Real Woods - day to day

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

  On 11/17/2022 at 7:05 PM, 98lberEating2Lunches said:

I understand Cael's current position is that any participant should treat it like any other competition by assuming it will be considered by Coaches in their rankings.  I don't think coaches (even Cael) are in a real strong position to pull athletes, because NIL is in play for NWCA All Star match participants (Flo has the broadcast rights).

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The Hall situation clearly happened before NIL. I would imagine that you would have to reevaluate as the circumstances changed.  However, initially (pre-NIL)  I would have been very reluctant to attend that event based on the Hall situation.

Also, the assumption that the All-Star is considered in rankings is a good one, until your athlete pulls a big upset and it isn't considered.

[98lberEating2Lunches]

  On 11/17/2022 at 7:19 PM, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

The Hall situation clearly happened before NIL. I would imagine that you would have to reevaluate as the circumstances changed.  However, initially (pre-NIL)  I would have been very reluctant to attend that event based on the Hall situation.

Also, the assumption that the All-Star is considered in rankings is a good one, until your athlete pulls a big upset and it isn't considered.

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Understood.  We can only live in the moment with some expectation to act after considering the best available information.

Edited November 17, 2022 by 98lberEating2Lunches

[98lberEating2Lunches]

  On 11/17/2022 at 7:04 PM, ionel said:

 

What place did he finish and who/what seed did he lose to?

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I responded to a request for clarification.  For all I know, Cael knows the Coaches' ranking considered the all star result, because he, himself, considered it, and proposed seeding Mark Hall #2.  I am certain that I didn't assert the seeding as being incorrect.

Edited November 17, 2022 by 98lberEating2Lunches

[ionel]

  On 11/17/2022 at 7:41 PM, 98lberEating2Lunches said:

I responded to a request for clarification.  For all I know, Cael knows the Coaches' ranking considered the all star result, because he, himself, considered it, and proposed seeding Mark Hall #2.  I am certain that I didn't assert the seeding as being incorrect.

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No I'm just asking if being seeded #2 had any affect on the outcome?

Its possible to understand a "policy" that says the AllStar doesn't count but yet understand why some coaches may consider such a result in their seed vote.  Where the athlete finished the year before is also not supposed to be considered.  Its also certainly understandable why a coach might consider a singlet grab penalty point win in a double OT match to not be too much more valuable than the opposing wrestler's loss, yet there's no specific "policy" on how they should weight such in their own mind.  

All said, maybe the AllStar is to blame for the New Age of Ducking. 

[Wrestleknownothing]

  On 11/17/2022 at 7:54 PM, ionel said:

No I'm just asking if being seeded #2 had any affect on the outcome?

Its possible to understand a "policy" that says the AllStar doesn't count but yet understand why some coaches may consider such a result in their seed vote.  Where the athlete finished the year before is also not supposed to be considered.  Its also certainly understandable why a coach might consider a singlet grab penalty point win in a double OT match to not be too much more valuable than the opposing wrestler's loss, yet there's no specific "policy" on how they should weight such in their own mind.  

All said, maybe the AllStar is to blame for the New Age of Ducking. 

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Speaking of which, who was it that proposed a ducking index on the old board?

[ionel]

  On 11/17/2022 at 8:09 PM, Wrestleknownothing said:

Speaking of which, who was it that proposed a ducking index on the old board?

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[Caveira]

Wasn’t hall almost majored in the finals that year….. against the same opponent?

[98lberEating2Lunches]

  On 11/17/2022 at 7:54 PM, ionel said:

No I'm just asking if being seeded #2 had any affect on the outcome?

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Funny, it sure looked like you asked "What place did he finish and who/what seed did he lose to?" as a troll who already knows the answers might ask.

To answer your clarified question, I would hope being seeded number #2 would not have an effect to one who loses to the #1 seed.  But I suppose if we want to engage the hypothetical:

1) It could be the #2 vs #3 match was tougher than the #1 vs #4 match might've otherwise been for Mark Hall.

2) It could be if the eventual champ and #1 seed had been seeded #2, that stylistic match-up closer to weigh-ins against the #3 seed might've prevented him from making the finals.  After all, he had lost to Mark Hall in the semifinals the prior year.

[ionel]

  On 11/17/2022 at 9:10 PM, 98lberEating2Lunches said:

Funny, it sure looked like you asked "What place did he finish and who/what seed did he lose to?" as a troll who already knows the answers might ask.

To answer your clarified question, I would hope being seeded number #2 would not have an effect to one who loses to the #1 seed.  But I suppose if we want to engage the hypothetical:

1) It could be the #2 vs #3 match was tougher than the #1 vs #4 match might've otherwise been for Mark Hall.

2) It could be if the eventual champ and #1 seed had been seeded #2, that stylistic match-up closer to weigh-ins against the #3 seed might've prevented him from making the finals.  After all, he had lost to Mark Hall in the semifinals the prior year.

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Ok, what year, ill look it up?

Edited November 17, 2022 by ionel

[Wrestleknownothing]

  On 11/17/2022 at 9:10 PM, 98lberEating2Lunches said:

Funny, it sure looked like you asked "What place did he finish and who/what seed did he lose to?" as a troll who already knows the answers might ask.

