Where O' Where Has Top Wrestling Gone?

[Truzzcat]

Just now, Gus said:

Seidel and Downey came to mind for me as well. Novak is tough on top. Have you watched Posada much from Stanford? Guy is a menace on top with that claw and half. Does Rocco Welsh turn guys on top? I have never thought of him as much of a guy that makes a difference with his top wrestling. I think Sinclair is the guy at 184 but you could make a case for Soldano who is just a wild man. 

Posada is an absolute menace on top I actually think he is a better pick than Novak very good call. 184 is extremely devoid of anyone who I would consider an elite top wrestler. I think Sinclair probably has the best ability to turn into one. I'm not even sure if soldano works from top a lot or if he just puts himself in crack downs and tries to hip over. Sonny Sasso is creative from top and Rune lawrence is pretty good there as well but I am not sure if either of them are riding out or turning a top 5 guy. 

[Hoyt Matthews]

48 minutes ago, Truzzcat said:

Posada is an absolute menace on top I actually think he is a better pick than Novak very good call. 184 is extremely devoid of anyone who I would consider an elite top wrestler. I think Sinclair probably has the best ability to turn into one. I'm not even sure if soldano works from top a lot or if he just puts himself in crack downs and tries to hip over. Sonny Sasso is creative from top and Rune lawrence is pretty good there as well but I am not sure if either of them are riding out or turning a top 5 guy. 

Posada dominant in crab, waters really good here too and does some things that are fun to watch if you know the position. IMO crab one of the hardest positions to stop bc not everyone does it and guys that do it well the feel is so unique, see Jesse Jantzen. You are seeing more and more crab now, but I see many use it as a short time ride bc so many guys are escaping from that sit position now. At any rate, Posada one of my faves on top to watch as is Waters from WVU. 

[Gus]

1 minute ago, Hoyt Matthews said:

Posada dominant in crab, waters really good here too and does some things that are fun to watch if you know the position. IMO crab one of the hardest positions to stop bc not everyone does it and guys that do it well the feel is so unique, see Jesse Jantzen. You are seeing more and more crab now, but I see many use it as a short time ride bc so many guys are escaping from that sit position now. At any rate, Posada one of my faves on top to watch as is Waters from WVU. 

Good call on Watters. He is really tough on top. 157 has a few guys that fit the bill. 

[Gus]

54 minutes ago, Truzzcat said:

Posada is an absolute menace on top I actually think he is a better pick than Novak very good call. 184 is extremely devoid of anyone who I would consider an elite top wrestler. I think Sinclair probably has the best ability to turn into one. I'm not even sure if soldano works from top a lot or if he just puts himself in crack downs and tries to hip over. Sonny Sasso is creative from top and Rune lawrence is pretty good there as well but I am not sure if either of them are riding out or turning a top 5 guy. 

I had a hard time with 184 as well. Ultimately chose Sinclair for the same reason - he seems like a guy that could actually get a turn on a top 184. 

[SRDVIKINGS]

To me it has more to do with Freestyle is king of the world. If you want to go to Olympics and world championships you have to 95 focus on your feet only college kids (ie know not good enough for post college wrestling) care about mat wrestling.

[Truzzcat]

27 minutes ago, Hoyt Matthews said:

Posada dominant in crab, waters really good here too and does some things that are fun to watch if you know the position. IMO crab one of the hardest positions to stop bc not everyone does it and guys that do it well the feel is so unique, see Jesse Jantzen. You are seeing more and more crab now, but I see many use it as a short time ride bc so many guys are escaping from that sit position now. At any rate, Posada one of my faves on top to watch as is Waters from WVU. 

Ethan lizak use to have one of the best claw series back in the day, Steve fittery was very good despite being very short for the weight as well. I believe Stieber use to also set up a lot of his bar series from a claw.

[Gus]

12 minutes ago, SRDVIKINGS said:

To me it has more to do with Freestyle is king of the world. If you want to go to Olympics and world championships you have to 95 focus on your feet only college kids (ie know not good enough for post college wrestling) care about mat wrestling.

Someone should have told that to David Taylor so he did not spend so much time becoming a hammer on top. Someone should have also told Logan Stieber and Spencer Lee.

[mr.nonothingatall]

3 hours ago, Caveira said:

3pt takedown was a bad rule change.  Stop changing the rules already.   Each rule change begets more rule changes.   

I didn't mind it, but they do need to stop changing the rules. They need to start enforcing the current rules better instead. Refs need to take stalling more serious, otherwise it is just a joke. If a guy is literally running away with 13 seconds left in the 3rd, I don't care if he has a 12 point lead, call him for stalling. Rules are rules, you cant just choose not to enforce them some of the time. Same with potentially dangerous. If the ref even thinks it might be, call it... Too many kids getting shoulders blown out and knees going out. It's a big responsibility being a ref, but stalling and PD need to be called every time. Stalling in SV causing the match to end....idk make them go back to center

Edited January 24 by mr.nonothingatall

[Caveira]

2 hours ago, Coastal said:

Mat wrestling in general  is basically only emphasized in PA public schools.   The private schools travel to larger events and have more of a free style focus.  Other states have never been as mat wrestling focused over the last decades.

In the 49 other states they don’t even bother to have mat wrestling.  All three periods on your feet I think.  
 

Without the snobs from pa I don’t even know if the rest of the country would have wrestling as a sport.  

