dragit

I don't think injury cost them a team title. Wasn't it: 2020: Their best team. Legit juggernaut. Covid wipes out NCAAs, definitely cost them a team title. 2021: Same guys but lose likely finalist in Lugo, and (1) some injury issues; and (2) Penn State much better after very quick rebuild. Iowa wins team title, but somewhat anticlimactic with only one champ and PSU with four, including two head to heads over Iowa. 2022: Mostly same crew eligible, but Lee's 25 points wiped out by redshirt and Kemerer/Eierman/Cass injuries affect their placements. But that likely costs them second rather than third with PSU's five champs and other points.

Geez!! One of my all time favorites! Maybe my worst example yet of memory loss.

I don't know what to think about the injuries or Iowa in general. D1 wrestling is a minefield of injuries. But it seems worse at Iowa. And it's consistent with the stereotype of the Brands being old school full speed ahead training guys. More generally, it feels like they did try to get a little more modern in their approach which helped with a few years of great recruits, but (thanks to covid) they only got one somewhat anticlimactic championship out of it and then they were out of the top two again last year. It just feels like something's missing. They haven't sustained the momentum that their PA recruits started, they've got no significant post-grads, and other than Lee I don't think they've had a champ since Ramos. (?) Not saying that the sky is falling, but between the losses in Austin and the injuries being the biggest story of the season again, it just feels like they're stuck and that they are at best just competing to be the most consistent team trophy winner in the not PSU bracket.

The staff has been together a long time. They clearly mesh well together. And they appear to be better than everyone else at being able to work with the different styles of very talented wrestlers. Definitely not one size fits all. They seem to start with the premise that they need to adapt their coaching to the athlete, not make the athlete learn to wrestle in the program's style. We snickered at RBY putting his arm behind his back but they were working through a problem based on what that wrestler could do then.

By being a transcendent badass.

If the grades are based on yesterday then O'Toole is valedictorian. He put on a folkstyle clinic in every position. Old school crisp wrestling for most of the match and then a slick new era takedown to cap it off. As a Shane Griffith fan I found it thoroughly depressing.

Is this correct: In his first year after high school, he wrestled a little while attached, then they converted him to a non-medical redshirt, under applicable rules, which is now their basis for saying the losses aren't official? If so, I think their position seems reasonable. Otherwise you could have career records based on five years of eligibility. It wouldn't seem right to give him credit for wins if he went undefeated in those matches. To me in assessing a career this is the same as a typical redshirt. The wrestler is getting a full year to take losses and ease his way in. This is a significant part of why I rate Dake as the best college career. He graduated high school, won an NCAA championship 9 months later, and then did it again the next three Marches. (On top of other attributes, including who he beat in NCAAs, particularly going up in weight to beat the Hodge winner, and how he controlled all his NCAA matches.)

I am in your collective. 3x champ, world silver, smart, resourceful wrestler. Clear favorite. I'd say 75% is a little optimistic against the field given that the field is showing teeth. I don't think it starts with a 7. The match was not a disaster for Yianni. Hard fought first period. Made a mistake allowing Gomez to go upper body, cost him 4, and put him in position of taking bad shots. It's early in the year, he's probably not fully in folkstyle mode, maybe he was up late working on a paper, etc. Also we know if Gomez is at his best and you're not 100% ready he can beat anyone. The score doesn't worry that much, but I would say Gomez looked a lot bigger and stronger, definitely a fuller 149 than Yianni. And let's say they meet in NCAA final with many hours after weigh in before Saturday night match - big size delta. Still see Yianni as strong favorite but this does take a coronation and give it a lot more suspense.

Things would not have gone better with Cael. I think the question is based on the wrong premise - that Cael has unique ability to keep a bad actor on the straight and narrow. That's not his strength. His program is far and away the best at getting the most out of good talent. That 45-5 or whatever it is record in Friday night matches unambiguously proves that. But part and parcel of that is that he like all great coaches has his type of guy. You can't just put anyone there and he molds the clay. They've got to be within certain parameters to be moldable. Suriano, who hasn't almost killed three people for no good reason in a car crash and I can't picture being accused of the recent alleged crimes, wasn't the right kind of clay. Ferrari - no. And in response to the inevitable "what about Andrew Long," doesn't that prove the point, a guy who has those issues isn't going to reform just being there.

If it were March, Dean big favorite. First semester, Dean slight favorite.

Pretty impressive to get this up and running smoothly with such a short runway. I had just assumed that Oct. 31 was going to be it, that I wouldn't spend any more time on this stuff, and that I'd maybe find some sort of productive, socially useful, and uplifting alternative use of my time. Instead I'll just keep doing this.

Yeah good point for the thread that's what was at issue. So I'll use this to rant. For a message board odds discussions like this are good fodder. But this gambling stuff has gotten out of control on TV and radio. I just want to drill a hole in my head when entire shows are devoted to spreads when the time could be used to cover, you know, the games. The extent to which games are watched and covered for the point spread or other thing besides the outcome is weird to me. The point of the game is to win. That's it.

Even then I wouldn't be sure. He was a totally different wrestler at freshman year NCAAs than he'd been all year.

Noooooooooooo say it ain't so.

For sure. Second semester sometime.

Who? Spencer? After knee surgery? Two words: Load. Management.

I seem to remember although I wish I didn't some creepy message board fascination with Alex Marinelli and his gainfully employed wife's pursuit of the American dream of settling down together in a house with a mortgage.

He's a 2x NCAA champ, Spencer should end up 4. No world medals, lost Olympic trials. Spencer has lots of age group medals and very high potential at senior level if healthy. And Metcalf hasn't had a particularly credentialed coaching career, plus he's estranged from the program at their lesser rival. Doesn't have Spencer Lee level cache. Less logical choice for several years down the road when the job might open.

Actually not a lot of candidates near his level. Under 45 anyway. And those guys haven't been coaching. I agree that the Spencer fixation is notable. But I think it's understandable. It's been a really tough run since 2011 as PSU has established clear dominance. The one oasis in there has been Lee. He dominates as much or more as the PSU studs. And not only is he at that level as a wrestler, he has also been credited as a leader who drove recruiting and togetherness of their one (two, really, they would have won in 2020) breakthrough during The Decade Of Cael. So he occupies a unique place as a potential Brands successor, which is a relevant issue with Brands already several years older than Gable was at retirement.

No chance this happens (among other reasons, why would Taylor sacrifice at least one, probably two years in his prime to make the weight change), but good topic and funny title. I would pick Snyder if Taylor put on 24 pounds to challenge him. Snyder would still be materially stronger and his technique is really sharp, so he can stay out of the scrambles Taylor would want.

There would be some good competition in the room for him at St. Thomas. And some interesting challenges for the campus police force.

Like any mysterious charismatic performer he is letting the suspense build. Wouldn't Jason B know, I think he interviewed him once. Sounded relatively nerdy, kind of a Wizard of Oz man behind the curtain thing.

Not a TMZ kind of sport. p.s. Thanks for providing the new home!