scourge165

LOL...I've never seen someone this personally offended at the idea that you slightly change the rules in Wrestling. Do you lose a little power if that happens bud? Do you no longer get to pick which kid is too "ignorant" about Wrestling to stop it? What exactly personally offended YOU in the mere suggestion that the Bow and Arrow should MAY be banned as it's effectively a submission move? And I wasn't bragging about being in my 30s. Just replying to the inference that this was somehow self serving because...well, I just wasn't tough enough to deal with it!

Yeah, that's fair. But you're always going to have bad refs. If we start using that as a rationale to not change a rule... Plus, this is already the rule at the HS level. So if they can figure it out, I'm sure the College Refs can.

Jesus...this was NOT easy to get through. Yeah, I'm done pal. I'm in my 30s, I wrestled for 20 years. I don't need to pick another sport. I think I can still have an opinion on a move. What I can't do it decipher some of this nonsense and respond to it. No scenario was made up. You inferred it was SO outrageous that a kid could get hurt that in your wealth of experience..."I gave reffed for about 5 years…" you've NEVER seen anyone hurt from it. You still had to stop it. Oh and then apparently there were those other times; Huh...so all these times you've had to stop the bow and arrow, but it's NO different than any other move and there's no danger. And if a kid looks hurt...well, then he MUST be faking it! I made up a scenario? Huh...and what scenario did I "make up?" What did I post that didn't come DIRECTLY from you? Please by all means, post where I lied?

Seems like he's focusing on Greco now. How many guys that focus on Greco have regressed or failed to live up to the hype in College? It's a LONG list. Who's the last Greco guy to win a NC? Schultz could do it at HWT I guess. I don't think he will, but he's been in the finals. But who's the last guy who focused on Greco to win it in March?

LOL...ok. You've NEVER seen anyone hurt from this move(other than faking it I guess). But you STILL felt the need to stop it at the cadet level because you decided a kid was too ignorant and had no idea how to react...to the totally legal move? So what? Why is that a problem if injury is SUUUCH a far fetched idea? Do you also stop kids who don't know how to defend double legs? But sure, everyone who doesn't agree with you is ignorant.

No....that was an absolute ass whooping. You're right about that. Prescott looked TINY compared to Brands. Brands looked like a 49 pounder in modern Wrestling. MAYBE a big '41 and Prescott looked like a regular '25. If you're going best matches...that wasn't even competitive. Brands pushed him all over the mat and just dominated him. Prescott did have a couple of times where he could have gotten a tilt if Brands wasn't so much stronger. Brands did that with a few other guys who were on that level. Went down a rabbit hole and ended up watching about a dozen of his matches. Man, I do not like that guy, but he was a stud and he was intense. I'd kinda forgotten about that match, but I went back and watched it. Watching guys from that era, it feels like you can see how much more weight they were sucking also. The whole day to recover. Joe Williams for instance, he looked like a '74 pounder than a '58. New rules definitely a good thing there.

Yeah, I'm sure beating the two time reigning Hodge Trophy winner was a big incentive. AS was winning a Title at 4 different weights... I guess I'm being picky here. I'm talking about one match, bumping up, wrestling at a disadvantage to try and get the best matchup. Dake and Taylor was one of the best storylines in recent College Wrestling, so it certainly had the intrigue. Two of the best Wrestlers EVER...a 6 Finals between them, 5 Titles, one fluke-ish pin heading into their Sr years... But again, Dake was up all year and he was certainly at no disadvantage physically. Hell, I'm also not the gatekeeper of what "going up," means, so sure. I think Jordan and Dresser is my favorite though...Gable and Gant is pretty cool as well.

Really? You think Dean was dirty in that match? I just thought it was punishing...and looked bad. But dirty infers there was some ill will on his behalf. I will say that Amos is SO frustrating to watch. Like a LOT of Wrestlers in that 8-16 range, he could easily be in the top 4 and challenge the top guys, but it feels like it's mental. He started off with a headlock that...wouldn't work against a good varsity Wrestler and...probably wouldn't have been a slip it was so slow and Dean caught him. Seems like it's been a LOONG time since people were talking about him beating Ferrari in the NCAAs last year(before the season started). Why guys, especially guys who are good in both styles, wrestle Greco in the off-season is baffling. I think Lamont is another Greco guy, right? Outside of HWT, you almost always know a guys not going to progress in College by Wrestling Greco. /End Rant

Huh...I just thought the move should have been banned, but trying to figure out the intent behind it? I'd give the benefit of the doubt to Dean. He doesn't strike me as a dirty Wrestler. Despite suggestions otherwise, the Bow and Arrow IS legal and as such...he did nothing wrong. Well...that's not how they seed the Nationals, so...I don't see them making Yianni or Brooks a 9 seed. If we're going based on who we think, I'd make a few changes, but if we're goin based on how they actually seed it, this looks good.

I always said I could have been a GREAT HWT! Seriously though...I don't get how people can move after some of these meals. They just had a buy a Quarter pounder, get one for a buck. Well...I don't go to McDonalds often, but I can't pass up a deal like that! So, two Quarter Pounders with Cheese. I was on my back drooling 20 minutes later and felt like I could feel my stomach tearing(and I'm not a little guy). And yet, I've seen my Dad, a 55 year old man put away 2 Quarter Pounders, a Big Mac, a Flurry(large fry and a coke)...and then go to his 2 pound bag of M and Ms. He's 6'1 180 and has the energy of a 20 year old.

