Why does Flo hate Rocky Elam?

[KCMO2]

He knows that, he's just throwing shade. 

[Hammerlock3]

I'd be pissed if I was ramirez or the okstate kid, carr just got left above both of em.

[JimmyBT]

5 hours ago, KCMO2 said:

You're either joking, or clueless.  Maybe both.

Please tell me which one.  Either way I’m right and you should probably put down your kool aid.  He.  Ducked. Him.  

[JimmyBT]

5 hours ago, nhs67 said:

He legitimately went to a tournament with a bunch of backups the next day.

Why not educate @JimmyBTinstead of instantly attacking him?

This  

[flyingcement]

3 hours ago, Hammerlock3 said:

I'd be pissed if I was ramirez or the okstate kid, carr just got left above both of em.

I still think Carr will finish higher than both (wouldn't be shocked if he didn't). but to your point, these should be reflective of past results rather than predictive.

Edited December 7, 2023 by flyingcement

[MPhillips]

5 hours ago, nhs67 said:

Why not educate @JimmyBTinstead of instantly attacking him?

Agreed. Help him...

Edited December 7, 2023 by MPhillips

[JimmyBT]

12 hours ago, MPhillips said:

Agreed. Help him...

But but but you’re the best and you can’t do it. Hahahahahahhaha

[JimmyBT]

16 hours ago, KCMO2 said:

He knows that, he's just throwing shade. 

[PortaJohn]

On 12/6/2023 at 1:31 AM, Husker_Du said:

That's an all time bad ranking.

I'm thinking of starting a weekly segment where i discuss rankings moves I like and don't like. 
 

and that's not a knock on flo. i like some of their decisions, and i don't wholly agree with every Intermat decision (although it's considerably less frequent).

maybe i could look at other sets and make a thing of it. 

That would be cool.  Ever think of doing a weekly Power 8 ranking for each weight class?  Gives you more flexibility to rank more on eye test and gut feeling.

Willie's Weekly Power 8 would be fun for wrestling geeks

 

Edited December 7, 2023 by PortaJohn

[XiXiTiger]

13 hours ago, JimmyBT said:

Please tell me which one.  Either way I’m right and you should probably put down your kool aid.  He.  Ducked. Him.  

Didn't Brooks duck Beard this weekend? I see he's still #1.

[JimmyBT]

27 minutes ago, XiXiTiger said:

Didn't Brooks duck Beard this weekend? I see he's still #1.

That makes Elam ducking Buchanan ok???  Oh and has brooks ever lost to beard???  I’m pretty sure Elam has lost to Buchanan 

[Husker_Du]

Buchanan hasn't wrestled for a year.

you don't move a 3x AA down for missing one match unless you have totally changed your methodology.

why didn't Fix drop for missing CKLV? 

Brooks? 

i mean, i can follow the A->B->C logic, but i've never seen rankings done like that.

and i can follow their rationale for Maida. it's not lost on me.

but it's never been done like that in the history of sports or rankings. 

the guy literally fell 18 spots and didn't lose lol.

[Husker_Du]

1 hour ago, PortaJohn said:

That would be cool.  Ever think of doing a weekly Power 8 ranking for each weight class?  Gives you more flexibility to rank more on eye test and gut feeling.

Willie's Weekly Power 8 would be fun for wrestling geeks

 

i do ncaa projections every week or so. imo they are much more sensible than any set of college rankings which goes off relatively arbitrary rules.

https://rokfin.com/ranking/3491/2024-Crystal-Ball-Week-6

[Crotalus]

That makes Elam ducking Buchanan ok???  Oh and has brooks ever lost to beard???  I’m pretty sure Elam has lost to Buchanan 

Is it really ducking if you have lost to someone and are ranked behind them? There's no real advantage to skipping the match, ranking/seeding wise.

There is an advantage to skipping matches against someone you have beaten and are ranked ahead of because the rankers and seeding criteria don't penalize for doing so.

[steamboat_charlie]

I don't want to be too hard on the guy, given that he's a man of the Lord and all, but Kozak's rankings have been consistently terrible every step of the way. 

That goes doubly for his international rankings, which include gems like Chance Marstellar as the #4 79kg in the world, as recently as November 10th.  

[Gibby Haynes]

Rocky had a recent surgery and was recovering. Pretty sure the coaches wanted to ease him back into competition. I can't think of one thing that would be considered an ease when wrestling Steve Buchanan. 

[nhs67]

55 minutes ago, steamboat_charlie said:

I don't want to be too hard on the guy, given that he's a man of the Lord and all, but Kozak's rankings have been consistently terrible every step of the way. 

