Snyder vs Sanderson

[headshuck]

Today there’s a discussion of

Snyder as an all-time HWT great. But he’s really a big 197. How would the best Snyder do vs Sanderson, Hartung, Hahn, etc?

[Hammerlock3]

i don't think he was a big 197, he was a tweener HWY, should have been there every year.

[MPhillips]

2 minutes ago, Hammerlock3 said:

i don't think he was a big 197,

230?

[Hammerlock3]

5 minutes ago, MPhillips said:

230?

i mean i don't think he was ever a 197...or for clarification he never should have been at that weight, despite weighing in

Edited May 31 by Hammerlock3

[Le duke]

i mean i don't think he was ever a 197...or for clarification he never should have been at that weight, despite weighing in

If their starter at 285 had been a legit point scorer, it makes sense. But their 285 that year was 12-12 and went BBQ at NCAAs.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Hammerlock3]

3 minutes ago, Le duke said:

 

If their starter at 285 had been a legit point scorer, it makes sense. But their 285 that year was 12-12 and went BBQ at NCAAs.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ok so are you saying tOSU made a bad choice or I'm wrong because they would have made the right one?

[headshuck]

Remember this was before the portal bidding system existed.

[Le duke]

ok so are you saying tOSU made a bad choice or I'm wrong because they would have made the right one?

I’m saying you are right and tOSU was wrong.

Kyle Snyder shouldn’t have ever weighed in at 197.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[AgaveMaria]

Cael would be too fast for him.

Even though Cael did not like wrestling physical types and bulls he would have picked Snyder apart with takedowns. This IF Snyder could drop down to 197 for the matches in College Prime condition.

 

[jackwebster]

4 hours ago, AgaveMaria said:

Even though Cael did not like wrestling physical types and bulls he would have picked Snyder apart with takedowns.

 

Like that Sajidov guy? Picked that dude's pocket, right? I know it's sacrilege to mock him, but we shouldn't just give Sanderson the fantasy win. 

 

Edit: Of course, Sanderson does win at the stipulated 197. At catch weight, idk.

Edited May 31 by jackwebster

[nhs67]

Being that the word from everyone who has said anything about 'in the room' action as far as now goes - Sanderson NOW owns the room against what should be the best version of Snyder EVER.

[Gus]

9 minutes ago, nhs67 said:

Being that the word from everyone who has said anything about 'in the room' action as far as now goes - Sanderson NOW owns the room against what should be the best version of Snyder EVER.

The question is whether or not we actually believe that. If so, Cael could be an olympic champion at 97kg right now.

[nhs67]

2 minutes ago, Gus said:

The question is whether or not we actually believe that. If so, Cael could be an olympic champion at 97kg right now.

He doesn't train to compete.  He's old.  I am 30 years away from my competition days, and I can still throw around guys who are 30lbs heavier and going on to D1/D2 competition.  Edit:  In practice, mind you.

That said, if the guys in the room are the ones saying it, then there really isn't an argument to be had against it.

I don't makes the rules.

Edited May 31 by nhs67

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

5 minutes ago, nhs67 said:

He doesn't train to compete.  He's old.  I am 30 years away from my competition days, and I can still throw around guys who are 30lbs heavier and going on to D1/D2 competition.  Edit:  In practice, mind you.

That said, if the guys in the room are the ones saying it, then there really isn't an argument to be had against it.

I don't makes the rules.

There is a lot going on here.  

Big brother-y type stuff can come into play.

Familiarity

The fact that Snyder has the fatigue associated with going hard every single day, whereas Cael can pick and choose when he goes hard.

Coaches also are known for picking advantageous times to wrestle a fatigued athlete during practice.

If only there was a data point of Coach Cael putting it on the line vs. the best in the world!  Alas, he retired in 2004...

[Caveira]

13 minutes ago, nhs67 said:

He doesn't train to compete.  He's old.  I am 30 years away from my competition days, and I can still throw around guys who are 30lbs heavier and going on to D1/D2 competition.  Edit:  In practice, mind you.

That said, if the guys in the room are the ones saying it, then there really isn't an argument to be had against it.

I don't makes the rules.

There are old Iowa haters that refute stories about elder dan gable in the room all the time.  I wonder if they really don’t have an argument given the stories come from Iowa room guys.  

[Hammerlock3]

10 hours ago, Le duke said:

I’m saying you are right and tOSU was wrong.

Kyle Snyder shouldn’t have ever weighed in at 197.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

thanks for clarifying. sometimes its hard to know when leave your sword in its scabbard around here.

[Paul158]

I would have loved to see a round robin, best of 3 matches between Sadulaev, Sanderson and Snyder in their prime. That would be 4 matches for each wrestler. At 206 pounds. I believe Sadulaev wins it. The matches would be very competitive. Snyder and Sanderson would be a toss up.

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

4 minutes ago, Paul158 said:

I would have loved to see a round robin, best of 3 matches between Sadulaev, Sanderson and Snyder in their prime. That would be 4 matches for each wrestler. At 206 pounds. I believe Sadulaev wins it. The matches would be very competitive. Snyder and Sanderson would be a toss up.

Sanderson was never in the argument for "best in the world."  The other two have been.  

Sanderson is an all-time  American great, but no one out the the US would consider him much more than a one hit wonder.  His NCAA and coaching accomplishments have inflated his international achievements.  Similar stuff happened with Dan Gable.

Edited May 31 by Interviewed_at_Weehawken

[Paul158]

1 minute ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Sanderson was never in the argument for "best in the world."  The other two have been.  

Sanderson is an all-time  American great, but no one out the the US would consider him much more than a one hit wonder.

I still think it would have been some great wrestling and I would have paid 100.00 to watch it on PPV.

[Hammerlock3]

Folk made Sanderson bulletproof. His incredibility fluidity, creativity and "freeness" made controlling him seemingly impossible. The way free makes you vulnerable really hurt him.

There is also the question of if Romero was invoking any cuban traditions at the olympic games.

[Paul158]

Snyder is a great wrestler, but I think his prime was when he was in college wrestling a tough heavyweight schedule. In addition to his freestyle wrestling. He just seemed to be a little sharper and more physical. 

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

2 minutes ago, Hammerlock3 said:

Folk made Sanderson bulletproof. His incredibility fluidity, creativity and "freeness" made controlling him seemingly impossible. The way free makes you vulnerable really hurt him.

There is also the question of if Romero was invoking any cuban traditions at the olympic games.

Are you saying the US may have bribed Yoel Romero?

[Paul158]

2 minutes ago, Hammerlock3 said:

Folk made Sanderson bulletproof. His incredibility fluidity, creativity and "freeness" made controlling him seemingly impossible. The way free makes you vulnerable really hurt him.

There is also the question of if Romero was invoking any cuban traditions at the olympic games.

100 percent. 

 

[Hammerlock3]

1 minute ago, Interviewed_at_Weehawken said:

Are you saying the US may have bribed Yoel Romero?

I've heard it muttered consistently. But probably shouldn't have mentioned it...but Cael's legacy and reputation can take it.

[Interviewed_at_Weehawken]

Just now, Hammerlock3 said:

I've heard it muttered consistently. But probably shouldn't have mentioned it...but Cael's legacy and reputation can take it.

I spent a couple weeks at the OTC around the time Cael made his debut.  I had conversations with a prominent coach or two and the topic of bribery came up.  The gist at the time was: "other countries do that... the US cannot and will not."

I'm not saying it is impossible that Romero was bribed, but seemed unlikely a few years before.  

I generally saw Cubans taking dives in finals, too.  Didn't they have a ridiculous finals losing streak at some point?  Like 8 straight losses or something?