1/president-trumps-2024-campaign-announcement 

I like the direction on these

• Address the “disturbing” relationship between technology platforms and the government
• Foreign Policy: stop 'never-ending wars'
• Fentanyl: Former President Trump said he would deploy military assets to fight the fentanyl crisis and "inflict maximum damage" on cartel operations if elected in 2024, and he would seek the death penalty for convicted drug dealers and human traffickers.

 

 

[Husker_Du]

imo, Trump's policies were never in question. they were/are superior. he just can't help himself from being a prick. and voters are relatively stupid and shallow. 

i have no idea what's going to happen, but the current policies under this admin are so stupid it's almost like they want to hurt the country on purpose.

 

i think it would be interesting if we all listed what policies we'd like to see enacted going forward. here's mine:

1) fully secured southern border w/ proper documentation/process for immigrants and deportation for offenders (which would also crush the fentanyl stream which is out of control

2) open domestic oil production back up (which would reduce inflation immediately)

3) get the eff out of the Ukraine conflict. it's a giant grift from one of the world's most corrupt governments and we're the suckers

[DJT]

2 hours ago, Husker_Du said:

imo, Trump's policies were never in question. they were/are superior. he just can't help himself from being a prick. and voters are relatively stupid and shallow. 

i have no idea what's going to happen, but the current policies under this admin are so stupid it's almost like they want to hurt the country on purpose.

 

i think it would be interesting if we all listed what policies we'd like to see enacted going forward. here's mine:

1) fully secured southern border w/ proper documentation/process for immigrants and deportation for offenders (which would also crush the fentanyl stream which is out of control

2) open domestic oil production back up (which would reduce inflation immediately)

3) get the eff out of the Ukraine conflict. it's a giant grift from one of the world's most corrupt governments and we're the suckers

That’s a good start… I’d add, in no particular order:

4) End birthright citizenship… I’ll agree to follow Europe’s lead on this one… even a blind squirrel can find a nut.

5) Close down the majority of the 750+ military bases we have around the world (compared to China’s 1.5), and focus on economic world dominance, not military world dominance. 

6) Withdraw from NATO and let Europe pay to protect themselves… no reason for us to be flipping the bill for them to have free healthcare, 32-hour work weeks and three months paid time off, then they have the nerve to smug about it.

7) Phase out the present social security system for something that isn’t the literal definition of a ponzi-scheme.

8 ) Phase in a Federal sales tax while phasing out Federal income tax.

9) Term limits, age limits, cognitive testing for all elected officials. Octogenarians should not be setting the direction of the country for the next several decades when they are not likely to see the end of this one.

10) Return rights to the states and allow them to be the laboratories of democracy as they were intended.

11) Require a balanced federal budget.

12) Remove party identification from ballots. No “R” or “D” next to the candidate, only an “i” for the incumbent. The only straight ticket voting option is a “No Confidence” vote, which automatically places your vote against all incumbents.

[WrestlingRasta]

On this one for me it’s a lot less about policy and more about getting away from the extremes. Of the supposed leading candidates on both tickets, I can’t see myself voting for either one. 
 

Beyond the question, down the ticket, I’m happy to fill a very split ticket full of moderate candidates. Most of the time I vote an R over a D, I’d say over time probably a 60-30 clip, but anyone “MAGA” will be automatically voted against.  In fact that is it appears the only vote I would have for president. If it’s trump for R, and it looks like it may be close, I will vote whoever the D is. 
 

Policies can be changed every four years at the stroke of a pen. We’ve seen it time and time again. Trumps policies, at least the ones that were favorable to America, were all the work of other people, who by the way would never work for him again. A Trump return to the presidency, I don’t even want to think about it.  So if I thought it were close, I would vote directly against him, whomever. Which, it should be said, is the first time I would be doing that. I’ve left that spot blank on two occasions. 