That goes doubly for his international rankings, which include gems like Chance Marstellar as the #4 79kg in the world, as recently as November 10th.  

You are off-base on everything you posted here except the opening to your initial statement.

Rankings are not ratings or projections or predictions.

You can only rank based off of results that actually happen(ed) and at some point you have to have a cutoff insofar as time limit since last competition.

If John Smith were to retire from OSU to venture back in to the International MFS forray you couldn't just rank him #1 at 61 KG right now simply because he rattled off a ridiculous amount of championships a few years back.

You may disagree with the time cutoff, but he puts the work in and follows some sort of code that they have sworn to uphold.  If he weren't following that, I don't think he would be doing them.  He holds himself to a higher standard than anybody on these forums possibly could.

Edit: Sorry if that seemed direct or harsh towards you, I was just piping up in defense of Kozak.  The guy is a gem both in his field of expertise (wrestling journalism) and ethically.

Edited December 7, 2023 by nhs67

[Jon_Kozak]

37 minutes ago, steamboat_charlie said:

I don't want to be too hard on the guy, given that he's a man of the Lord and all, but Kozak's rankings have been consistently terrible every step of the way. 

That goes doubly for his international rankings, which include gems like Chance Marstellar as the #4 79kg in the world, as recently as November 10th.  

Thanks for not wanting to go too hard on me but you're welcome to tag me next time.

This has been an incredibly unique year of college wrestling and the rankings reflect that. Maida dropping 18 spots is "unprecedented" because everything surrounding 125 this year is unprecedented. 

Rocky Elam didn't drop because he sat out. He dropped because other guys wrestled and recorded really good wins. 

Where do you think Chance Marsteller should be ranked after holding wins over Jordan Burroughs, Ali Savadkouhi, and Avtandil Kentchadze in the past year? I follow international wrestling as close as anyone in the world so I'm genuinely curious what other issue you take with the international rankings.

[nhs67]

6 minutes ago, Jon_Kozak said:

Thanks for not wanting to go too hard on me but you're welcome to tag me next time.

This has been an incredibly unique year of college wrestling and the rankings reflect that. Maida dropping 18 spots is "unprecedented" because everything surrounding 125 this year is unprecedented. 

Rocky Elam didn't drop because he sat out. He dropped because other guys wrestled and recorded really good wins. 

Where do you think Chance Marsteller should be ranked after holding wins over Jordan Burroughs, Ali Savadkouhi, and Avtandil Kentchadze in the past year? I follow international wrestling as close as anyone in the world so I'm genuinely curious what other issue you take with the international rankings.

Right after ThugMassa G.

[1032004]

20 hours ago, Hammerlock3 said:

I'd be pissed if I was ramirez or the okstate kid, carr just got left above both of em.

I think it’s more about not thinking Carr should drop 2 spots for losing 1 match due to Ramirez losing his next one.

This is actually consistent with what they did with Vito.  Rather than making Fix 1 and Crookham 2, they put Crookham to 1 and kept Vito ahead of Fix.

@Jon_Kozak, is it safe to assume Ramirez would have went to 2 had he beaten Olejnik?

[Jon_Kozak]

1 minute ago, 1032004 said:

I think it’s more about not thinking Carr should drop 2 spots for losing 1 match due to Ramirez losing his next one.

This is actually consistent with what they did with Vito.  Rather than making Fix 1 and Crookham 2, they put Crookham to 1 and kept Vito ahead of Fix.

@Jon_Kozak, is it safe to assume Ramirez would have went to 2 had he beaten Olejnik?

David Carr is 2-1 against #1 Keegan O'Toole...completely different situation imo

[1032004]

2 minutes ago, Jon_Kozak said:

David Carr is 2-1 against #1 Keegan O'Toole...completely different situation imo

Wait…is that a no to my question?

[KCMO2]

1 hour ago, Crotalus said:

Is it really ducking if you have lost to someone and are ranked behind them? There's no real advantage to skipping the match, ranking/seeding wise.

There is an advantage to skipping matches against someone you have beaten and are ranked ahead of because the rankers and seeding criteria don't penalize for doing so.

Shhhh......you're messing with his alternate reality.  He apparently has an ax to grind, and no amount of logic will change that.

[nhs67]

2 minutes ago, KCMO2 said:

Shhhh......you're messing with his alternate reality.  He apparently has an ax to grind, and no amount of logic will change that.

You need to STFU and not be a dickhead just to exacerbate here.

The adults are talking.  Back away.

[Jon_Kozak]

6 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Wait…is that a no to my question?

Sorry...forgot to answer your question. Yeah, I think we'd have put Ramirez above Carr had he beat Olejnik.