Why are there 33 NCAA qualifiers per weight?

[Alces Alces Gigas]

NAIAs did not qualify a wrestler to the NCAAs.     The teams were dual affiliated. 

[Wrestleknownothing]

4 minutes ago, Alces Alces Gigas said:

NAIAs did not qualify a wrestler to the NCAAs.     The teams were dual affiliated. 

Then bring back the dual affiliation. Whatever it takes, give me more.

[Lipdrag]

9 hours ago, Alces Alces Gigas said:

Why an auto low seed?  If they deserve it, seed them! Don't ruin a d1 studs tourney by not seeding them 

If he is a stud then a seed of a D2 or D3 guy won't ruin his tourney.  Nuff said.

[Alces Alces Gigas]

32 minutes ago, Lipdrag said:

If he is a stud then a seed of a D2 or D3 guy won't ruin his tourney.  Nuff said.

Ask the Hwt D1 studs who lost to Les  Sigman or Tervel Dlagnev  if their Midlands were ruined by these two D2 champs

[Gambatte]

4 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Bring back NAIA too, while we are at it.

I think this is the complete list of non-D1 D1 champs. Bolded and underlined means they were also outstanding wrestler that year.

This is a great list. Thanks. A few corrections: Rick Sanders was a D1 champion in 66 & 67 and runner up in 68. Gary Barton was champion in 72. Don Rohn was champion in 73.

[Gambatte]

Ooops! I mistook the last column as the wrestler's placement in D1.

[Dark Energy]

I wonder if there is very little desire to remove since it gives just a bit more time for most everyone not in a pigtail to recover from the weight cut!!

[Wrestleknownothing]

32 minutes ago, Gambatte said:

Ooops! I mistook the last column as the wrestler's placement in D1.

No worries. I appreciate the help. Anf I love the fact that in 1966 Sanders finished 3rd at D2, but 1st at D1.

Edited March 14, 2023 by Wrestleknownothing

[Gambatte]

Yeah. Warren Crow started out at Cornell before transferring to SUNY Albany when he defeated Sanders in the College Division Nationals at 123 lbs. Sanders then dropped to 115 for the D1 NCAAs and Crow finished 4th at 123 lbs.

Edited March 14, 2023 by Gambatte

[TexRef]

4 hours ago, Lipdrag said:

If he is a stud then a seed of a D2 or D3 guy won't ruin his tourney.  Nuff said.

Most of the complaints came from the bigger schools. They didn't want their kid getting knocked around by a D2 stud. 

[SocraTease]

9 hours ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Bring back NAIA too, while we are at it.

I think this is the complete list of non-D1 D1 champs. Bolded and underlined means they were also outstanding wrestler that year.

Floyd "Shorty" Hitchcock was Division I and II champ and outstanding wrestler in both tournaments.

Floyd "Shorty" Hitchcock excelled as a wrestler during his days at Bloomsburg University. He posted an 84-7-2 dual meet record and won 3 PSAC Championships. His senior year he won both the Division I and II National titles in the 177-pound weight class and was named the Outstanding Wrestler in both tournaments. He also won a silver medal at the 1973 World Games in Moscow. During his high school coaching days at Lake Lehman, he guided the Knights to 4 District 2 Titles and was a 4-time district coach of the year. In 1981, he coached Lake-Lehman to the PIAA Class AA State Championship. Two of his former high school stars were Rick and Rock Bonomo, who later achieved All-American honors at Bloomsburg. In 1984 Coach Hitchcock was named wrestling coach at Millersville University, where for the past 19 years, his enthusiasm and winning attitude have made the Marauders perennial contenders in the NCAA I Regional mat circles. He produced 18 Eastern Regional Champs and 28 NCAA qualifiers and was named NCAA Eastern Regional Coach of the Year twice. Shorty was presented a very special award during the alumni banquet of the 1951 wrestling team, at Millersville University. That night 200 people were able to honor Shorty before he passed away. The founder of the wrestling program at Millersville, Dr. Ted Rupp, stated "He is firm, but fair with his athletes. What you see is what you get. He commands their respect and, with many, their love. Coach Hitchcock lost his battle to cancer and passed away in February 2002 

[SocraTease]

16 hours ago, Alces Alces Gigas said:

Why an auto low seed?  If they deserve it, seed them! Don't ruin a d1 studs tourney by not seeding them 

I'm not opposed to seeding a guy from another Division, but it likely would be very difficult to do so given that they wouldn't have many (if any) common opponents and the comparisons would be very hard to make.   Further, it might be used as a reason for the NCAA to keep them out and maintain  the status quo of "Division Apartheid" so to speak.  

