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Posted
35 minutes ago, forkemaz said:

I'm so glad you brought up the term "dual tournament" it barely makes sense. And it literally makes sense for what you would call an "individual tournament" in that tournament its still TWO competitors. Does NCAA even do round Robins? The term dual is dumb and redundant. The term team match is not, the term duel is also more specific. Because "match" doesn't specify the number of competitors which was just so important to you with the last definition.

So you are right and the rest of the wrestling world is wrong. The rule book is wrong and every one naming their team events are wrong. A duel is between 2 individuals and not between 2 teams. Each contested match by definition could be considered a duel. If you are in the wrestling world though you know it is a match, the same as boxing. It is called a dual for the number of teams participating. What dictionary are you using that states a duel is between more than 2 individuals? 

Posted
47 minutes ago, Chas2105 said:

So you are right and the rest of the wrestling world is wrong. The rule book is wrong and every one naming their team events are wrong. A duel is between 2 individuals and not between 2 teams. Each contested match by definition could be considered a duel. 

Well I'm glad you can admit that I'm right and you have taken my side. 

Posted (edited)
44 minutes ago, alex1fly said:

Sooooo what's the history of dual championships then? Does anybody care to share or do y'all just want to debate the best way to spell words. lol

JB would know for sure but I believe the late 80s Virginia Duals were the original modern-era NCAA Dual Championship...then NWCA spun off another Midwest centric version thru the 90s - 2000s

Edited by gromit
Posted
51 minutes ago, alex1fly said:

Sooooo what's the history of dual championships then? Does anybody care to share or do y'all just want to debate the best way to spell words. lol

Carl killed the DC ... or Karl however you spell it.  🤨

.

Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, OMW said:

.................

Duel by definition isn't technically incorrect, but it is more-or-less the mouth-breather way of stating Dual Meet.

😆

Edited by gromit
Posted
47 minutes ago, ionel said:

Carl killed the DC ... or Karl however you spell it.  🤨

Killed it? So it existed until when? 

I honestly don't remember Dual Championships being a thing even back in the 90s-00s.

Posted

So here's a link to last year's NWCA Dual Championships

https://nwcaonline.com/news/2023/5/25/national-wrestling-coaches-association-nwca-national-dual-meet-championships-headed-back-to-the-uni-dome.aspx

"The National Duals were last held in the UNI-Dome in 2011. In 2024, the National Duals will feature 96 programs from the following six divisions: NAIA Men, NAIA Women, NCAA D2 Men, NCAA D3 Men, NCAA Women, and NCWA Men."

Was NCAA D1 Men ever a part of this?

Posted
So here's a link to last year's NWCA Dual Championships
https://nwcaonline.com/news/2023/5/25/national-wrestling-coaches-association-nwca-national-dual-meet-championships-headed-back-to-the-uni-dome.aspx
"The National Duals were last held in the UNI-Dome in 2011. In 2024, the National Duals will feature 96 programs from the following six divisions: NAIA Men, NAIA Women, NCAA D2 Men, NCAA D3 Men, NCAA Women, and NCWA Men."
Was NCAA D1 Men ever a part of this?

Virginia Duals spawned the event. Then it started to move around the country. They started the Multi-Divisional National Duals in 2004. Division I broke off to try regional formats (and back to single sites) and then a finals site in 2012 and then various versions until the bowl-series style that Cael actually suggested put an end to it. Multi-Duals have been on-going since 04, with the NJCAA moving theirs to Oklahoma a week later the last few years.
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Insert catchy tagline here. 

Posted
22 hours ago, ionel said:

Was it Cael or Carl, maybe both?  Believe Tommie also said no ddm.  😕

Spelled Cael, pronounced Carl. It’s an old English translation scenario, a sort of Color/Colour, aluminum aluminium, if you will.

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Posted
56 minutes ago, D3UC157 said:

 It’s an old English translation scenario, a sort of Color/Colour, aluminum aluminium, if you will.

Theatre, Theater. "202-221, whatever it takes."

.

  • 11 months later...
Posted

I have nothing to offer of much substance I think a dual championship is a bit of a no brainer. I just wanted to say one of my favorite things with high school dual meets is bumping guys. Not a perfect example here because the guy I am going to propose bumping is probably less effective than the guy currently at the weight but imagine an iowa Oklahoma state dual where Ferrari goes 184 and gabe bumps to 197 or back when Cassar could not crack the lineup putting him out at 197 and bumping Nickal.

Posted
22 minutes ago, Truzzcat said:

I have nothing to offer of much substance I think a dual championship is a bit of a no brainer. I just wanted to say one of my favorite things with high school dual meets is bumping guys. Not a perfect example here because the guy I am going to propose bumping is probably less effective than the guy currently at the weight but imagine an iowa Oklahoma state dual where Ferrari goes 184 and gabe bumps to 197 or back when Cassar could not crack the lineup putting him out at 197 and bumping Nickal.

