What happened to Northwestern?

[Mr. PeanutButter]

How and why did they have half their team stolen? 

 

[MNRodent]

7 minutes ago, Mr. PeanutButter said:

How and why did they have half their team stolen? 

 

[flyingcement]

I could be mistaken, but I thought all of DeAugustino, Cannon, and Davison were all grad transfers.  And that Northwestern has zero scholarships (although maybe do provide some aid, but I have no clue) whereas Michigan has NIL money to throw around, along with 9.9 scholarships, and are another midwest school with top academics

[Mr. PeanutButter]

5 minutes ago, flyingcement said:

I could be mistaken, but I thought all of DeAugustino, Cannon, and Davison were all grad transfers.  And that Northwestern has zero scholarships (although maybe do provide some aid, but I have no clue) whereas Michigan has NIL money to throw around, along with 9.9 scholarships, and are another midwest school with top academics

Damn. Didn't know NW has little to no scholarships. 

They are in a really rough spot. 

[Mr. PeanutButter]

Keuter back on the mat and scores a 45 second fall. 

Iowa blanks NW 46-0

[flyingcement]

54 minutes ago, Mr. PeanutButter said:

Damn. Didn't know NW has little to no scholarships. 

They are in a really rough spot. 

That was my understanding although @Major Kong might be able to confirm

[Major Kong]

8 minutes ago, flyingcement said:

That was my understanding although @Major Kong might be able to confirm

Unless there has been a drastic change, they have scholarships. NIL cash I strongly doubt. What happened was the loss of 4 AA's - the three UM transfers and Yayha. And of course Deakin the year before. I'm just guessing the transfers were somewhat unexpected and they were caught short on using available schollys in recruiting. Anyway, it's start from pretty much scratch time. Not sure how they can get recruits like Welch, Tsirtsis etc. in this new $$ age. Could be a rough road ahead. Even Storniolo seems discouraged.

[Hammerlock3]

4 minutes ago, Major Kong said:

Unless there has been a drastic change, they have scholarships. NIL cash I strongly doubt. What happened was the loss of 4 AA's - the three UM transfers and Yayha. And of course Deakin the year before. I'm just guessing the transfers were somewhat unexpected and they were caught short on using available schollys in recruiting. Anyway, it's start from pretty much scratch time. Not sure how they can get recruits like Welch, Tsirtsis etc. in this new $$ age. Could be a rough road ahead. Even Storniolo seems discouraged.

Storny obviously does a great job with that program, the portal is BS.

[Major Kong]

9 minutes ago, Hammerlock3 said:

Storny obviously does a great job with that program, the portal is BS.

Yes, Storny is a smart and cool dude, particularly for a wrestling coach. I just don't know how they compete for talent in today's environment.

[FanOfPurdueWrestling]

They developed some studs that all happened to transfer to Michigan, which doesn’t appear to care to win duals or anything, which is upsetting to see they have the money but not the will. 
 

hopefully they continue to develop guys and get back in the swing of things. With Purdue on the road at NW on February 9th it could be a good chance for both programs to get a Big10 win. 
 

 

[FanOfPurdueWrestling]

1 hour ago, Major Kong said:

Yes, Storny is a smart and cool dude, particularly for a wrestling coach. I just don't know how they compete for talent in today's environment.

How does anyone compete with the 10-15 programs that are willing to throw money at facilities and have donor support: Illinois is installing a $14M facility; Iowa is getting a $31M facility. College sports are becoming an arms race, even in a sport that has no true pro league or millions to be made like the average pro in the NBA or NFL.

[Antitroll2828]

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Edited January 28 by Antitroll2828

[Antitroll2828]

3 hours ago, Mr. PeanutButter said:

How and why did they have half their team stolen? 

 

I don’t think you can under estimate what the lose of Kennedy and Howe has had on the program. Kennedy got scooped up by Cael immediately and has a big role as PSU now and no offense to BJ Futrell and Justin Oliver both much better than me but they aren’t close to being on the level of a Kennedy and Howe 

[Gantry]

Plus they have an incredibly low roster limit, I want to say the lowest in all of D1? 

[Southend]

2 hours ago, Major Kong said:

Unless there has been a drastic change, they have scholarships. NIL cash I strongly doubt. What happened was the loss of 4 AA's - the three UM transfers and Yayha. And of course Deakin the year before. I'm just guessing the transfers were somewhat unexpected and they were caught short on using available schollys in recruiting. Anyway, it's start from pretty much scratch time. Not sure how they can get recruits like Welch, Tsirtsis etc. in this new $$ age. Could be a rough road ahead. Even Storniolo seems discouraged.

Not 9.9

[Southend]

Northwestern misses their old coach. He developed talent like no one else. Got guys to commit with little to no money

[FanOfPurdueWrestling]

35 minutes ago, Gantry said:

Plus they have an incredibly low roster limit, I want to say the lowest in all of D1? 

