lu_alum Posted October 28 Posted October 28 (edited) The lack of a thread for the U23 World Championships is in line with the lack of production from the team. One silver and one bronze is not a good showing. Big dropoff from the 2023 showing. 2024: 1 SILVER, 1 BRONZE 2023: 4 GOLD, 2 BRONZE Edited October 28 by lu_alum 1
oldschool Posted October 28 Posted October 28 Yeah; I feel like we didn't send as many of our top guys this year. Also increasing competition from abroad. I'm wondering if our U20 team would've beat our U23 team head-to-head this year?
oldschool Posted October 28 Posted October 28 Our 2024 U20 vs U23 teams: 57 kg - Luke Lilledahl (4-0, gold medalist) vs Maxwell Gallagher (5th) 61 kg - Marcus Blaze (4-1, bronze medalist) vs Nik Bouzakis (DNP) 65 kg - Bo Bassett (4-1, bronze medalist) vs Joshua Saunders (DNP) 70 kg - PJ Duke (4-1, bronze medalist) vs John Wiley (DNP) 74 kg - LaDarion Lockett (4-1, silver medalist) vs Mitchell Mesenbrink (bronze) 79 kg - Zack Ryder (4-1, silver medalist) vs Patrick Kennedy (7th) 86 kg - Josh Barr (3-1, silver medalist) vs John Gunderson (10th) 92 kg - Connor Mirasola (3-2, 5th place) vs Jacob Cardenas (silver) 97 kg - Justin Rademacher (4-1, bronze medalist) vs Massoma Endene (7th) 125 kg - Ben Kueter (3-1, silver medalist) vs Lucas Stoddard (5th) I feel like our U20 team wins 57, 61, 65, 70, 86, and 125. U23 wins 74, 92. And a tossup for 79kg and 97kg. 1 3
maligned Posted October 28 Posted October 28 2 hours ago, oldschool said: Our 2024 U20 vs U23 teams: 57 kg - Luke Lilledahl (4-0, gold medalist) vs Maxwell Gallagher (5th) 61 kg - Marcus Blaze (4-1, bronze medalist) vs Nik Bouzakis (DNP) 65 kg - Bo Bassett (4-1, bronze medalist) vs Joshua Saunders (DNP) 70 kg - PJ Duke (4-1, bronze medalist) vs John Wiley (DNP) 74 kg - LaDarion Lockett (4-1, silver medalist) vs Mitchell Mesenbrink (bronze) 79 kg - Zack Ryder (4-1, silver medalist) vs Patrick Kennedy (7th) 86 kg - Josh Barr (3-1, silver medalist) vs John Gunderson (10th) 92 kg - Connor Mirasola (3-2, 5th place) vs Jacob Cardenas (silver) 97 kg - Justin Rademacher (4-1, bronze medalist) vs Massoma Endene (7th) 125 kg - Ben Kueter (3-1, silver medalist) vs Lucas Stoddard (5th) I feel like our U20 team wins 57, 61, 65, 70, 86, and 125. U23 wins 74, 92. And a tossup for 79kg and 97kg. Before I read your assessment at the end, that's about how I had it mentally too as I read thru the matchups. Good post 1
nhs67 Posted October 28 Posted October 28 4 hours ago, maligned said: Before I read your assessment at the end, that's about how I had it mentally too as I read thru the matchups. Good post 7 hours ago, oldschool said: Our 2024 U20 vs U23 teams: 57 kg - Luke Lilledahl (4-0, gold medalist) vs Maxwell Gallagher (5th) 61 kg - Marcus Blaze (4-1, bronze medalist) vs Nik Bouzakis (DNP) 65 kg - Bo Bassett (4-1, bronze medalist) vs Joshua Saunders (DNP) 70 kg - PJ Duke (4-1, bronze medalist) vs John Wiley (DNP) 74 kg - LaDarion Lockett (4-1, silver medalist) vs Mitchell Mesenbrink (bronze) 79 kg - Zack Ryder (4-1, silver medalist) vs Patrick Kennedy (7th) 86 kg - Josh Barr (3-1, silver medalist) vs John Gunderson (10th) 92 kg - Connor Mirasola (3-2, 5th place) vs Jacob Cardenas (silver) 97 kg - Justin Rademacher (4-1, bronze medalist) vs Massoma Endene (7th) 125 kg - Ben Kueter (3-1, silver medalist) vs Lucas Stoddard (5th) I feel like our U20 team wins 57, 61, 65, 70, 86, and 125. U23 wins 74, 92. And a tossup for 79kg and 97kg. Same. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me
Truzzcat Posted October 28 Posted October 28 (edited) As the posts above allude to, I think the issue is our college guys are not really doing u23's or at least our elite college guys, and they take place at the exact same time as u20's so our elite younger guys have to pick and choose. Edited October 28 by Truzzcat
nhs67 Posted October 28 Posted October 28 18 minutes ago, Truzzcat said: As the posts above allude to, I think the issue is our college guys are not really doing u23's or at least our elite college guys, and they take place at the exact same time as u20's so our elite younger guys have to pick and choose. How do we get our U20 gents involved in U23? Do we allow them a special wrestleoff? I know if someone makes the Senior team and they are eligible, they are awarded the spot. Do we do something similar? 1 1 "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me
