Bidenomics is working says Wall Street

[Scouts Honor]

1 hour ago, billyhoyle said:

There are multiple forms of student loan forgiveness written into current law that authorizes the federal government to provide student loans.  These are public service loan forgiveness and forgiveness forgiveness from income driven repayment.  These aren't handouts but part of the "deal" that people make when they take out student loans. These programs allow for social mobility and for poor people to attend college and graduate/professional schools.

 

i remember seeing nothing like this in my loans or my daughters loans.

there are some loans that have forgiveness clauses....but that's not whats going on.

she almost got some of hers forgiven... but didn't qualify

they are handouts... and many to cronies

 

you might be thinking about pell grants and other programs. 

[billyhoyle]

4 minutes ago, Scouts Honor said:

i remember seeing nothing like this in my loans or my daughters loans.

there are some loans that have forgiveness clauses....but that's not whats going on.

she almost got some of hers forgiven... but didn't qualify

they are handouts... and many to cronies

 

you might be thinking about pell grants and other programs. 

No, I'm referring to the federal student loan program. you can get forgiveness through the public service loan forgiveness program (10 years), as well as through income driven repayment plans when working in the private sector (20-25 years). These provision are written into law and are a part of the federal student loan program. 

[Scouts Honor]

4 minutes ago, billyhoyle said:

No, I'm referring to the federal student loan program. you can get forgiveness through the public service loan forgiveness program (10 years), as well as through income driven repayment plans when working in the private sector (20-25 years). These provision are written into law and are a part of the federal student loan program. 

right i agree.

but that's not who was getting loan forgiveness in biden's exulted loan forgiveness sweeps

[Paul158]

1 hour ago, billyhoyle said:

There are multiple forms of student loan forgiveness written into current law that authorizes the federal government to provide student loans.  These are public service loan forgiveness and forgiveness forgiveness from income driven repayment.  These aren't handouts but part of the "deal" that people make when they take out student loans. These programs allow for social mobility and for poor people to attend college and graduate/professional schools.

Many students believe that the requirements for forgiveness should be less stringent (e.g. decreasing the required payments or years for IDR or PSLF).  It's perfectly fine to think that the current law is fine and doesn't need to be made less stringent, but the concept of loan forgiveness is already written into law. BTW, I agree that all student loans shouldn't just be magically forgiven, but I don't think something like the SAVE plan that was implemented is ridiculous.

The concept of just saying "tips aren't taxable" is pulled out of thin air, and it's pure populism. What is the point of that? Why do one specific class of workers no longer have to pay income tax on their income?

Are you aware the Federal Government along with State Governments gives out 130 billion dollars in financial aid every year. This is not loans it is financial aid. For those who need help going to college. Now the Biden administration says we need to just forgive everyone's student loans. I have heard where some people have racked up 200K in loans for 6 years of college. The Biden Admin. forgave the whole thing. The lady works at Harvard University. No one every brings up the amount of money that is already given in aid to students. 

[Paul158]

7 minutes ago, billyhoyle said:

No, I'm referring to the federal student loan program. you can get forgiveness through the public service loan forgiveness program (10 years), as well as through income driven repayment plans when working in the private sector (20-25 years). These provision are written into law and are a part of the federal student loan program. 

These have been around for a long time and are completely different than what Biden Administration is doing, handing out 250 Billion dollars in debt transfer loan forgiveness. Yes, Biden is just transferring the debt of the student to the taxpayer. You and I are paying for their loans. It's just debt transfer to other hardworking Americans. Biden and now Kamala are buying votes. This vote buying could win them the election.

[billyhoyle]

1 hour ago, Paul158 said:

These have been around for a long time and are completely different than what Biden Administration is doing, handing out 250 Billion dollars in debt transfer loan forgiveness. Yes, Biden is just transferring the debt of the student to the taxpayer. You and I are paying for their loans. It's just debt transfer to other hardworking Americans. Biden and now Kamala are buying votes. This vote buying could win them the election.

I know it's different-I agree that the legality of what Biden did is questionable. I'm just saying the concept of student loan forgiveness isn't novel and is part of the law itself. 

