Ryder Block Flo Ranking

[Wrestleknownothing]

@Jon_Kozak

This one has me confused.

Ryder Block entered the 141 rankings at #26 on Dec. 9 after going 2-2 with a win over never ranked David Mayora and a win over never previously ranked Nash Singleton (Singleton entered the same week at #27). Block has wrestled twice since against higher ranked wrestlers and lost them both.

Singleton has lost to many unranked wrestlers since (and beat #33) causing him to drop from Flo's rankings.

But somehow Block has gone 0-2 and jumped 8 spots to #18. It feels like the Singleton win gave him a floor of #26, even though Singleton was not ranked at the time and would quickly lose his rank.

Block has only ever wrestled 6 times in his career, has lost four of those, but keeps moving up the rankings?

[Spencerlee]

I think it’s perfectly fair honestly.

[Wrestleknownothing]

10 minutes ago, Spencerlee said:

I think it’s perfectly fair honestly.

I am shocked you don't think it is low.

[Mr. PeanutButter]

28 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

@Jon_Kozak

This one has me confused.

Ryder Block entered the 141 rankings at #26 on Dec. 9 after going 2-2 with a win over never ranked David Mayora and a win over never previously ranked Nash Singleton (Singleton entered the same week at #27). Block has wrestled twice since against higher ranked wrestlers and lost them both.

Singleton has lost to many unranked wrestlers since (and beat #33) causing him to drop from Flo's rankings.

But somehow Block has gone 0-2 and jumped 8 spots to #18. It feels like the Singleton win gave him a floor of #26, even though Singleton was not ranked at the time and would quickly lose his rank.

Block has only ever wrestled 6 times in his career, has lost four of those, but keeps moving up the rankings?

Looks like the previous #17 and #19-24th ranked wrestlers moved up after #15 and #18 both lost. BUT this does not explain why Ryder Block was so high to begin with. Maybe Kozak is drawn to his aura

[Spencerlee]

9 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

I am shocked you don't think it is low.

I personally would have him 15, but am okay with 18 for now.

[1032004]

Is he getting credit for Jace Rhodes beating Julian Tagg?

[SocraTease]

Wrestlestat has him at #102.  Down (or is it up?) from #266 last year.

In any event, he has risen far past his level of mediocrity.  

[1032004]

9 minutes ago, SocraTease said:

Wrestlestat has him at #102.  Down (or is it up?) from #266 last year.

In any event, he has risen far past his level of mediocrity.  

He didn’t wrestle any matches last year 

[1032004]

Flo just calling attention to their mistake now (I do believe it to be a mistake)

 

 

[VakAttack]

In Flo's meager defense, there aren't any ranked freshmen at the weight other than Block and Rallo from Bellarmine, whom Block beat.

[1032004]

2 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

In Flo's meager defense, there aren't any ranked freshmen at the weight other than Block and Rallo from Bellarmine, whom Block beat.

He may deserve being the highest ranked freshman.  Just not at #18

[Wrestleknownothing]

4 minutes ago, VakAttack said:

In Flo's meager defense, there aren't any ranked freshmen at the weight other than Block and Rallo from Bellarmine, whom Block beat.

I think Block beat Rallo's backup.

[1032004]

I was gonna try to give them some benefit of the doubt and say “maybe the guys below him have no resume either.”

But it didn’t take long to prove that theory wrong.  The guy one spot below him - Dylan Cedeno of UVA - is 7-0 with wins over #20 (Scott), #28 (Hanna), and #30 (Miranda).   Zero reason for Block to be above him.  They have to be giving him credit for Rhodes’ win over Tagg, but even that when combined with the losses shouldn’t put him above Cedeno.

The next guy, Jayden Scott of UNC, has wins over #13 (Schwartz) and #26 (Treanor), and has only lost to guys in the top 20.

You got something against the ACC, @Jon_Kozak  ?

 

 

[BruceyB]

20 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

I was gonna try to give them some benefit of the doubt and say “maybe the guys below him have no resume either.”

But it didn’t take long to prove that theory wrong.  The guy one spot below him - Dylan Cedeno of UVA - is 7-0 with wins over #20 (Scott), #28 (Hanna), and #30 (Miranda).   Zero reason for Block to be above him.  They have to be giving him credit for Rhodes’ win over Tagg, but even that when combined with the losses shouldn’t put him above Cedeno.

