Book Bans

[neutral]

There are folks in this thread using dishonest reasoning to justify book bans. 

[jross]

36 minutes ago, neutral said:

There are folks in this thread using dishonest reasoning to justify book bans. 

Please tell me more precisely what dishonest reasoning I'm using to support book bans.  

[neutral]

Who said I was talking about you?  If you think I was, maybe  you should apply some introspection and ask why?

[Bigbrog]

59 minutes ago, neutral said:

There are folks in this thread using dishonest reasoning to justify book bans. 

It is statements like this that drive me crazy...who the hell are you and how the hell do you claim to know if someone is being true to their statements???  Please explain how you know someone is dishonest in the things they say and believe.  And again, what books are being banned and what is the reasons that aren't true when explaining how some books aren't appropriate for certain age levels?

[Ban Basketball]

2 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

 And again, what books are being banned and what is the reasons that aren't true when explaining how some books aren't appropriate for certain age levels?

Thanks for proving my pernt and as to why I refused to send you links.  You deliberately WANT to keep yisself uninformed, ma'am.

You also know NOTHING about age appropriate materials in edgertashun, and only going by what your echo chambers tell you what to think. 

Stay out of eggakashun, unless you can speak to it in an informed way. 

 

[Ohio Elite]

7 minutes ago, Ban Basketball said:

Thanks for proving my pernt and as to why I refused to send you links.  You deliberately WANT to keep yisself uninformed, ma'am.

You also know NOTHING about age appropriate materials in edgertashun, and only going by what your echo chambers tell you what to think. 

Stay out of eggakashun, unless you can speak to it in an informed way. 

 

Can you translate that into to English?

[Ban Basketball]

Just now, Ohio Elite said:

Can you translate that into to English?

It should be VERY legible for several on here. 

Done did speak their language,  I's tell ya!

[Ohio Elite]

2 minutes ago, Ban Basketball said:

It should be VERY legible for several on here. 

Done did speak their language,  I's tell ya!

Engrish?

[Ban Basketball]

4 minutes ago, Ohio Elite said:

Engrish?

Like ionel ( except you weren't SO foolish as to actually "correct" it), none do you know,  but the joke's on you. 

How about the irony,  eh, friends?

[jross]

@neutral I'm the main person expressing specific reasons for support, and I am fully game to hear you explain how I'm being dishonest.

@Bigbrog is correct that you should be more specific when you accuse the crowd of dishonesty.

[neutral]

We are a few pages into this topic and not a single one of you has given a good reason for book bans.  We are not talking porn or smut.  We are talking Diary of Anne Frank, To Kill a Mockingbird, Maus, Catcher in the Rye, Farenheit 451, etc.  Just because you don't like the titles doesn't give you the right to have them removed for everyone else. 

[mspart]

You might add Huck Finn and Tom Sawyer to your list. 

mspart

[Plasmodium]

11 minutes ago, mspart said:

You might add Huck Finn and Tom Sawyer to your list. 

mspart

Let's do it.

[mspart]

Just now, Plasmodium said:

Let's do it.

Well, they have already been "banned" in certain places.  That's why I mentioned them. 

mspart

[jross]

19 minutes ago, neutral said:

We are a few pages into this topic and not a single one of you has given a good reason for book bans.  We are not talking porn or smut.  We are talking Diary of Anne Frank, To Kill a Mockingbird, Maus, Catcher in the Rye, Farenheit 451, etc.  Just because you don't like the titles doesn't give you the right to have them removed for everyone else. 

Key point: the books are still accessible for everyone outside the school!

If we engaged in a lengthy conversation, we would identify inappropriate content that you believe should have restricted access to children.   

We would likely align to support book bans on a case-by-case basis, preserving intellectual freedom, and age-appropriateness, and addressing (parental, educator, etc.) concerns through open communication and alternative options rather than outright censorship.  Examples... parental emails on books accessed, lib policy for parent permission to access targeted books, alternative assignments, etc.  

-------

@ThreePointTakedown seemed to agree with you initially, but later his statement: "I agree with parents in Cali. Well done." might support the parent's behavior to influence "Flamer" removal from the K-6 library.  (article link)

Have you been able to read into that situation?  Is Flamer appropriate for K-6 school libraries?

[jross]

1 hour ago, neutral said:

We are a few pages into this topic and not a single one of you has given a good reason for book bans.  We are not talking porn or smut.  We are talking Diary of Anne Frank, To Kill a Mockingbird, Maus, Catcher in the Rye, Farenheit 451, etc.  Just because you don't like the titles doesn't give you the right to have them removed for everyone else. 

What dishonesty has been presented in support of book bans at public schools?

Why should 6-year-olds have access to the graphic novel "Flamer" in their school library?

[ionel]

17 minutes ago, jross said:

What dishonesty has been presented in support of book bans at public schools?

Why should 6-year-olds have access to the graphic novel "Flamer" in their school library?