[scourge165]

11 hours ago, Scouts Honor said:

i dont disagree, but when Trump said it... lots of leftists got the vapors 

Oh bullshit. Trump said it like a Month ago. 

 

A "lot of leftists?" I remember seeing some peripheral articles about how it would raise costs or...some other minor shit, but PLEASE don't tell me how "the left" was all up in arms about THAT Trump comment.

This was roughly the same time he was telling people this would be the last election they'd ever need to vote in...

 

BUT, it's funny, it was JUST Harris who was pandering because she "saw the polls," and knew how many people in Vegas rely on tips and that's what delegitimized it. So I pointed out Trump said the same thing and it's "well yeah but "the left." 

No, there are some economists who have talked about how it could lead to higher prices and...other larger economic issues, but this was not panned by "the left."

I really need to understand the double standard here though. Again, Harris says it and it's pandering. Trump says it after a waitress gets up and speaks and it's....what? Somehow NOT pandering?

 

[scourge165]

14 hours ago, billyhoyle said:

In some states, servers are required to be paid at least minimum wage (not counting tips) + benefits if they are full time. The solution to restaurants not paying a living wage isn’t to create an arbitrary group of tax-free employees-it’s to pay actual salary. 

I'm not disagreeing. I'm actually indifferent and not well-informed on the issue.

I'm simply TAKING issue with the fact that when Harris does it, it's somehow...bad because she's "looking at the polling," in Nevada...but Trump did it because a waitress in Wisconsin said they're taxing too much of her tips. 

 

The program itself, how it impacts restaurants...I just spent about 3 minutes browsing a WSJ article on why SOME economists are against it.

My issue was more the double standard. Harris suggests it=Bad, Trump=....crickets. Hell, whoever brought it up on here clearly didn't even know Trump proposed it.

 

Edit-I didn't even realize, it was YOU and Scout.

Trump actually came up with this one first for better or worse.

He heard the women in Wisconsin talk about it, and realized how popular it was. 

Why are you not calling THAT out as "idiotic populism?" Or are you?

 

Also...why is Scout nodding like a bobble head doll?

Quote

I’m sure they saw a poll in Nevada showing how popular it is. It’s idiotic populism to just deem tips as a form of tax free income. Why should waiters pay no taxes while janitors and cooks do? 

 

 

https://www.ibtimes.com/how-1-waitress-got-both-trump-harris-change-tax-policy-3739606

Edited August 13 by scourge165

[scourge165]

13 hours ago, Offthemat said:

Prior to covid hitting, blue collar wage increases were outpacing white collar increases.  Trump turned over a fast recovering economy that Biden then proceeded to shut down. 
If tariffs on China were bad for Americans, is that why Biden has kept them in place?

Please, tell me you don't know how trade wars without telling me you don't know how trade wars work?

[scourge165]

15 hours ago, Paul158 said:

With all due respect I will stay with my synopsis of what occurred under President trump, what happened during and presently during the Biden/Harris administration and where we are right now. I will stick with the numbers that were on my thread. 

Sure. And I will stand by my synopsis of how Trump inheriting an exponentially better economy than Biden did and Trump ignoring Covid and dismantling the ENTIRE pandemic response apparatus around the WORLD is why it's lazy and ignorant to just give him a pass for the 14 TRILLION dollars Covid Cost the US Gov't.

Same with the pretending to shut down all flights in and out of China without ACTUALLY doing so. 

 

Here's a number that you CANNOT deny. INCOME under Joe Biden has outpaced inflation...and now wages are catching up. 

[scourge165]

6 hours ago, billyhoyle said:

I know it's different-I agree that the legality of what Biden did is questionable. I'm just saying the concept of student loan forgiveness isn't novel and is part of the law itself. 

The Cost of College has gotten absolutely insane. 

There's absolutely no doubt if you just canceled all student loan debt in the US right now, the Economy would benefit from it...tremendously.

And then you'd be back in the same place in 4-5 years. 

 

I'd like to see a hybrid system put in place(this would never happen and it's poorly thought out, but I think it'd be a good idea).