[jross]

My brain hurts to think about anyone voting for four more years of this policy and culture... and it hurts to think about voting for any deep-state nut case.  If this becomes a Biden v Trump election... folks are certifiably insane to vote for Biden.  Forget the stupid policies on immigration, crime, etc.  The open hypocrisy with how the government agencies are blind to the leftist errors and strongly convicting the right... and censoring information... is unacceptable.  This current cycle is atrocious.  Replace Biden and Democrats have a chance for my vote.

[BerniePragle]

While I don't agree 100% with all the policies listed on here, I am beyond thrilled to see no mention of the Big Three that have been used for way too long to divide us... Gun Control,  Abortion,  and Gay Marriage.  I also see a lot of things listed that I whole heartedly agree with and that are undeniably good for the vast majority of Americans. 
I'll add two things to what's been mentioned:
1)  Bring Manufacturing, and the associated good paying jobs back to the US.  This will require something besides chest-pounding and a few trips to underutilized plants in The Rust Belt.  It will require disincentivizing American companies from sending manufacturing offshore, through changes to tax law and corporate accounting law.  Nothing  will change till that happens. We need to use the policies of some other countries, namely Switzerland and Germany. 
2)  Get Big Business and their lobbyists out of Washington.   Nothing will change for the better for the Middle Class till that happens.  There's way too much corporate money deciding our elections, laws, and policy.  As an example,  a couple people (and trump) mentioned stopping the 'never-ending wars'.  The defense contractors and their lobbyists in Washington would fight that successfully as long as they're there.

Exactly how much of this could be changed by a new, different,  competent President, I don't know.

[jross]

This gives me hopeful and optomistic thoughts.

Quote

The federal government would charter 10 new cities on federal land, awarding them to areas with the best development proposals. The former president said in a campaign video that the Freedom Cities would bring the return of US manufacturing, economic opportunity, new industries, and affordable living.

 

[DJT]

1 hour ago, jross said:

This gives me hopeful and optomistic thoughts.

 

I hope that it’s an open contest, and the winners are chosen via an internet poll. It will be a glorious shitshow.

A better plan would be to return federal land to the states and allow them to do as they see fit with it.

[Theo Brixton]

3 hours ago, BerniePragle said:

1)  Bring Manufacturing, and the associated good paying jobs back to the US.  This will require something besides chest-pounding and a few trips to underutilized plants in The Rust Belt.  It will require disincentivizing American companies from sending manufacturing offshore, through changes to tax law and corporate accounting law.  Nothing  will change till that happens. We need to use the policies of some other countries, namely Switzerland and Germany. 

This and there is no close second. The de-industrialization of the United States will be (or is already) our undoing. We can handle all of the graft inherent to centralized government, as unseemly as it may be, if the vast majority of working class people could productively contribute to the economy. 

[WrestlingRasta]

9 hours ago, jross said:

My brain hurts to think about anyone voting for four more years of this policy and culture... 

I don’t disagree with this, however I personally just feel Trump and Maga are far more dangerous to what the United States is (or at least was written to be). My feeling is, as I said before, policies are changed at the stroke of a pen. Once someone takes hold of an authoritarian government….that’s it. It’s all over. 

 

9 hours ago, jross said:

If this becomes a Biden v Trump election... folks are certifiably insane to vote for Biden.  

This is where you lose me. As I see this mindset of “you are certifiably insane if you vote against the way I think you should vote”, a mindset that has spread like wildfire and to the extremes of both sides of the aisle, is a bigger problem to the United States than anything. 
 

This is why anyone iI vote for in the future is going to be a moderate from either side. 

[Offthemat]

Given this country’s proximity to war in Eastern Europe and the Pacific, when the reason for supplying cluster bombs is because we’re out of everything else, and Weimar level inflation at the loss of Global Reserve Currency status, I cannot fathom the envy or jealousy that would require to vote for the man who single-handedly put us in this position because he is beholden to both China and Ukraine.  