I’ve heard this before, what do they get out of a lower roster limit?

 

For a private school it’s makes sense to allow 40+ kids on a team and then tuition pays for the team and then some. Why would they not use the same logic? 

[Major Kong]

20 minutes ago, Southend said:

Not 9.9

No, not 9.9

[wrestle87]

4 hours ago, Mr. PeanutButter said:

Damn. Didn't know NW has little to no scholarships. 

They are in a really rough spot. 

It's not just that they are low on scholarships, they are notoriously stingy on strategies that other schools use to boost/continue enrollment for athletic purposes. 

Northwestern still holds tight to the "we are a school first, you are a student first" approach to college athletics, which 99% of other institutions either never operated by or have long since done away with.

All of their good guys had eligibility left, but they couldn't find a way to make it work for staying enrolled in some way at the school.  The NW team has never had THAT much pull with the school.  Anytime you hear coaches go with the "compete and get a great education" line, that is code for "I don't really have that much pull with administration, so we get who we can, but don't expect the world from us."

 Michigan, conversely, is very good at finding ways to be flexible, despite their similar assertions of academic excellence, is at least willing to make room for fluff degrees so athletes can be athletes.

[1032004]

11 minutes ago, FanOfPurdueWrestling said:

I’ve heard this before, what do they get out of a lower roster limit?

 

For a private school it’s makes sense to allow 40+ kids on a team and then tuition pays for the team and then some. Why would they not use the same logic? 

I know @Jason Bryant would agree with you

[Wrestleknownothing]

8 minutes ago, wrestle87 said:

It's not just that they are low on scholarships, they are notoriously stingy on strategies that other schools use to boost/continue enrollment for athletic purposes. 

Northwestern still holds tight to the "we are a school first, you are a student first" approach to college athletics, which 99% of other institutions either never operated by or have long since done away with.

All of their good guys had eligibility left, but they couldn't find a way to make it work for staying enrolled in some way at the school.  The NW team has never had THAT much pull with the school.  Anytime you hear coaches go with the "compete and get a great education" line, that is code for "I don't really have that much pull with administration, so we get who we can, but don't expect the world from us."

 Michigan, conversely, is very good at finding ways to be flexible, despite their similar assertions of academic excellence, is at least willing to make room for fluff degrees so athletes can be athletes.

And the extra bonus at Michigan is that you don't have to wrestle any duals.

I kid. It was just sitting there and I could not resist.

[wrestle87]

12 minutes ago, FanOfPurdueWrestling said:

I’ve heard this before, what do they get out of a lower roster limit?

 

For a private school it’s makes sense to allow 40+ kids on a team and then tuition pays for the team and then some. Why would they not use the same logic? 

Northwestern is not Sacred Heart.  Northwestern has an endowment of $15 billion.  Sacred Heart's is a few hundred million.

The math, and institutional priorities, are veeery different. Athletics is not a tier 1A priority for the school.  More like a tier 1C priority. Reputation management is 1A, Academic and research dollars are 1B.  

[1032004]

Just now, wrestle87 said:

Northwestern is not Sacred Heart.  Northwestern has an endowment of $15 billion.  Sacred Heart's is a few hundred million.

The math, and institutional priorities, are veeery different. Athletics is not a tier 1A priority for the school.  More like a tier 1C priority. Reputation management is 1A, Academic and research dollars are 1B.  

But why not let more kids on the team as long as they meet all the academic requirements?

[Major Kong]

2 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

But why not let more kids on the team as long as they meet all the academic requirements?

Because they still have to pay all the ancillary costs for them. They also have Title IX considerations on roster size. They have 22 on the roster this year. Same as Harvard. When my kid had a visit at Harvard some years ago he was told "we'd love to have you, but can't use an admissions arrow on you" and "you can walk on but it will be very hard to roster you unless you are starting". They are just not going to throw money at their programs, and as private schools have a somewhat different mandate. In fact I know of kids recently on both NU and Harvard rosters whose families made large contributions to the schools. Neither kid ever wrestled a dual! A few comparable schools - Cornell, Princeton, Stanford, Lehigh, seem to have private resources helping the programs.

[1032004]

37 minutes ago, Major Kong said:

Because they still have to pay all the ancillary costs for them. They also have Title IX considerations on roster size. They have 22 on the roster this year. Same as Harvard. When my kid had a visit at Harvard some years ago he was told "we'd love to have you, but can't use an admissions arrow on you" and "you can walk on but it will be very hard to roster you unless you are starting". They are just not going to throw money at their programs, and as private schools have a somewhat different mandate. In fact I know of kids recently on both NU and Harvard rosters whose families made large contributions to the schools. Neither kid ever wrestled a dual! A few comparable schools - Cornell, Princeton, Stanford, Lehigh, seem to have private resources helping the programs.

Title IX considerations are fair.  But at minimum, I’d think that whatever tuition someone is paying over the average should be considered “revenue”

Edited January 29 by 1032004