Do you see Spencer Lee leaving Iowa?

[BruceyB]

19 hours ago, BAC said:

If Brands can't find someone to bring in who can push him, maybe do some sort of 6-month club swap, e.g. send him to Stillwater to roll around with Fix, RBY, Sakamoto, Figueroa, Spratley and Jax. Maybe OSU can send over Wyatt for 6 months to roll around with Dreshaun and Keuter. 

Is the Oklahoma State commit is spending a lot of time in the Hawkeye wrestling room?

[Dogbone]

Spencer will be fine at Iowa.  Winning Worlds is hard.   

Only Spencer could win Oly Silver and then get criticized for not sweeping the next cycle like its an easy thing to do.

[neweruser69]

Should he, probably.

Will he? I doubt it.

The Brands have their talons deep deep in him, they can't afford to see him move on.

Hell, he probably should've moved on years ago after they made it perfectly clear they were willing to sacrifice his knees for temporary rewards. 

[BruceyB]

10 minutes ago, Dogbone said:

Spencer will be fine at Iowa.  Winning Worlds is hard.   

Only Spencer could win Oly Silver and then get criticized for not sweeping the next cycle like its an easy thing to do.

If Harutyunyan made the finals and pulled Spencer back in and he took a bronze, then I don't think this noise is anywhere near as loud. 

If Khadi didn't pull Dake back in 2021, everyone would have said that Burroughs should have been the guy at the Olympics.

Repechage is a fickle b1tch.

At the end of the day, I don't think Spencer respected Harutyunyan enough, and it cost him. You can't take any match for granted at Worlds, and to me it looked like Spencer went into the match thinking he was the better wrestler and would win, and when Harutyunyan gave him more than he was expecting, he couldn't regroup mid-match and it snowballed. IMO it was kind of similar to the US Open match between Mesenbrink and Carr where Mesenbrink won a couple of early exchanges and things just unraveled for Carr leading to a tech.

My biggest question with Spencer is whether or not he still loves wrestling. After being denied his 4th HS state title, the battles with knee injuries from his senior year of high school in 2018 until preparation for the 2024 Olympics, the pin in the NCAA semis to stop him from being a four-time NCAA champ.. you have to imagine he has some demons to battle after giving so much to the sport and feeling let down by shocking losses when all eyes are on him, and by his own body when just as he's feeling fully healthy again, another heartbreaking injury and long road of recovery takes place again.

[ionel]

29 minutes ago, BruceyB said:

you have to imagine he has some demons to battle 

Don't forget the jimmy affect.  

[BruceyB]

33 minutes ago, BruceyB said:

My biggest question with Spencer is whether or not he still loves wrestling. After being denied his 4th HS state title, the battles with knee injuries from his senior year of high school in 2018 until preparation for the 2024 Olympics, the pin in the NCAA semis to stop him from being a four-time NCAA champ.. you have to imagine he has some demons to battle after giving so much to the sport and feeling let down by shocking losses when all eyes are on him, and by his own body when just as he's feeling fully healthy again, another heartbreaking injury and long road of recovery takes place again.

Sorry to quote myself but I wanted to add on to this last part. 

I can't help but wonder how much of Spencer at this point in his career feels like he has to finish out this quad because if he doesn't win a world and Olympic title, he will look back on his career with resentment and the feeling of failure, despite all of his success. I wonder if he still enjoys the process and competing or if he is doing it simply because he feels like he has to win a World and Olympic title to feel at peace about his career.

If any of you haven't watched the Kolat documentary on Flo (you're missing out, it's unbelievable btw), he says when he looks back on his career, he sees failure. He was "only" a two-time NCAA champion when he wanted 4. He wanted to be the greatest international wrestler that ever lived, but he (for various reasons) was never able to win a World or Olympic title. You can hear the disappointment and hurt in his voice when he talks about his perceived shortcomings in his own career. I can't help but think that Spencer knows that this is probably the last quad where he has a chance to achieve everything that he's worked for his entire life, and that after failing to win his 4th state title, and his 4th NCAA title, there are greater internal doubts and feelings of pressure than ever making it extremely difficult to wrestle freely and with enjoyment.

[Caveira]

1 hour ago, neweruser69 said:

Should he, probably.

Will he? I doubt it.

The Brands have their talons deep deep in him, they can't afford to see him move on.

Hell, he probably should've moved on years ago after they made it perfectly clear they were willing to sacrifice his knees for temporary rewards. 

Be specific.  What did they do to his knees ?

[ionel]

34 minutes ago, Caveira said:

Be specific.  What did they do to his knees ?

 ... threw em to the wolves ... 

[Caveira]

10 minutes ago, ionel said:

 ... threw em to the wolves ... 

that lacks.  What word am I looking for.  Specifics.  
 

was it the pitch count ?     Was it not going live with Ayala all that much?   Was it the year they had him get his knees repaired surgically ?     Was it that year he basically only did cardio and didn’t wrestle in the top. Because they were protecting his knees?

[CHROMEBIRD]

1 hour ago, BruceyB said:

Sorry to quote myself but I wanted to add on to this last part. 

I can't help but wonder how much of Spencer at this point in his career feels like he has to finish out this quad because if he doesn't win a world and Olympic title, he will look back on his career with resentment and the feeling of failure, despite all of his success. I wonder if he still enjoys the process and competing or if he is doing it simply because he feels like he has to win a World and Olympic title to feel at peace about his career.

If any of you haven't watched the Kolat documentary on Flo (you're missing out, it's unbelievable btw), he says when he looks back on his career, he sees failure. He was "only" a two-time NCAA champion when he wanted 4. He wanted to be the greatest international wrestler that ever lived, but he (for various reasons) was never able to win a World or Olympic title. You can hear the disappointment and hurt in his voice when he talks about his perceived shortcomings in his own career. I can't help but think that Spencer knows that this is probably the last quad where he has a chance to achieve everything that he's worked for his entire life, and that after failing to win his 4th state title, and his 4th NCAA title, there are greater internal doubts and feelings of pressure than ever making it extremely difficult to wrestle freely and with enjoyment.

Could be that he's putting additional pressure on himself to raise his career stock if he really wants to be a coach, AD, or college administrator. Not that his current accolades aren't already impressive as hell...

[Room Guy]

This guy is a Silver Medalist in the God damn Olympic Games. An absolute stud. Why is he talked about like he’s a sad story and held to such an unreasonable standard? So many things have to go right to win all the time. 

[The Kid]

31 minutes ago, Room Guy said:

This guy is a Silver Medalist in the God damn Olympic Games. An absolute stud. Why is he talked about like he’s a sad story and held to such an unreasonable standard? So many things have to go right to win all the time. 

Some dude told me that Lee didn't live up to his expectations.  An Olympic silver medal is super impressive.  

[Mr. PeanutButter]

I can't remember the last time another wrestler received as much scrutiny and criticism as Lee has since starting college. Every single time he has had a bad match, let alone a loss, the comments would swarm in about how he's cooked, Iowa is cooked, the Brands have failed him/cudgled him/abused him, Dan Dennis should be fired, and all his practice partners over the years - Ayala, DeSanto, Real Woods, Jaydin and others - have been absolute bums.

Perhaps he should seek out some sort of change. Based on certain comments he has made in interviews the last couple years and how ridiculously self critical he can be after close matches or losses I think seeking out a sports psychologist or paying a visit to Carl's secret California witch doctor (the one that magically fixed Gilman's broken foot) is not a crazy thing.

But aside from that, the rhetoric around Lee has always surprised me. I'm an obviously biased Iowa fan but I really don't think other wrestlers get close to the same treatment