I guess it's 36:15....and now, that's NOT the direction the knee was "designed" to be bent. Which moves would you deem as being as dangerous? Lets just make the same rules as the High Schools. When start pulling the foot toward the head, then it's illegal.

Ooh...damn...I like this one. Wouldn't let Wrestlers start jogging around the Circle with 15 seconds left in a 1 point match...

So...as a ref, you arbitrarily stopped it because you were afraid the other kid...who in your estimation didn't understand the sport well enough...was going to get hurt? But your first sentence was that you'd never seen anything OTHER than a kid ACTING hurt because he just lost. Seems...contradictory, no?

No, my logic is pretty straight forward. Your argument that "the Forum" is contradictory because apparently there have been complaints about people working to ride and not turn(I don't know how to argue for "the Forum" to be clear, only my own opinion) then it's somehow at odds with the belief that a particular turn should be illegal is circular. I was using hyperbole to make a point. If we've determined SOME moves on top are dangerous or likely to cause injury, that supercedes the "Forums" desire to see more turns. Amos had his foot behind his head and his knee twisted. That's a good way to Spencer Lee a kid and serves no real purpose other than I guess serve as a strawman for those on the forum who have complained about not enough Wrestlers working for turns. Go to 35:50 and tell me that should be legal?

Yes...a full nelson would be a turning move...and it's illegal. So we've clearly decided simply attempting to turn a guy in and of itself doesn't make a move legal. This...and it was after Amos gave up 2 when his knee just buckled...so it was that same knee(didn't look serious)...but I see both sides to it. It's really not a technique, it's almost more like a submission. I don't think Amos could have put his shoulders down(which is an old coaches comment...if it hurts too bad or you can't breath, put your shoulders down).

People really think he's got a shot to beat Yianni again? That's a TALL order. That TD and NF totally changed the direction of the match. I still think Yianni's in that Starocci, Brooks, Lee group. Ahead of O'toole, RBY or anyone else as the favorites. I'll be pulling for Gomez, but...I don't know, it's asking a LOT.

I really did believe ya ionel!

This is boring. We've already established the OBVIOUS answer is Cox...so it's other than Cox. And yeah, it seems like the answer is nobody as of now, but the goal is to project out. Could it be a guy like Trumble who looks like he could be the perfect size for 97KG and is surprisingly athletic? Feldman? Could he wrestle at 97? He's gonna be a HWT in College, but...seems feasible he could make the cut at the next level. TJ Stewart? Young, talented...5 years away. The young Fishback? All of these are WAAY too premature, but that's what makes it fun...IMO. If Bastida can't Wrestle for Cuba or chooses not to or whatever it may be, and he competes for team USA, he's the more obvious choice after Cox. Remember...Coon did beat Snyder when that seemed like a real long shot. I would mention Ferrari, but...I'm prettys ure that Ferrari is full of nitrous oxide!

Dake and Taylor's the best of them all, but I don't really view that as the same. I'm talking about jumping up a weight above your normal weight(something you never see any longer). Dake just went up a weight each year...and he looked more like a '65 pounder than Taylor by the end of that year. Askren v Kish is a good one. I guess with Herbert and Askren Wrestling in the finals and then wrestling the exhibition later on when Herbert was still Wrestling, I forgot it was Kish. How about Jim Jordan vs Kevin Dresser? Jordan was the defending champ...was gonna wrestle 142, got WAXED 10-0 and Dresser sent his ass back down to 134! They weren't both champs yet, but, they would be a few months later.

Ok...I was thinking that was Gable's Soph year(so first year of competition). It says it was Feb of 1966(obviously an error) on Mike Gant's OU HOF page and I wasn't familiar with it myself.

You're right...you don't get all day to get ready after weigh in's. The turn around is much quicker... That's how you had Joe Williams wrestling 150 with a 28 inch waist. He was cutting his balls off. As were other Wrestlers. WAAAY past Glory levels. Does anyone here have any personal knowledge of Glory's issues OTHER than '25 is a difficult cut for him to maintain and wrestle at every weigh in, including a Friday and Saturday duel? And I'm not sure I see the "fear." He's staying at a weight where he's going to face(if well goes well) one of the greatest and most dominant Wrestlers ever.

Was that before Gable won a title though? I mean, either way it's a big one, but it feels more like Zain vs Stieber(unless I'm mistaken and Gable had already won a title).

I had no clue this was a rule. I could have sworn Kaukauna kids went out to the Best or the East or...maybe the Ironman.

I'd love to see Lee vs RBY(I also think it'd be kinda stupid given his health and how he's working his way back into it, but I'd still enjoy it). What's the closest we've seen to that? Abas and Guerrero? Askren v Herbert(I think Askren bumped up after his win his Jr year). What was the best match where a Wrestler bumped up to try and make a point?

I'm pretty sure he can. I don't think he fled Cuba. It's been...~10 years now that Cuba's allowed athletes to sign in Baseball without fleeing and they can go back to participate in the World Baseball Classic. But I don't know for certain...it'll be interesting. He's pretty damn explosive and would be a solid 97.