Kolat vs Bassett

[scourge165]

21 minutes ago, fishbane said:

He took 3rd at Midlands back in 1989.  Joe WIlliams is younger than Kolat and would not win the tournament until 5 years later in 1994.  This is a year after Kolat won Midlands for the first time.  In 1989 when Kolat placed third there were no significant post grad entries in his bracket.

I never said...nor inferred they were in the same weight or same year, I was pointing out the Midlands were a tougher tournament back then and cited one anecdotal example of a guy who wrestled in and won the tournament several more times after his Collegiate career ended.

 

2 hours ago, OH-IO said:

wait, being honest and straight forward BB will be 19 when he graduates from HS, seriously or is this????  doesnt change how much talent he has just just makes it less impressive, personally I was 17 and 9 months old when i graduated, at 19 i was totally different...for the better!  

 

its not like i havent heard of this (kids being much older while still in HS) before if we are being honest, i just didnt know BB was, well basically a Freshmen in college age wise but only a Junior in HS!  

I went to a school who was in my grade and born 2 years and 6 months before me. He was my same grade. 

A lot of things go into that. 

As long as you're still winning age-level World Medals, you're fine. 

 

I do feel like in College you start to get to the point of diminishing returns year 6 or when you're 24/25. You're not as fresh, you've got beaten up more. You have a bigger target.

This could be a lot of the Iowa 'runs their guys into the ground,' basis. Because they've had some guys transfer and as happens, you inevitably get beat up. 

 

 

Lot of pressure on this kid. A kid who's REALLY really good, but who is arguably 3rd in his class(Again, Forrest and Ross...who'd be my #1 if he choose Wrestling). 

Edited 6 hours ago by scourge165

[fishbane]

9 minutes ago, scourge165 said:

I never said...nor inferred they were in the same weight or same year, I was pointing out the Midlands were a tougher tournament back then and cited one anecdotal example of a guy who wrestled in and won the tournament several more times after his Collegiate career ended.

Pointing out that that Midlands were often tougher than NCAAs and guys like Joe Williams would wrestle in it after graduation are both not applicable to Kolat's 3rd place finish.  Selecting Joe Williams as your example was especially funny because he wouldn't wrestle in Midlands for another 5 years, but as I also pointed out there were no significant post grad entires in Kolat's bracket.  No post grad wrestler that had placed at the D1 NCAA tournament was in Kolat's bracket in 1989.  His bracket was not tougher than the 118 bracket at the 1990 NCAA tournament.  Both NCAA finalists and the 7th place finisher were there.  Kolat beat the 7th place finisher didn't wrestle the other two.  I think the presence of the 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 8th place finishers at NCAAs more than makes up for Kolat's absence.  The two facts you gave might be true of some weight at Midlands in 1989, but they were not true of Kolat's. 

[fishbane]

1 hour ago, fishbane said:

Bassett turned 18 in August of last year.  He will turn 19 in August of this year and graduate in June of next year.  I think this puts him two years older than if he had enrolled at the min age in PA.  However if he had done that he would have been one of the youngest graduates in his class like you probably were.

Kolat turned 18 in May of his junior year.  He turned 19 in may of his senior year.  I think this puts him a year older than enrollment at the min age.  Kolat had enrolled at the min age and famously intentionally failed 8th grade the first time through.

In cases like theirs (and all cases really) I think the hold back holds back wrestling development.  Kolat beat AAs in placing 3rd at the Midlands in Dec of 1989 when he was 16 years old.  He was too far ahead of his peers by the end of his junior year and would have been better off in a college room.  Bassett beat Anthony Ashnault 12-2 last spring at their last chance OTT qualifier when he was 17 years old.  Hard to imagine he gets much out of wrestling a high school schedule next year.

I was wrong about Bassett's age.  He was born January of 2007.  He just turned 18, so no double hold back or anything like that.  He will turn 19 in early January of his senior year in high school,  Kolat turned 19 in May of his senior year.  About a 4 month age diff.

[Truzzcat]

1 minute ago, fishbane said:

I was wrong about Bassett's age.  He was born January of 2007.  He just turned 18, so no double hold back or anything like that.  He will turn 19 in early January of his senior year in high school,  Kolat turned 19 in May of his senior year.  About a 4 month age diff.

no his birthdays in August hes 19 uww age if he was born in January he would still be 18 on their website I believe he confirmed his birthday was August 4th 2006.

[fishbane]

4 minutes ago, Truzzcat said:

no his birthdays in August hes 19 uww age if he was born in January he would still be 18 on their website I believe he confirmed his birthday was August 4th 2006.

I really don't know.  The Rudis website has his birthday as January 2007 - https://www.rudis.com/pages/athlete-detail-bo-bassett

[MPhillips]

10 minutes ago, scourge165 said:

I was wondering when Fried would get mentioned.

Fourth post...

The only disappointment regarding Phillips is a selfish one, in that we didn't get to see him in college. 

[Paul158]

1 hour ago, MPhillips said:

Fourth post...

The only disappointment regarding Phillips is a selfish one, in that we didn't get to see him in college. 

I remember him beating the NO.1 ranked wrestler from ST. EDs in the finals of the Ironman when he was a freshman. I believe the score wasn't even very close. What a talent. Little tiny Monroeville I think they had 4 4time state champs. Right at the same time almost. Did Phillips ever go to Fargo to wrestle?

Edited 3 hours ago by Paul158

[scourge165]

2 hours ago, fishbane said:

Pointing out that that Midlands were often tougher than NCAAs and guys like Joe Williams would wrestle in it after graduation are both not applicable to Kolat's 3rd place finish.  Selecting Joe Williams as your example was especially funny because he wouldn't wrestle in Midlands for another 5 years, but as I also pointed out there were no significant post grad entires in Kolat's bracket.  No post grad wrestler that had placed at the D1 NCAA tournament was in Kolat's bracket in 1989.  His bracket was not tougher than the 118 bracket at the 1990 NCAA tournament.  Both NCAA finalists and the 7th place finisher were there.  Kolat beat the 7th place finisher didn't wrestle the other two.  I think the presence of the 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 8th place finishers at NCAAs more than makes up for Kolat's absence.  The two facts you gave might be true of some weight at Midlands in 1989, but they were not true of Kolat's. 

Really? Again with pointing out Joe Williams wasn't in that bracket?

AGAIN...the POINT was that it used to be a tournament that Sr level Wrestlers would participate in and Williams one anecdotal example. 

It has to do with the level of competition of the Midlands back in the 80s/90s vs today. That's it. 

"Often," also doesn't literally mean EVERY SINGLE time...it means, "in many instances." 

 

The fact that there was a 7th place finisher and 2 NCAA Finalists is...in and of itself fairly compelling.

But nowhere did I say, "the Midlands were tougher the year and at the weight Cary Kolat took 3rd as a Soph in HS than the NCAA Tournaments."