fishbane

https://uww.org/article/world-championships-sadulaev-forfeits-undergo-scans-neck-injury "Sadulaev is suffering from a neck hernia, towards the end of his spinal cord. Medical scans will determine if it is a tumor or if Sadulaev can return to the mat without surgery."

According to UWW "65kg champion Takuto OTOGURO (JPN) also pulled out due to a foot injury he has been carrying for one year."

Playing for the Giants my concerns would be more that my friend would lose money and I wouldn't want to feel responsible. Or general annoyance that he would be betting against me because some player is injury or just not believe in us. Nothing really unethical or illegal - just being a bad friend. Do you think there should be no limits on athletes betting on other sports teams at their institution? Supposing there is a late season largely meaningless football game and bunch of Iowa athletes from other sports (Baseball, basketball, wrestling, golf, track, and women's sports) as well as athletic department staff not directly involved in the game bet against the Hawkeyes and they lose the game. I could see how if that information came to light it would bring disrepute onto the university and NCAA athletics even if they were all just betting against them because they were really bad and that's why they were playing in a meaningless game late in the season. It will always be the NCAA and the institution that takes the reputation hit and not the sports books, so they will be the ones making the rules. Whose image was hurt most by the Black Sox scandal? The players, the team, the league, or the sports books? The incorrect answer is obvious. The sports books don't care if it's fixed, so long as they mitigate the risk they will make money either way. They take bets on WWE events!

If I played fro the Giants and I found out a friend was making bets based on information I told him that would probably annoy me. It would make me not want to share information with that person. I can't think of a major professional sports league that allows their athletes or employees to bet on league contests even involving other teams. The Iowa athletic department is essentially running 20 different professional teams some more profitable than others. The athletes are essentially employees of the same entity. I am sure there is some interaction between the different sports - they don't have 20 different weight rooms, running tracks, ect. Information could be learned from proximity and not by someone directly sharing information like your friend example. Allowing betting on sports at the same institution has little benefit to the institution or the NCAA and can only really damage their reputation if there is an incident, so why allow it? I think the NCAA rules could be relaxed in some aspects. I don't see the conflict in allowing betting on professional sports (NFL, MLB, Overseas Tennis, ect.) and sports that are not sponsored by the school (In Iowa's case one example might be NCAA men's ice hockey), but I'd keep the penalties for betting on your own NCAA sport or your own institution.

I dunno about that but Brands should get a lawyer and sue Draft Kings. According to his tweet he signed up because they said if he placed a $5 bet on an NFL game as a new member he would receive $200, yet the account summary he posted only shows $51 in rewards and promotions. Looks to me like he was cheated out of $149.

The repechage system seems like someone asked a mathematician what's the fewest matches you need to determine the top 3 wrestlers. Then they decided that was one too many matches. The thing is whilst this would be just fine if you are only interested in determining the top 3 the logic doesn't work below 3rd. It's possible the 4th best wrestler is not even involved in the repechage. And it's not like they don't care about the places after 3rd. They give out a second 3rd, sometimes 5th and/or 6th get Olympic qualification, and they award rankings points based on more than just the top 3 placements.

After the U.S. Supreme Court overturned a federal ban on sports betting in 2018, Iowa legalized sports gambling Aug. 15, 2019.

One might infer that from the statement "had no clue that I could be PERMANENTLY banned"

Looking back at his tweets it says "I missed the meeting in 2022." It doesn't say whether he also missed it in 2021, or 2020, or 2019, or 2018.

I am not sure what distinction you are trying to make. If Rose was under duress it was of his own making. Was he under duress when he bet on the Reds 50+ times in 1987? He simply agreed to the inevitable That he agreed to be placed on the ineligible list itself is a novelty. No one else on the list agreed to be placed there. This agreement came about because Rose refused to participate in the hearings and then sued to stop them. The agreement was a settlement agreement to his lawsuit. And whilst he had been granted a temporary restraining order stopping the hearing he wasn't going to win this lawsuit. One final distinction is that Rose agreed to be placed on the ineligible list at the time there was no formal rule preventing someone on the list from being inducted into the hall of fame. So he didn't really agree to no hall of fame, but that ultimately was a consequence of his actions.

Isn't this an annual meeting? He is in his 6th year at Iowa. Did he skip it 5 straight years?

