Arizona State - How does it shake out?

[Caveira]

  On 10/12/2024 at 7:01 PM, RegularStalling said:

Grad transfers that leave without influence aren’t. Not the case here. 

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Is there any evidence?   Were any rules broken?

[Hammerlock3]

  On 10/12/2024 at 7:01 PM, RegularStalling said:

Grad transfers that leave without influence aren’t. Not the case here. 

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are you counting money as influence? Those days are gone, money is baked in.

[WrestlingRash]

  On 10/11/2024 at 10:02 PM, RegularStalling said:

Pretty dense statement when the team has had 4-5 AAs every year for the last half decade.

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over the last 20 years, they have averaged 3 AAs. I stand by my statement. 

[D3 for LU]

I just couldn't help my self w/ the subject: ... How does it shake out?

... we now continue with the program, now in progress.

D3

[RegularStalling]

  On 10/13/2024 at 5:32 AM, WrestlingRash said:

over the last 20 years, they have averaged 3 AAs. I stand by my statement. 

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You had to go back to 2004 to even semi justify your comment. A comment I might add, that was entirely unrelated to original post. I’m sure you have something better to do than substantiate a straw-man argument. 

[wjd]

  On 10/13/2024 at 7:11 PM, RegularStalling said:

You had to go back to 2004 to even semi justify your comment. A comment I might add, that was entirely unrelated to original post. I’m sure you have something better to do than substantiate a straw-man argument. 

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So your quote is correct, but if you're gonna evaluate things, take the average since Zeke returned as coach. Or even better once his recruits started wrestling. All of the first class except Tanner Hall redshirted their freshman year.

[nhs67]

  On 10/14/2024 at 2:44 PM, wjd said:

So your quote is correct, but if you're gonna evaluate things, take the average since Zeke returned as coach. Or even better once his recruits started wrestling. All of the first class except Tanner Hall redshirted their freshman year.

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Keep adding asterisks, why don't we?

Let us only count the points at nationals from weights in which ASU had placers.  That should show that they're at worst the 2nd best program in the land.

Now, knowing that what I just said is stupid - let us evaluated based on their own measure of standards - a team trophy.  They have two team trophies in Zeke's time.  20% of the time.  That isn't good enough.  For a team that wants one every year, they have failed 80% of the time under Zeke.  That is subpar.

[RegularStalling]

  On 10/14/2024 at 3:08 PM, nhs67 said:

Keep adding asterisks, why don't we?

Let us only count the points at nationals from weights in which ASU had placers.  That should show that they're at worst the 2nd best program in the land.

Now, knowing that what I just said is stupid - let us evaluated based on their own measure of standards - a team trophy.  They have two team trophies in Zeke's time.  20% of the time.  That isn't good enough.  For a team that wants one every year, they have failed 80% of the time under Zeke.  That is subpar.

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It’s really not that hard. Evaluate the programs performance over the last 5 or so years. It’s been good. They’ve won two trophies. There’s about a dozen programs that want trophies every year and more often than not they don’t win them, are they failures too?

[nhs67]

  On 10/14/2024 at 8:20 PM, RegularStalling said:

It’s really not that hard. Evaluate the programs performance over the last 5 or so years. It’s been good. They’ve won two trophies. There’s about a dozen programs that want trophies every year and more often than not they don’t win them, are they failures too?

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By their own standards: Yes.

Do you not see Hawkeye fans everywhere preaching how the Brands bros, who are the 2nd most succsssful program behind Sanderson's Penn State, need to be fired and that they are shit coaches?  Their standard is #1.  They perform subpar when they do not attain a #1 finish at the end of the season.

Again, if you wish to throw all sorts of asterisks up there, we can say whoever we want is #2... or #3... or #4, etc.

If getting 4th twice in 20 years (not close to 3rd either time, btw) is elite to you, fine.  As I said before, I have no horse in that race just a different standard for what elite is.

I am going to enjoy watching many of their wrestlers because it is entertaining.

[BloodRound]

I need the breakdown of how Schultz is still in college.  Is this not like year 8 by now?

[MPhillips]

  On 10/15/2024 at 1:00 PM, BloodRound said:

I need the breakdown of how Schultz is still in college.  Is this not like year 8 by now?

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Season	Year	School	Rank/Plc	Weight	Record	Win %	Bonus %	RPI
2025	SR St	#23 Arizona State	#5	285	0 - 0	.00 %	.00 %	NA (NA)
2024	JR St	#16 Arizona State	#8 6th	285	12 - 4	75.00 %	37.50 %	0.682
2023	SO St	#5 Arizona State	#5 7th	285	23 - 4 (24 - 4)	85.19 %	53.57 %	0.681
2022	FR St	#9 Arizona State	#4 2nd	285	20 - 1 (22 - 1)	95.24 %	56.52 %	0.692
2021	RSFR St	#9 Arizona State	#9 4th	285	17 - 2 (16 - 2)	89.47 %	36.84 %	0.682
2020	FR  RS	#14 Arizona State

[nhs67]

  On 10/15/2024 at 1:00 PM, BloodRound said:

I need the breakdown of how Schultz is still in college.  Is this not like year 8 by now?