Iowa state did the triple bump against Cornell a couple years back when Yonger was 197 in 2023. He bumped up to 285 and beat Lewis Fernandes. Marcus Coleman bumped to 197 and beat Jacob Cardenas. Joel Devine bumped to 184 and beat Evan Canoyer. 

Posted

A DAY IN HISTORY

It is February 12, 2012.

You check to see what's playing at the theaters, and it's all trash. The top four movies are Safe House, The Vow, Journey 2: The Mysterious Island and perhaps the most disappointing film ever released, Star Wars: Episode 1 - The Phantom Menace.  

You put the newspaper down in disgust. 

There's nothing happening on Snapchat, so you turn on the radio just in time to hear Casey Kasem's American's Top Forty as it runs through the top three in ascending order: Rihanna, Kelly Clarkson and Adele with Set Fire to the Rain.  

You put a hammer through the radio.

It was made for cheap in Korea like your car and The Simpsons. And you try to remember when America made things, and then you remember that America makes great wrestlers, and you'll get to see some of them today as the #6 ILLINI are in the NWCA National Duals Regional Finals.

They face #5 Cornell in cold and ugly Ithaca, New York. 

The dual starts out with that new Freshman sensation Jesse Delgado facing off against All American Frank Perelli of Cornell. Delgado is coming off an upset of #1 Matt McDonough in Iowa City, so you have your fingers crossed. You keep them crossed because this is a Flo stream. 

And there's the 8-3 win for the Cali Kid! He might turn out to be pretty good some day.

At 133, All American BJ Futrell absolutely mauls an Arujau with a tech fall. Things are shaping up. You almost forget that Adele has the #1 song in America and that Jar Jar Binks exists. 

The team from ILLINOIS needed to win three of the four matches to start off the meet. They do. They needed that because the Big Red (named after chewing gum?) have #1 Kyle Dake, #5 Steve Bosak and #1 Cam Simaz later in their lineup. Jackson Morse actually takes Dake down in that match and the excitement is through the roof! 

He ends up losing 4-6, but there is no bonus. There is a window of opportunity here. 

All Americans Conrad Polz and Jordan Blanton win their matches for ILLINOIS at 165 and 174. But now we've hit the real tough stretch of the dual, as #5 Bosak and #1 Cam Simaz are warming up. But Head Coach Jim Heffernan pulls a fast one. He moves up his Sophomore 197-pounder to heavyweight to take on the Cornell Senior. 

It pays off! 

Mario Gonzalez wins, and the ILLINI take the dual! 

 

#6 Illinois 19, #5 Cornell 16

125 No. 6 Jesse Delgado (ILL) dec. No. 6 Frank Perrelli (COR), 8-3

133 No. 5 BJ Futrell (ILL) tech fall Naryman Arujau (COR), 18-3, 6:08

141  Mike Nevinger (COR) maj. dec. Daryl Thomas (ILL), 9-0

149  No. 17 Eric Terrazas (ILL) dec. Chris Villalonga (COR), 3-1

157  No. 1 Kyle Dake (COR) dec. Jackson Morse (ILL), 6-4

165  No. 9 Conrad Polz (ILL) dec. Marshall Peppelman (COR), 8-3

174  No. 12 Jordan Blanton (ILL) dec. William George (COR), 7-6

184  No. 5 Steve Bosak (COR) dec. Tony Dallago (ILL), 4-0

197  No. 1 Cam Simaz (COR) pinned Martin Smith (ILL), 3:31*

HWT No. 14 Mario Gonzalez (ILL) dec. Maciej Jochym (COR), 8-2

 

--------------------------

This is my second-favorite ILLINI dual of all time. Part of the reason for it is that the win catapulted the Orange and Blue into the National Duals Final Four. Also, it was just a freaking great match. The NWCA National Duals brought excitement to the sport. I would love to see them happen again, and I would suggest that February is the best time. 

The way to bring back the National Duals is to have teams like ILLINOIS, Missouri, Cornell, Oklahoma State, Arizona State, NC State, Penn, Pitt, Northern Iowa and other highly-ranked teams all show up. Then, the champion gets to parade around for the rest of the year as NATIONAL CHAMPIONS. See how long Professor Carl and the Brandos keep their teams from becoming NATIONAL CHAMPIONS.  

 

 

 

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Posted
1 hour ago, 666 said:

Not really a good counterpoint by Goodale.  We had national duals for years and no such point was made. 

Agreed

What seems to happen is that coaches disagree on exactly how/when to do them, so they never get done. Perfect being the enemy of good and all that. Wrestling as a whole has scheduling issues - some want it a summer/fall sport, some want NCAAs to not compete with basketball, on and on.

I personally don't care when it is. Heck, try it in the fall and then next season try it in the spring. See what the wrestlers, coaches, and fans think about both.

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