The next guy, Jayden Scott of UNC, has wins over #13 (Schwartz) and #26 (Treanor), and has only lost to guys in the top 20.

You got something against the ACC, @Jon_Kozak  ?

 

 

Both Nash Singleton and Ryder Block first appear in the rankings on Dec. 9th. Nash Singleton beat Kai Owen who was previously #26. Since Block had a win over Singleton, they move him to 26, Singleton to 27, and Owen at 28. I am not going to do all the research on the rest of the guys, but knowing how flo ranks, I'm assuming 18-25 have all taken losses that have caused them to drop while Block hasn't lost to anyone ranked below him (Zach Redding was #21 when they wrestled).

Basically, Flo ranks mostly objectively on wins and losses, and having wrestled such a limited schedule, he has benefited in the rankings from others taking Ls. It will sort itself out in time.

[VakAttack]

I don't see a valid defense of Block being ranked, either.

[1032004]

4 minutes ago, BruceyB said:

Both Nash Singleton and Ryder Block first appear in the rankings on Dec. 9th. Nash Singleton beat Kai Owen who was previously #26. Since Block had a win over Singleton, they move him to 26, Singleton to 27, and Owen at 28. I am not going to do all the research on the rest of the guys, but knowing how flo ranks, I'm assuming 18-25 have all taken losses that have caused them to drop while Block hasn't lost to anyone ranked below him (Zach Redding was #21 when they wrestled).

Basically, Flo ranks mostly objectively on wins and losses, and having wrestled such a limited schedule, he has benefited in the rankings from others taking Ls. It will sort itself out in time.

But they have always said they base it on “total resume,” and that the resume is constantly changing as the season goes on.

That’s exactly what happened last year with Jack Maida when he dropped like 10 spots or something without wrestling, because guys he had beaten took a bunch of losses (which I agreed with).  So pretty much same situation here.  I think this was an oversight and they will correct it (as long as Block doesn’t beat Beau Bartlett).

[CGriff]

Looked like a high 20s to low 30s against Mendez

[Silver]

This will surely keep me up tonight

[No BS Fan]

I'm not even convinced he's even the best option in their room. Cullan seems like a victim of the Brands lack of development but has still remained loyal. Looked like he was going to be the guy at one time then in comes Woods.  

[nhs67]

12 hours ago, Mr. PeanutButter said:

Looks like the previous #17 and #19-24th ranked wrestlers moved up after #15 and #18 both lost. BUT this does not explain why Ryder Block was so high to begin with. Maybe Kozak is drawn to his aura

This isn't a thing.

Their oath prevents them from allowing opinion to influence.  It seems robotic, but for rankings it seems to work (for them).

[Truzzcat]

It seems like a margin of defeat ranking which I know they have never accounted for before so would be wrong to do here. They have puncino at 16. I believe they have historically not dinged people for losses to guys under redshirt or none starters perhaps it's just under red shirt or not attached I know Stanich was not penalized for his forrest lost last year nor was Ramos. If you account for that Block would technically be 2-2 voiding the valencia and Redding losses. Even at that though they are hesitant to rank freshman without a large sample, so you have a guy who is 2-2 no bad losses but has no ranked wins either. 

[Dogbone]

I agree the ranking is  odd but to me the bigger question is should we be ranking this many guys?  

I get that 33 guys make NCAAs (so we rank 32) but with only 77(6)? teams, that is ranking  ~42% of the field.  And like most bell curves there isn't a lot of separation between the middle guys.   The difference is probably just as much schedule related (who has loses to whom).  If Block and Singleton had swapped scheduled, they might have similar results and Block would be unranked.   

Of course the obvious reason is Flo is a business that relies on page views and subscriptions so putting a guy with Iowa singlet higher is probably better for business. 

[PencilNeck]

until there is enough data, wrestlers with cool names tend to get slightly overrated.

[JimmyCinnabon]

Flo's rankings are meaningless though. I wouldn't even pay attention to them.

[strange_daze]

Real question: do Flo rankings have a discernible or tangible influence over actual seedings? If not, fine; then they're content for the fans and a topic for debate on message boards. I agree with the OP though: I can't quite get my head around Block at 18. Even 125 for the Hawks is showing some glimmers of hope--141 not so much.