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It is his 6th year, not 8th.  Tanner Hall was in for 24 years before people noticed.  This should be nothing new for heavyweights at ASU.

That said, he hasn't even used a medical or an Oly-shirt, so there are quite a few that have been in for longer than he has.

[Hammerlock3]

  On 10/15/2024 at 1:56 PM, nhs67 said:

It is his 6th year, not 8th.  Tanner Hall was in for 24 years before people noticed.  This should be nothing new for heavyweights at ASU.

That said, he hasn't even used a medical or an Oly-shirt, so there are quite a few that have been in for longer than he has.

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He's someone that people are aware of but don't really think about a lot, those are the types that seem like they hang around forever. Counter example, everyone has kept track of starocci's eligibility.

[BloodRound]

  On 10/15/2024 at 1:56 PM, nhs67 said:

It is his 6th year, not 8th.  Tanner Hall was in for 24 years before people noticed.  This should be nothing new for heavyweights at ASU.

That said, he hasn't even used a medical or an Oly-shirt, so there are quite a few that have been in for longer than he has.

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Oh wow.  I could have sworn he would have taken at least an Oly.  Now that you mention it though, he did come in a year after Gable (if my poor memory serves me correctly)...

[1032004]

  On 10/15/2024 at 4:58 PM, Hammerlock3 said:

He's someone that people are aware of but don't really think about a lot, those are the types that seem like they hang around forever. Counter example, everyone has kept track of starocci's eligibility.

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It is interesting that some people (not me) seem upset that Starocci will have the chance to be a 5x champ.   But no one really cares about other guys who will have had 5 postseasons, other than to say they’re old.

Schultz will have an opportunity to be a 5x top-8 finisher, how many of those have there actually been so far?  Only one I can think of off the top of my head is Myles Amine but I’m sure there are more.

[Hammerlock3]

  On 10/20/2024 at 2:18 AM, 1032004 said:

It is interesting that some people (not me) seem upset that Starocci will have the chance to be a 5x champ.   But no one really cares about other guys who will have had 5 postseasons, other than to say they’re old.

Schultz will have an opportunity to be a 5x top-8 finisher, how many of those have there actually been so far?  Only one I can think of off the top of my head is Myles Amine but I’m sure there are more.

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Its cause Starocci is an a$$hole. 

Keckheisen? 

[MPhillips]

  On 10/20/2024 at 2:26 AM, Hammerlock3 said:

Its cause Starocci is an a$$hole. 

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[Wrestleknownothing]

  On 10/20/2024 at 2:18 AM, 1032004 said:

It is interesting that some people (not me) seem upset that Starocci will have the chance to be a 5x champ.   But no one really cares about other guys who will have had 5 postseasons, other than to say they’re old.

Schultz will have an opportunity to be a 5x top-8 finisher, how many of those have there actually been so far?  Only one I can think of off the top of my head is Myles Amine but I’m sure there are more.

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Only Amine and Fix, so far. Eierman had a shot, but got injured.

[1032004]

  On 10/20/2024 at 8:09 AM, Wrestleknownothing said:

Only Amine and Fix, so far. Eierman had a shot, but got injured.

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Thanks!  Do you know how many can do it this year?  At first glance, I see:

Schultz

Kerk

Elam

Starocci

Keckeisen

O’Toole

Parco

 

So this year will be the last year for guys who were freshmen in 2021 and wrestled 5 straight years.  But we’ll still have some more 5 season guys next year if they redshirted after 2021 (and probably still a couple after that if they redshirted twice)

[Hammerlock3]

  On 10/20/2024 at 7:43 AM, MPhillips said:

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Thats me talking about ferrari right?

[Wrestleknownothing]

  On 10/20/2024 at 11:07 AM, 1032004 said:

Thanks!  Do you know how many can do it this year?  At first glance, I see:

Schultz

Kerk

Elam

Starocci

Keckeisen

O’Toole

Parco

 

So this year will be the last year for guys who were freshmen in 2021 and wrestled 5 straight years.  But we’ll still have some more 5 season guys next year if they redshirted after 2021 (and probably still a couple after that if they redshirted twice)

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I believe that is the complete list

[wrestlingfan22]

  On 10/21/2024 at 4:43 PM, Wrestleknownothing said:

I believe that is the complete list

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Maybe Ferrari if he actually got a medical and Olympic redshirt in 2022 and 2024, I haven't seen anything confirming he did but some people have claimed he still has four years left. 

[GimJustafan]

  On 10/12/2024 at 7:01 PM, RegularStalling said:

Grad transfers that leave without influence aren’t. Not the case here. 

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well said 

[Wrestleknownothing]

  On 10/22/2024 at 1:24 PM, wrestlingfan22 said:

Maybe Ferrari if he actually got a medical and Olympic redshirt in 2022 and 2024, I haven't seen anything confirming he did but some people have claimed he still has four years left. 

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Ferrari can only get to four. He used up a year when he tried passing in a no passing zone. He wrestled too many matches that year to qualify for a medical.

[wrestlingfan22]

  On 10/22/2024 at 2:08 PM, Wrestleknownothing said:

Ferrari can only get to four. He used up a year when he tried passing in a no passing zone. He wrestled too many matches that year to qualify for a medical.

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that is what I had thought