Maybe he is fishing for an NIL deal from an online casino? I think Pete Rose does endorsements for casinos.

Things changed recently with regards to betting. When the NCAA first outlawed betting years ago and made the initial rules the only sports betting was essentially illegal sports books. It made sense to have harsher penalties at that time because if an athlete was betting they were also breaking the law. Even betting on professional games could be problematic. An athlete could end up in the hole with a bookie who might demand the debt be paid by fixing or point shaving their athletic contests. Today I don't see why they continue to ban betting on professional sports since it is widely legal to do so and fewer negative externalities. Also with the legalization of gambling it also makes it easier to catch offenders which should mean that the punishment doesn't have to be as harsh to serve its purpose. If you are unlikely to catch offenders because they're doing all this on the black market, harshly punishing offenders can serve as a valuable deterrent. If you can catch ~100% of offenders then it makes sense to have less harsh penalties because the near perfect enforcement is deterrent itself.

Yes, but this was the year he redshirted. 1983-1984 he lost in the second round and DNP. 1984-1985 was the year he lost to Jordan in the final, wrestled at Espior worlds (July in Colorado) and took bronze. 1985-1986 he redshirted won senior nationals (April? in Vegas), won Goodwill Games (July in Moscow), did not wrestle at worlds (October in Budapest). 1986-1987 he won NCAAs, did not win senior nationals (did he wrestle?), presumable won WTT, won Pan Ams (August in Indianapolis), and won world championships (August in France). 1987-1988 he won NCAAs, won senior nationals, won OTT, won Olympics. I suppose worlds being in October 1986 may have interfered with his preparation for his redshirt junior year so he may have sat out the trials. Maybe if they had been earlier in the year like they were in 1987 he would not have sat out. Or perhaps if he had beaten Iseav before the trials he would have prioritized going to the world championships. Either way if he sat out the WTT in 1986 then we still don't know where the 3rd domestic loss occurred.

That's what I found as well. I would assume that would mean 2 domestic losses at the junior level which wouldn't work. Since the HOF record for him had three losses and he definitely had two at the senior level. Maybe he forfeited the 3rd place match?

I really don't know. I read an article that said the loss to Fisher in 1992 was his first domestic loss in 4 years (Lewis in 1988 presumably) and first since 1990 (Reinoso at Cerro Pelado). So I think this loss had to happen before the 1988 loss to Lewis. I see that he won Senior Nationals in 1986 and, as you pointed out, the Goodwill Games. I think those would have happened in maybe an April/May time frame for Senior Nationals and the Goodwill Games were in July. Joe McFarland represented the US at the World Championships in October where he lost to the finals to Isaev. So maybe he lost at the trials in 1986? It would seem odd too me that he skipped the trials. For context this was his redshirt year so he didn't wrestle an NCAA schedule. Another guess would be Senior Nationals in 1987. Smith did not win Senior Nationals in 1987. He won them in 1986 and 1988-1991. I do not know if that was because he sat out in 1987 or because he lost. My final guess is that they included some loss from Junior or Espior in that record. I think he lost domestically at the Junior level. I suspect they did this with his international record (100-5). The international losses I could find for him are below. Could only find 3 at the senior level so I think the other two were at Espior and Juniors. 1992 Olympics 5th round Reinoso (Cuba) 3-1 OT over Smith (USA) 1990 Cerro Pelado Reinoso (Cuba) 4-3 OT over Smith (USA) 1989 World Cup Sarkisyan (USSR) 2-1 over Smith (USA) 1985 World Espior Championships Smith finished 3rd in a weight won by Arsen Fadzayev (USSR) though I don't know who beat Smith. Radko Karmandiev (Bul) was the silver medalist. 1983 Junior World Championships Finals Nikolai Garkin (USSR) over Smith (USSR)

The Olympics happened in 2021. I know they are often called the 2020 Olympics because they were supposed to have happened in 2020. If you want to call them the 2020 Olympics for that reason that's fine, but Snyder was 25 years old when he wrestled in them whether you call them the 2021 Olympics or the 2020 Olympics.

Expectations have changed a lot in the past 10-15 years. Saying 97kg just isn't performing? It's been better than 57kg, 61kg, 65kg, 70kg, 92kg, 125kg. Brooks at 97kg could be the move. The word is that he's moving up top 197lbs and either him or Starocci said a goal was for them be Olympic teammates at 74 and 86kg. 86 and 97kg could be more realistic than 74 and 86kg.