Truzzcat Posted October 28 Posted October 28 2 hours ago, nhs67 said: How do we get our U20 gents involved in U23? Do we allow them a special wrestleoff? I know if someone makes the Senior team and they are eligible, they are awarded the spot. Do we do something similar? I think the simplest way to do so would be to make the trials take place on different days so that they don't need to pick one or the other. Or make it so if you win the u23 spot and are u20 eligible you can get a special wrestle off. 1
nhs67 Posted October 28 Posted October 28 50 minutes ago, Truzzcat said: I think the simplest way to do so would be to make the trials take place on different days so that they don't need to pick one or the other. Or make it so if you win the u23 spot and are u20 eligible you can get a special wrestle off. Being that U20 is the more reputable one and requires certain criteria to be met (U23s does not, aside for age), I think it would make more sense to go the other way. National Team Member U23 Eligible - They can claim it if they want. U20 Trials Winner - Can request a wrestleoff against the U23s winner for the U23s spot. I know we're playing 'backwards' there, as U23s should have better wrestlers since they have a larger pool to pull from, but those are the apples we are given to play with. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me
VHSAlum Posted October 28 Posted October 28 Nothing needs to change. Because we have a collegiate folkstyle season - this is going to happen. Some years will be good, others not so. A tournament like this keeps our depth rolling. These guys go to the camps, and now have some international competition under their belt. 1
bnwtwg Posted October 28 Posted October 28 The 2023 team was far above average because guys were trying to qualify for olympic trials and/or getting (more) international experience to gear up for trials. This year had much lower expectations because a lot of the heavy hitters have been going nonstop between free and folk from 2021 (beginning attempts to qualify for trials) through April 2024 at the trials themselves. Peaking again is a lot to ask, especially when these guys in particular have done the international stuff throughout their career. Rest assured the 2027 U23 squad will be another banner year. 2 1 1 i am an idiot on the internet
Wrestleknownothing Posted October 28 Posted October 28 https://www.flowrestling.org/events/12430225-2024-u23-world-championship/videos?playing=12950556&limit=60 All of Mesenbrink's matches. Not behind the firewall. Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge
Wrestleknownothing Posted October 28 Posted October 28 And every Cardenas match https://www.flowrestling.org/events/12430225-2024-u23-world-championship/videos?playing=12950564 Drowning in data, but thirsting for knowledge
Eagle26 Posted October 29 Posted October 29 I think the better question is why do we even have a U23 world championship? 22 and 23 year olds are literally in the prime of their life and the best ones can and do wrestle seniors. I’m all for more wrestling experience and opportunities for age level world championships, but I think you could cut it off at U20. So, IMO, it’s not very concerning that we didn’t send our best team to U23.
MPhillips Posted October 29 Posted October 29 Our U23's have never been comparable to our other age groups... .
nhs67 Posted October 29 Posted October 29 3 hours ago, Eagle26 said: I think the better question is why do we even have a U23 world championship? 22 and 23 year olds are literally in the prime of their life and the best ones can and do wrestle seniors. I’m all for more wrestling experience and opportunities for age level world championships, but I think you could cut it off at U20. So, IMO, it’s not very concerning that we didn’t send our best team to U23. U23s is what the old University Worlds are. It is SUPPOSED to be the college age gents and ladies tussling. "I know actually nothing. It isn't even conjecture at this point." - me
Eagle26 Posted October 29 Posted October 29 59 minutes ago, nhs67 said: U23s is what the old University Worlds are. It is SUPPOSED to be the college age gents and ladies tussling. Yeah I know. There was never a big emphasis on the University worlds either.
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