Every student takes a year off of school between HS and College unless they have a VERY specific field they want to get into. STEM would be an obvious one. They want to be an Engineer, cool. 

Otherwise, the people just going because that's the next box on their parents to check off, they could spend a year in a modern day CCC type program. You spend 3 months in California building affordable houses.

You spend 3 months digging wells somewhere else. 

You spend 3 months just digging ditches.

 

I'm sure I'll hear shit about this as it's not a good idea and we're on the Political thing right now, but if you do that, if you spend a year learning different real-world skills, being of SOME use to the US Gov't(you could spend 3 months working on road construction, I'm sure there's plenty of infrastructure programs to work on with the state of our country and the outdated grid, bridges among other things)...

Then you're eligible for some type of grant if you choose to go to College. And I'd imagine a LOT more students would have a much better idea, not waste a year of College and get to work on an actual, degree that's going to either allow you to repay those loans as opposed to a Philosophy degree where you go and manage a Dollar General after school.

 

I'd also be personally willing to help pay for more people to get sociology degrees. One that teaches people HOW to think for themselves.

A little financial literacy would come a long way. I just talked to a VERY intelligent College-educated man, a former Wrestler, Coach, someone who's done well financially...and he didn't know what compound interest was. 

 

*That's one area I think this generation is better educated than others. There's a lot of bullshit about Crypto(some of it's not bullshit as states are not investing in it s part of pension funds) and those stupid meme stocks, but I think people understand better how to accumulate wealth via the market and long term investing.

But we need to gut Higher Education in this Country and try and start over(at least state schools). It costs several times more(relative to the cost of living IIRC) for kids to go to school now than it did in the 70s, 80s, and even 90s. 

Maybe offer to pay for more 2 year degrees so more people get into plumbing, welding, fields that are sorely lacking skilled labor. That could be another avenue to helping solve SOME issues. 

[Offthemat]

3 hours ago, scourge165 said:

Sure. And I will stand by my synopsis of how Trump inheriting an exponentially better economy than Biden did and Trump ignoring Covid and dismantling the ENTIRE pandemic response apparatus around the WORLD is why it's lazy and ignorant to just give him a pass for the 14 TRILLION dollars Covid Cost the US Gov't.

Same with the pretending to shut down all flights in and out of China without ACTUALLY doing so. 

 

Here's a number that you CANNOT deny. INCOME under Joe Biden has outpaced inflation...and now wages are catching up. 

O’Bama responded to Trump saying he would increase the GDP and improve the economy, saying “What’s he gonna do, wave his magic wand?”  Then Trump did it, with a less than cooperative congress. 

3 hours ago, scourge165 said:

The Cost of College has gotten absolutely insane. 

There's absolutely no doubt if you just canceled all student loan debt in the US right now, the Economy would benefit from it...tremendously.

And then you'd be back in the same place in 4-5 years. 

 

I'd like to see a hybrid system put in place(this would never happen and it's poorly thought out, but I think it'd be a good idea).

Every student takes a year off of school between HS and College unless they have a VERY specific field they want to get into. STEM would be an obvious one. They want to be an Engineer, cool. 

Otherwise, the people just going because that's the next box on their parents to check off, they could spend a year in a modern day CCC type program. You spend 3 months in California building affordable houses.

You spend 3 months digging wells somewhere else. 

You spend 3 months just digging ditches.

 

I'm sure I'll hear shit about this as it's not a good idea and we're on the Political thing right now, but if you do that, if you spend a year learning different real-world skills, being of SOME use to the US Gov't(you could spend 3 months working on road construction, I'm sure there's plenty of infrastructure programs to work on with the state of our country and the outdated grid, bridges among other things)...

Then you're eligible for some type of grant if you choose to go to College. And I'd imagine a LOT more students would have a much better idea, not waste a year of College and get to work on an actual, degree that's going to either allow you to repay those loans as opposed to a Philosophy degree where you go and manage a Dollar General after school.

 

I'd also be personally willing to help pay for more people to get sociology degrees. One that teaches people HOW to think for themselves.