Not sure. I got that info from his hall of fame bio - https://nwhof.org/hall_of_fame/bio/108. I suspect the third loss was some time in 1986 and he didn't make the team. Maybe someone who knows can chime in.

Not that many. You seem like a John Smith fan. Smith's international career spanned 1987-1992 inclusive. His international record in that time was 100-5 and 77-3 in domestic freestyle competition. Between 2011 and 2017 (1 more year than Smith's career) Burroughs was 152-5 overall in freestyle. He lost once in domestic competition - that 2017 WTT match to Dake 6-6 on criteria. He lost 4 times in international events, 4-4 to Marable at 2014 Yasar Doug, 2-9 to Tsargush at 2014 Worlds, 2-3 too Guduev at the 2016 Olympics, and 11-1 to Abdurakhmonov also at the 2016 Olympics.

2017 was not an Olympic year. There was a summer games in 2016 and there was supposed to be a summer games in 2021, but the COVID-19 pandemic pushed back the 2020 OTT and Olympics to 2021. The series with Dake in 2017 was a WTT. Burroughs won the series 2-1 and won worlds in 2017. As someone else pointed out Marsteller won one of three at Final X in 2022 as well.

I am pretty sure Smith dropped one in the 2 out of 3 with John Fisher for the 1992 Olympic spot as well. Possibly not prime Smith by then. His world/Olympic titles were 1987-1992 inclusive.

Smith dropped 1 in the best 2 of 3 to Lewis in 1988. This was the year after Smith won his first title. This is probably pretty analogous to when Snyder dropped 1 in a best 2 out of 3 to Varner at the 2016 Trials. In both cases a younger wrestler coming off their first world title dropped 1 match in a best 2 out of 3 against a US gold medalist from 4 years ago. Though Varner's win over Snyder was on Criteria. Varner and Snyder wrestled more than that series. I think Varner had unretired a year earlier and Snyder swept that series 2-0 and they wrestled at the finals of the US Open once also won by Snyder. Overall Snyder was 5-1 against Varner. Not sure how many times Smith and Lewis met. Burroughs American freestyle losses were 2007 to Teyon Ware at University Nationals, 2013 to Marable in an international tournament, 2017 to Dake in a best 2 of 3 at the WTT, 2019 to Imar in a best 2 of 3 at Final X, 2021 to David Taylor at a the Flo Event at 86kg, 2021 to Dake 0-2 in best 2 of 3 at the OTT, 2022 1x to Marsteller in a best 2 of 3 at Final x, and 2023 2x to Marsteller in a best 2 of 3 at Final X. In total there were 10 freestyle losses to Americans all in domestic tournaments except Marable. The "prime" losses are probably the 2013 loss to Marable, and the 2017 loss to Dake, both of those were on criteria (4-4 and 6-6) which wasn't really a thing when Smith, and Baumgartner were competing.

Boultakaev has a bronze medal from 2013 worlds.

I thought that was what you did to start all this. You are going in circles. So Sadulaev preventing Snyder from winning more golds is a valid point, but Taylor preventing Yazdani from winning more titles is an "if not for" that should not be considered? I can't say I see the distinction. In my mind you said that about Sadulaev to try and make the point that Snyder has the same # of titles, more overall medals, and against better competition than Taylor. I attempted to rebut that by pointing out how great Yazdani has been (4 titles, 9 medals, 3 weights, only 3 losses outside of Taylor, 3 wins over 2x champ Ghasempour, no losses outside of Taylor in nearly 8 years) and that if Taylor had lost to him with the frequency that Snyder has lost to Sadulaev he would be considered in the top 5 or so all-time like Sadulaev is. He is objectively one of the top 10 freestyle wrestlers of the past 25 years. Compare Snyder's career and Yazdani's. They are almost the same. Both started competing on the senior level in 2015 have won 1 OG, 1 OS, 3 WG, 3 WS, 1WB - very similar stuff. Yazdani has one more world silver at a non-Olympic weight (70kg) and Snyder has another world bronze at 97kg. The big difference is that Yazdani is more consistent and loses a lot less. 8 losses in 8 years and 5 of them to Taylor. Snyder has lost a lot more in that time and not just to Sadulaev. Taylor is Yazdani's Sadulaev.