[Paul158]

On 7/8/2023 at 10:36 PM, BerniePragle said:

While I don't agree 100% with all the policies listed on here, I am beyond thrilled to see no mention of the Big Three that have been used for way too long to divide us... Gun Control,  Abortion,  and Gay Marriage.  I also see a lot of things listed that I whole heartedly agree with and that are undeniably good for the vast majority of Americans. 
I'll add two things to what's been mentioned:
1)  Bring Manufacturing, and the associated good paying jobs back to the US.  This will require something besides chest-pounding and a few trips to underutilized plants in The Rust Belt.  It will require disincentivizing American companies from sending manufacturing offshore, through changes to tax law and corporate accounting law.  Nothing  will change till that happens. We need to use the policies of some other countries, namely Switzerland and Germany. 
2)  Get Big Business and their lobbyists out of Washington.   Nothing will change for the better for the Middle Class till that happens.  There's way too much corporate money deciding our elections, laws, and policy.  As an example,  a couple people (and trump) mentioned stopping the 'never-ending wars'.  The defense contractors and their lobbyists in Washington would fight that successfully as long as they're there.

Exactly how much of this could be changed by a new, different,  competent President, I don't know.

Well said Bernie. I voting for you for president.

[Wrestleknownothing]

32 minutes ago, Offthemat said:

Weimar level inflation at the loss of Global Reserve Currency status

What is your obsession with something that is not happening?

[Offthemat]

15 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

What is your obsession with something that is not happening?

It happened slowly at first and then all of a sudden. 

[Wrestleknownothing]

1 minute ago, Offthemat said:

It happened slowly at first and then all of a sudden. 

And in your fantasy what is the replacement reserve currency?

[Offthemat]

The BRICS nations are having a meeting in August in South Africa to discuss a gold-backed currency.  Use of the dollar has already been declining.  If it happens, if we lose Reserve Currency status, our debt will strangle us.  

[Wrestleknownothing]

21 minutes ago, Offthemat said:

The BRICS nations are having a meeting in August in South Africa to discuss a gold-backed currency.  Use of the dollar has already been declining.  If it happens, if we lose Reserve Currency status, our debt will strangle us.  

Thank goodness. I thought you were going to say Dogecoin.

A gold-backed, currency by committee has zero chance at becoming a reserve currency.

[BerniePragle]

1 hour ago, Paul158 said:

Well said Bernie. I voting for you for president.

You must have missed where I said competent!  One of the big problems is that by the time someone rises to that level in the political system, they're beholden to too many special interest groups.  We need someone who couldn't find their way to Washington without a map, a true outsider.  But NOT trump.  He has some of the correct qualities, but his massive ego gets in the way too much.  We need a Jesse Ventura type.

[Plasmodium]

On 7/8/2023 at 8:36 PM, BerniePragle said:

While I don't agree 100% with all the policies listed on here, I am beyond thrilled to see no mention of the Big Three that have been used for way too long to divide us... Gun Control,  Abortion,  and Gay Marriage.  I also see a lot of things listed that I whole heartedly agree with and that are undeniably good for the vast majority of Americans. 
I'll add two things to what's been mentioned:
1)  Bring Manufacturing, and the associated good paying jobs back to the US.  This will require something besides chest-pounding and a few trips to underutilized plants in The Rust Belt.  It will require disincentivizing American companies from sending manufacturing offshore, through changes to tax law and corporate accounting law.  Nothing  will change till that happens. We need to use the policies of some other countries, namely Switzerland and Germany. 
2)  Get Big Business and their lobbyists out of Washington.   Nothing will change for the better for the Middle Class till that happens.  There's way too much corporate money deciding our elections, laws, and policy.  As an example,  a couple people (and trump) mentioned stopping the 'never-ending wars'.  The defense contractors and their lobbyists in Washington would fight that successfully as long as they're there.