To answer your clarified question, I would hope being seeded number #2 would not have an effect to one who loses to the #1 seed.  But I suppose if we want to engage the hypothetical:

1) It could be the #2 vs #3 match was tougher than the #1 vs #4 match might've otherwise been for Mark Hall.

2) It could be if the eventual champ and #1 seed had been seeded #2, that stylistic match-up closer to weigh-ins against the #3 seed might've prevented him from making the finals.  After all, he had lost to Mark Hall in the semifinals the prior year.

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Did it ever occur that not everyone who disagrees with you is a troll?

[Plasmodium]

[98lberEating2Lunches]

  On 11/17/2022 at 9:28 PM, ionel said:

Ok, what year, ill look it up?

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Already stated in original clarification. Try to keep up.

[98lberEating2Lunches]

  On 11/17/2022 at 9:30 PM, Wrestleknownothing said:

Did it ever occur that not everyone who disagrees with you is a troll?

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Yes.  But no position were stated to agree or disagree with.

[ionel]

  On 11/17/2022 at 11:40 PM, 98lberEating2Lunches said:

Already stated in original clarification. Try to keep up.

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Ok looked it up and it appears in hindsight maybe they seeded correctly, certainly the #2 didn't hurt Hall.  If I'm reading this correctly they both came in undefeated with similar bonus records.  So how do you pick the #1 vs #2, coin flip, the taller wrestler, maybe some on the committee just though V looked better end of year, maybe they got the #3 & #4 wrong which then effectively gave Hall the #1 path?  If you just go with the coin flip option then its 50/50.  Given how Cael wrestled and coached and the success he has had in the finals, I highly doubt he was concerned about a #2 seed.  ;_;

[98lberEating2Lunches]

  On 11/18/2022 at 12:05 AM, ionel said:

maybe they seeded correctly

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Agreed.  I already stated as much.

I only answered the hypothetical how it could possibly have affected the outcome.

Your answer includes another hypothetical that the #3 and #4 seeding could be wrong after stating it appears they got the #1 and #2 right.  An interesting, albeit incongruent take, in my opinion, given #4 was 28-6 and lost to the #5 in the quarters, and finished 6th.  Meanwhile the #3 was 33-2, made the semis, and finished 4th.

Given the #5, who faced the #1 in the semis and finished 3rd, later wrestled 197 and 184 at NCAAs in his career, perhaps his weight management challenges were on the same order as the #1's in the semis.  And perhaps the #3s were not.

[ionel]

  On 11/17/2022 at 9:30 PM, Wrestleknownothing said:

Did it ever occur that not everyone who disagrees with you is a troll?

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Has Dan lost weight?

[nhs67]

  On 11/17/2022 at 2:53 PM, ionel said:

You may be correct but I'd say OSU has been up there maybe surpassed them last half dozen years, they had 3 starters injured last half of last season. 

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I think OSU's are less to do with tough wrestling as they are tough cuts.

[Le duke]

  On 11/18/2022 at 1:53 AM, nhs67 said:

I think OSU's are less to do with tough wrestling as they are tough cuts.

Pretty strong correlation between weight cutting and injury.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Pish]

  On 11/18/2022 at 12:05 AM, ionel said:

If I'm reading this correctly they both came in undefeated with similar bonus records.  So how do you pick the #1 vs #2, 

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Pretty simple..you go with the defending champ. No if’s and’s or but’s. 
 

im shocked Cael is letting these guys go after the Hall debacle. 
 

That being said, personally I love it, compete against the best and lay it on the line. At least the Hall thing set precedence and now we know these matches will count in coaches ranking. 
 

I just wish the coaches would also ding other coaches for ducking (see Schultz with headgear on last year, and Jones sending him back to locker room against Kerk)

[ionel]

  On 11/18/2022 at 9:33 PM, Pish said:

Pretty simple..you go with the defending champ. No if’s and’s or but’s. 
 

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Pretty certain seeding criteria says not to consider previous year but if you want to guess again ...

[Pish]

  On 11/18/2022 at 9:40 PM, ionel said:

Pretty certain seeding criteria says not to consider previous year but if you want to guess again ...

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It’s called common sense..Hall would have been #1 coaches rank until he lost to Zahid in all-star match (which we were told wouldn’t count)

Why do you think Hall would have started #1 in coaches rank? I’ll give you a hint since you’re being obtuse..”previous years performance”
 

 

Edited November 18, 2022 by Pish

[Hurricane Wrestling]

  On 11/18/2022 at 9:46 PM, Pish said:

It’s called common sense..Hall would have been #1 coaches rank until he lost to Zahid in all-star match (which we were told wouldn’t count)

Why do you think Hall would have started #1 in coaches rank? I’ll give you a hint since you’re being obtuse..”previous years performance”
 

 

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[Pish]

  On 11/30/2022 at 2:56 AM, Hurricane Wrestling said:

 

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Way to bring up a two week old thread you dumb fk. What did I say in my post that wasn’t true?
 

Love the dumb fks that add nothing except playing with YouTube and Gifs. 

Tell me what I said isn’t true or go play with yourself on YouTube 

[Plasmodium]

  On 11/30/2022 at 3:03 AM, Pish said:

Way to bring up a two week old thread you dumb fk. What did I say in my post that wasn’t true?
 

Love the dumb fks that add nothing except playing with YouTube and Gifs. 

Tell me what I said isn’t true or go play with yourself on YouTube 

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