If you invite a few guys in and give them relatively low seeds, it might prove more possible and satisfy the critics.   It could also be a work in progress or something tried experimentally for a season or two.   I think it would also bring more attention to DI, DII and NAIA, which (let's be frank) a great number of wrestlers and wrestling fans ignore.

Maybe D I and II guys could earn ranking points at the proposed ranking tournaments (see other thread).  

[lu_alum]

17 minutes ago, SocraTease said:

Floyd "Shorty" Hitchcock was Division I and II champ and outstanding wrestler in both tournaments.

His senior year he won both the Division I and II National titles in the 177-pound weight class and was named the Outstanding Wrestler in both tournaments.  

Schalles wasn't eligible for the NCAA tourneys that year, so he went up to 177 for the PSAC championships and pinned Shorty to win the title and the tourney OW.

Edited March 15, 2023 by lu_alum

[SocraTease]

Just now, lu_alum said:

Schalles wasn't eligible for the NCAA tourneys that year, so he went up to 177 for the PSAC championships and pinned Shorty to win the title and the tourney OW.

Schalles is legendary.   Arguably, the original "funk" wrestler and maybe the greatest pinner of all time.   I heard he once put a small piece of tape on the mat and told others he was going to pin his opponent right on the tape, which he proceeded to do.   Too bad there isn't much video footage of him wrestling.  I've only seen a high school match and a match against Lee Kemp.  Looks like Bader did an interview with him on FLO

https://www.flowrestling.org/video/7360744-the-bader-show-wade-schalles-ep-264

 

[lu_alum]

4 minutes ago, SocraTease said:

Schalles is legendary.   Arguably, the original "funk" wrestler and maybe the greatest pinner of all time.   I heard he once put a small piece of tape on the mat and told others he was going to pin his opponent right on the tape, which he proceeded to do.   Too bad there isn't much video footage of him wrestling.  I've only seen a high school match and a match against Lee Kemp.  Looks like Bader did an interview with him on FLO

https://www.flowrestling.org/video/7360744-the-bader-show-wade-schalles-ep-264

 

True story:  

https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/sports/1978/03/19/people-named-gable-schalles-immortals-of-the-mat/12d87d0c-f2c1-466d-aaa3-fc3b6b8e2bcd/

Edited March 15, 2023 by lu_alum

[Wrestleknownothing]

1 hour ago, SocraTease said:

Floyd "Shorty" Hitchcock was Division I and II champ and outstanding wrestler in both tournaments.

Floyd "Shorty" Hitchcock excelled as a wrestler during his days at Bloomsburg University. He posted an 84-7-2 dual meet record and won 3 PSAC Championships. His senior year he won both the Division I and II National titles in the 177-pound weight class and was named the Outstanding Wrestler in both tournaments. He also won a silver medal at the 1973 World Games in Moscow. During his high school coaching days at Lake Lehman, he guided the Knights to 4 District 2 Titles and was a 4-time district coach of the year. In 1981, he coached Lake-Lehman to the PIAA Class AA State Championship. Two of his former high school stars were Rick and Rock Bonomo, who later achieved All-American honors at Bloomsburg. In 1984 Coach Hitchcock was named wrestling coach at Millersville University, where for the past 19 years, his enthusiasm and winning attitude have made the Marauders perennial contenders in the NCAA I Regional mat circles. He produced 18 Eastern Regional Champs and 28 NCAA qualifiers and was named NCAA Eastern Regional Coach of the Year twice. Shorty was presented a very special award during the alumni banquet of the 1951 wrestling team, at Millersville University. That night 200 people were able to honor Shorty before he passed away. The founder of the wrestling program at Millersville, Dr. Ted Rupp, stated "He is firm, but fair with his athletes. What you see is what you get. He commands their respect and, with many, their love. Coach Hitchcock lost his battle to cancer and passed away in February 2002 

Thanks for this. I mistakenly highlighted Jim Woods as OW in 1974, but he was the Gorian winner, not OW.

[ionel]

36 minutes ago, Wrestleknownothing said:

Thanks for this. I mistakenly highlighted Jim Woods as OW in 1974, but he was the Gorriaran winner, not OW.

thats the PinFest award, correct?

[lightweight]

How did they get to 33?  Well, originally it was 33 1/3, but then teams could not get the 1/3 wrestler's bleeding stopped before the five minute limit expired.  

(Although a few teams who had gotten creative with their 9.9 scholarships had a guy already sewn up and ready to go.)