I've asked before and unanswered, why is this "banned" from 3rd grade?  Look at the colorful pictures.

[mspart]

24 minutes ago, ionel said:

I've asked before and unanswered, why is this "banned" from 3rd grade?  Look at the colorful pictures.

I thought this was a genius level question.   Of course no one could provide a response.  

I'll give it a go.    Thermodynamics is an advanced course of study for college level students.   It is wholly inappropriate to put this in an Elementary school library because it would do no student there any good at all.   As an aside, I knew a lot of college students that struggled with it as well.   It's not that it is bad for elementary school children, it just isn't applicable to their level of knowledge.  

On the other hand, Playboy and the like are not found in elementary school libraries.   Why?   Because it is beyond the experience level of those children and will harm them psychologically.   Heck it harms adults psychologically.   So then why is anyone pushing for books that tell in text the same or worse as has been demonstrated?   It is not a matter of banning, it is a matter of appropriateness for school age children.  

The government should not be in the business of peddling smut in the name of tolerance and equity.  If you disagree, I will expect you to be advocating for elementary school children to have access to online porn and hard copies of Playboy, Penthouse, etc.  A ridiculous premise to be sure.  

The books that are being "banned" are read aloud at school board meetings and they have to be stopped because of it's graphic and vile nature.   Yet, this content is appropriate for elementary school libraries?   Get a clue and use common sense. 

mspart

mspart

 

[Plasmodium]

43 minutes ago, mspart said:

I thought this was a genius level question.   Of course no one could provide a response.  

I'll give it a go.    Thermodynamics is an advanced course of study for college level students.   It is wholly inappropriate to put this in an Elementary school library because it would do no student there any good at all.   As an aside, I knew a lot of college students that struggled with it as well.   It's not that it is bad for elementary school children, it just isn't applicable to their level of knowledge.  

On the other hand, Playboy and the like are not found in elementary school libraries.   Why?   Because it is beyond the experience level of those children and will harm them psychologically.   Heck it harms adults psychologically.   So then why is anyone pushing for books that tell in text the same or worse as has been demonstrated?   It is not a matter of banning, it is a matter of appropriateness for school age children.  

The government should not be in the business of peddling smut in the name of tolerance and equity.  If you disagree, I will expect you to be advocating for elementary school children to have access to online porn and hard copies of Playboy, Penthouse, etc.  A ridiculous premise to be sure.  

The books that are being "banned" are read aloud at school board meetings and they have to be stopped because of it's graphic and vile nature.   Yet, this content is appropriate for elementary school libraries?   Get a clue and use common sense. 

mspart

mspart

 

I provided lots of responses to this question.

Chief among them is it is a waste of money because interest is low.  American kids these days are lazy as hell.  In China, this is standard fare for preschool.

[jross]

55 minutes ago, mspart said:

The books that are being "banned" are read aloud at school board meetings and they have to be stopped because of it's graphic and vile nature.   Yet, this content is appropriate for elementary school libraries?   Get a clue and use common sense. 

mspart

Brace yourself for the circus responses

• Stay in your lane.  Parents have no say in the curriculum because they are not qualified educators.
• Parents should trust educators to provide age-appropriate content.  
• You have given zero evidence for why you should get to impose personal beliefs on everyone.
• This goes against freedom of expression.
• We need to get these young children to think critically about what they read instead of shielding them from uncomfortable material.
• Nuh uh!  Cite your sources.

Edited October 17, 2023 by jross

[jross]

Why do schools block web traffic and certain keyword searches?

Why does the school email parents their child's keyword searches on school devices?

Why does the school use history books that omit historical facts?

[mspart]

46 minutes ago, jross said:

Why do schools block web traffic and certain keyword searches?

Why does the school email parents their child's keyword searches on school devices?

Why does the school use history books that omit historical facts?

Answer to all is them thar ejumacators know whatz byist fer yer chilren. 

mspart

[Ban Basketball]

1 hour ago, jross said:

Why do schools block web traffic and certain keyword searches? In fact,  my college blocks some content on our computers. 

Why does the school email parents their child's keyword searches on school devices?

Why does the school use history books that omit historical facts?

First two questions are easy and not objectionable.  

Not every single piece of history can get thrown into one text,  but if there's a glaring factual omission ( or several) I'd like to know. 

And,  if it happens,  that's an author's choice.  It's not a legislature cancelling that culture. 

Edited October 17, 2023 by Ban Basketball

[neutral]

6 hours ago, jross said:

What dishonesty has been presented in support of book bans at public schools?

Why should 6-year-olds have access to the graphic novel "Flamer" in their school library?

No six year olds are having it pushed in their faces.  It is in the YA section.  Again, you are being intellectually dishonest.

[jross]

26 minutes ago, neutral said:

No six year olds are having it pushed in their faces.  It is in the YA section.  Again, you are being intellectually dishonest.

Now who is dishonest?  

Did I say the book is shoved in their faces?

Is K-6 young adult?  

Edited October 18, 2023 by jross