A little financial literacy would come a long way. I just talked to a VERY intelligent College-educated man, a former Wrestler, Coach, someone who's done well financially...and he didn't know what compound interest was. 

 

*That's one area I think this generation is better educated than others. There's a lot of bullshit about Crypto(some of it's not bullshit as states are not investing in it s part of pension funds) and those stupid meme stocks, but I think people understand better how to accumulate wealth via the market and long term investing.

But we need to gut Higher Education in this Country and try and start over(at least state schools). It costs several times more(relative to the cost of living IIRC) for kids to go to school now than it did in the 70s, 80s, and even 90s. 

Maybe offer to pay for more 2 year degrees so more people get into plumbing, welding, fields that are sorely lacking skilled labor. That could be another avenue to helping solve SOME issues. 

Tell me you’re not a communist without telling me you’re a communist. 

[billyhoyle]

4 hours ago, scourge165 said:

I'm not disagreeing. I'm actually indifferent and not well-informed on the issue.

I'm simply TAKING issue with the fact that when Harris does it, it's somehow...bad because she's "looking at the polling," in Nevada...but Trump did it because a waitress in Wisconsin said they're taxing too much of her tips. 

 

The program itself, how it impacts restaurants...I just spent about 3 minutes browsing a WSJ article on why SOME economists are against it.

My issue was more the double standard. Harris suggests it=Bad, Trump=....crickets. Hell, whoever brought it up on here clearly didn't even know Trump proposed it.

 

Edit-I didn't even realize, it was YOU and Scout.

Trump actually came up with this one first for better or worse.

He heard the women in Wisconsin talk about it, and realized how popular it was. 

Why are you not calling THAT out as "idiotic populism?" Or are you?

 

Also...why is Scout nodding like a bobble head doll?

 

https://www.ibtimes.com/how-1-waitress-got-both-trump-harris-change-tax-policy-3739606

Where did you see that I liked it when Trump did it? You think I like that we have a candidate telling his followers to write “vote Trump for no tax on tips” whenever they’re in a restaurant? 

[ionel]

4 hours ago, scourge165 said:

 

Here's a number that you CANNOT deny. INCOME under Joe Biden has outpaced inflation.

source?

[Caveira]

On 8/11/2024 at 9:01 PM, Scouts Honor said:

suddenly

no taxes on tips is a good idea..

i wonder why

 

[Scouts Honor]

11 hours ago, scourge165 said:

Oh bullshit. Trump said it like a Month ago. 

 

A "lot of leftists?" I remember seeing some peripheral articles about how it would raise costs or...some other minor shit, but PLEASE don't tell me how "the left" was all up in arms about THAT Trump comment.

This was roughly the same time he was telling people this would be the last election they'd ever need to vote in...

 

BUT, it's funny, it was JUST Harris who was pandering because she "saw the polls," and knew how many people in Vegas rely on tips and that's what delegitimized it. So I pointed out Trump said the same thing and it's "well yeah but "the left." 

No, there are some economists who have talked about how it could lead to higher prices and...other larger economic issues, but this was not panned by "the left."

I really need to understand the double standard here though. Again, Harris says it and it's pandering. Trump says it after a waitress gets up and speaks and it's....what? Somehow NOT pandering?

 

why did she change her position? 

[Scouts Honor]

11 hours ago, scourge165 said:

The Cost of College has gotten absolutely insane. 

 

do you have any idea why? 

[mspart]

On 8/13/2024 at 7:49 AM, ionel said:

source?

Well, those numbers show wages did not keep up with inflation, in fact real wages went down because of inflation.  

mspart

 

 

[billyhoyle]

On 8/12/2024 at 7:09 PM, Scouts Honor said:

i remember seeing nothing like this in my loans or my daughters loans.

there are some loans that have forgiveness clauses....but that's not whats going on.

she almost got some of hers forgiven... but didn't qualify

they are handouts... and many to cronies

 

you might be thinking about pell grants and other programs. 

Did she have federal or private loans? 

[Caveira]

On 8/11/2024 at 9:01 PM, Scouts Honor said:

suddenly

no taxes on tips is a good idea..

i wonder why

we need more joy in the economy