Exactly how much of this could be changed by a new, different,  competent President, I don't know.

Call me Debbie Downer.  Those issues aren't gone and they aren't going anywhere.  Throw in single payer health care.  That is our problem.  We don't solve problems.

[Husker_Du]

not that anyone cares, but...

i don't really care about the 'big 3'

1) Gun Control - i don't mess w/ guns, but i respect those who do. to me it's comical that the left continually points fingers at the ones who own guns legally and think that violent crime will go down by affecting them.

2) Abortion - it's now a states rights issue. it'll work itself out imo

3) Gay Marriage - i just don't see this as an issue. i don't know that i would even consider it a Big 3, actually. perhaps i'm naive here, but is there any credible threat to gay marriages being banned (for the love of god, please don't point out rhetoric from far right slapnuts. them saying it doesn't it make a likely to happen)

[Husker_Du]

On 7/8/2023 at 7:04 PM, WrestlingRasta said:

On this one for me it’s a lot less about policy and more about getting away from the extremes. Of the supposed leading candidates on both tickets, I can’t see myself voting for either one. 
 

Beyond the question, down the ticket, I’m happy to fill a very split ticket full of moderate candidates. Most of the time I vote an R over a D, I’d say over time probably a 60-30 clip, but anyone “MAGA” will be automatically voted against.  In fact that is it appears the only vote I would have for president. If it’s trump for R, and it looks like it may be close, I will vote whoever the D is. 
 

Policies can be changed every four years at the stroke of a pen. We’ve seen it time and time again. Trumps policies, at least the ones that were favorable to America, were all the work of other people, who by the way would never work for him again. A Trump return to the presidency, I don’t even want to think about it.  So if I thought it were close, I would vote directly against him, whomever. Which, it should be said, is the first time I would be doing that. I’ve left that spot blank on two occasions. 

i just don't get this at all.

beyond all the theatrics and rhetoric, the ONLY thing that truly affects citizens is POLICY. it's quite frankly the only thing you should care about.

saying 'it can change every four years' is flippant. tell that to the parents of dead kids of fentanyl. or an entire generation of kids whose development was retarded by absolutely ridiculous covid policy. or the permanent ramifications of both our funds and reputation for being in a grift of a war supporting a crooked govt in Ukraine.

[mspart]

27 minutes ago, BerniePragle said:

 We need a Jesse Ventura type.

Let's hope not.   I lived in MN and was happy with Ventura as governor for a few years, then he went nutty as he really is.   I did not vote for him but I wasn't unhappy that he won.   He was ok for a little while but became a nut case.   I really don't want Trump in there as he has a self destruct mode few others have.  He has good policy positions  but can't get out of his own way.   But I'd probably vote for BerniePragle.   Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie!!!

mspart

[BerniePragle]

26 minutes ago, mspart said:

Let's hope not.   I lived in MN and was happy with Ventura as governor for a few years, then he went nutty as he really is.   I did not vote for him but I wasn't unhappy that he won.   He was ok for a little while but became a nut case.   I really don't want Trump in there as he has a self destruct mode few others have.  He has good policy positions  but can't get out of his own way.   But I'd probably vote for BerniePragle.   Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, Bernie!!!

mspart

Unfortunately, I'm betting we end up with someone worse than whatever you thought of Jesse Ventura. 
Trump had only one actual policy.  Make himself and other rich guys richer.  Hence his Big Boys Tax Breaks.  The rest was just bluster and a way to get elected.
Unless you voted for Ralph Nader numerous times, you wouldn't want BP for President.  Besides, I don't meet one of the requirements. 
 

[Offthemat]

14 minutes ago, BerniePragle said:

Trump had only one actual policy.  Make himself and other rich guys richer.  Hence his Big Boys Tax Breaks.  The rest was just bluster and a way to get elected.

All the data shows that blue collar wages were increasing faster than white collar wages under Trump.  But yes, everyone was better off than under Biden policies.