[Pinnacle]

Zain

[alex1fly]

3 hours ago, Truzzcat said:

Ethan lizak use to have one of the best claw series back in the day, Steve fittery was very good despite being very short for the weight as well. I believe Stieber use to also set up a lot of his bar series from a claw.

Lizak was called The Backpack lol

[BruceyB]

1 hour ago, mr.nonothingatall said:

Refs need to take stalling more serious, otherwise it is just a joke. If a guy is literally running away with 13 seconds left in the 3rd, I don't care if he has a 12 point lead, call him for stalling. Rules are rules, you cant just choose not to enforce them some of the time.

 

1 hour ago, mr.nonothingatall said:

It's a big responsibility being a ref, but stalling and PD need to be called every time. Stalling in SV causing the match to end....idk make them go back to center

So enforce the rules unless we're in SV. Then stall calls be damned?

[mr.nonothingatall]

15 minutes ago, BruceyB said:

 

So enforce the rules unless we're in SV. Then stall calls be damned?

Not what I said. I guess a better way to say it is they need to be more strict with the stall calls. But if it's a match in sv, maybe less strict and instead of having a sv match end in stalling unless it is really bad. Then sv should decided by actual wrestling. Or all stall calls should be wiped clean going into sv so that both wreslters can wrestle 

[Truzzcat]

1 hour ago, mr.nonothingatall said:

Not what I said. I guess a better way to say it is they need to be more strict with the stall calls. But if it's a match in sv, maybe less strict and instead of having a sv match end in stalling unless it is really bad. Then sv should decided by actual wrestling. Or all stall calls should be wiped clean going into sv so that both wreslters can wrestle 

I think in very competitive matches earning that stall call in regulation is immensely important specifically for SV. I think if you were to wipe stall calls going into SV you would see a lot less activity in the third and OT period.

[Caveira]

2 hours ago, Coastal said:

Ask anyone who has ever wrestled in college. You could tell where a practice partner was from without even asking. PA dominated mat wrestling for decades as there was a lot more emphasis than other states.  That doesn't make them better but denying a generally accepted fact makes you look unintelligent.

I wrestled in college and am still around many recent d1 wrestlers old and young.  
 

With that said.   I also scored 4 touchdowns in one single football game at Polk high    
 

 

 

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Coastal said:

 

[mr.nonothingatall]

3 minutes ago, Truzzcat said:

I think in very competitive matches earning that stall call in regulation is immensely important specifically for SV. I think if you were to wipe stall calls going into SV you would see a lot less activity in the third and OT period.

Ya but you shouldn't be trying to earn a stall, you should be trying to earn a takedown. I don't disagree with you they are important in regulation. But no one wants to see a match get decided in SV by a stall call.

[mr.nonothingatall]

6 minutes ago, Truzzcat said:

I think in very competitive matches earning that stall call in regulation is immensely important specifically for SV. I think if you were to wipe stall calls going into SV you would see a lot less activity in the third and OT period.

I think I understand what u mean. And agree with you. I just don't want to see a SV were the official decides who wins. BruceyB seems to think that all SV should end in a stall call and was trying to get me off my original gripe. Which is that stalling needs to be called more in regulation. And it shouldn't not be called at the end of periods just because the period is over... Officials need to call stalling Everytime it's visible that way a standard is set. But instead some refs choose not to call it on a guy who is leading by 10 with low time left. I get it doesn't effect the outcome. It still effects the wrestlers mindset of that they aren't gonna call it. Refs NEED TO call it, and they need to call it more often

[MPhillips]

1 minute ago, mr.nonothingatall said:

Which is that stalling needs to be called more in regulation.

It needs called when it needs called. Whether it's in the first seconds or SV...

[silvermedal2]

Bucks McCrone is one of the best top wrestlers in the country at any wt.  

[mr.nonothingatall]

17 minutes ago, MPhillips said:

It needs called when it needs called. Whether it's in the first seconds or SV...

Sudden victory needs to be go until someone to get pinned

[MPhillips]

8 minutes ago, mr.nonothingatall said:

Sudden victory needs to be go until someone to get pinned

Or stalls out. Whatever the circumstance calls for...

[mr.nonothingatall]

6 minutes ago, MPhillips said:

Or stalls out. Whatever the circumstance calls for...

I will not be lured into this trolling

[MPhillips]

31 minutes ago, mr.nonothingatall said:

I will not be lured into this trolling

Too late...

[mr.nonothingatall]

17 minutes ago, MPhillips said:

Too late...

[BruceyB]

2 hours ago, mr.nonothingatall said:

I think I understand what u mean. And agree with you. I just don't want to see a SV were the official decides who wins. BruceyB seems to think that all SV should end in a stall call and was trying to get me off my original gripe. Which is that stalling needs to be called more in regulation. And it shouldn't not be called at the end of periods just because the period is over... Officials need to call stalling Everytime it's visible that way a standard is set. But instead some refs choose not to call it on a guy who is leading by 10 with low time left. I get it doesn't effect the outcome. It still effects the wrestlers mindset of that they aren't gonna call it. Refs NEED TO call it, and they need to call it more often

I didn't make any statement in my response to your previous post regarding my feelings. I was just pointing out the hypocrisy in that fact that you are saying stalling should be called stalling and the referees shouldn't choose when and where to call it, and then in the next sentence you said they shouldn't call stalling in SV if it's going to decide the match.

Pick a side.