Rules For Thee But Not For Me

[ThreePointTakedown]

9 minutes ago, Gene Mills Fan said:

It doesn't matter to him that those things were done and the entire mob was not seeked out and lawfully punished, and the few that were caught were offered defense money from civil employees and legislators.  I think we're all done trying to explain things to you like you're a 6 year old.

 

Which of those were inner city businesses? 
I know connections are difficult. But examples of buildings on fire don’t necessarily meet the criteria we were talking about. But go ahead and run from the nuances of a conversation because you can’t find examples of what I was asking for! I expected nothing less. 

[ThreePointTakedown]

6 minutes ago, mspart said:

Why don't they use those full scope of govt power to allow the current stores to stay open?  Perhaps that would be a better way to go.   Actually do the job the gov is supposed to do. 

mspart

So you have no ideas? 
Thats a shame. 

Grocery stores with 25-30% cheaper food might get robbed less. There’s one. Economics is fun. 

[Caveira]

@ThreePointTakedown

do you seriously think locking down shit because it’s stolen all the time is not a thing ?  

 

 

 

 

[Gene Mills Fan]

6 minutes ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

Which of those were inner city businesses? 
I know connections are difficult. But examples of buildings on fire don’t necessarily meet the criteria we were talking about. But go ahead and run from the nuances of a conversation because you can’t find examples of what I was asking for! I expected nothing less. 

SEATTLE – More than 60 businesses are cleaning up the damage left behind by vandals and looters who ransacked their stores.

A largely peaceful protest was held Saturday in response to the death of George Floyd in Minnesota. The demonstration turned violent when a separate group of people interrupted with their own agenda, terrorizing the city of Seattle into the night. After the group’s destructive path through downtown, businesses began picking up the pieces Sunday.

Construction crews carefully removed shattered glass and boarded up several downtown businesses including a luxury clothing store called Buki.

 

Maybe just keep asking questions is the best way to offer nothing . I expected nothing less

[Scouts Honor]

i love to point out the games you play

thats all

[Scouts Honor]

perhaps instead of deny i should have said deflect and stall.. so as not to actually answer the question or admit you are wrong.

but anyway.

 

[Scouts Honor]

still haven't addressed my insurance point.

but keep stalling.

i would expect nothing less 

[mspart]

14 minutes ago, Gene Mills Fan said:

During the 2020 Portland protests, a small fire was set in the Multnomah County Justice Center, the police union headquarters, and a county building in southeast Portland. A few other, smaller fires, such as a dumpster fire and a fire at the ICE building, also occurred. 

• Justice Center: A fire was set inside the Justice Center, which houses a police precinct and a jail.
• Police union headquarters: The Portland Police Association (PPA) building's entrance was set on fire after a window was broken.
• Multnomah County building: A small fire was lit inside a county building in southeast Portland, damaging a first-floor office and the lobby.
• ICE building: Flammable material was placed against the Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) building, and a lit flare was used to start a fire.

As a result of the city doing nothing, they have lost 2 Walmarts

Several stores and businesses have closed in Portland in the last five years, with some prominent examples including

multiple Walmart locations, the REI Pearl District store, and others due to factors like national trends, landlord disputes, and local business climate concerns. Other chains that have closed locations nationally in the same timeframe, which may have also affected Portland, include Sears, Kmart, Pier 1 Imports, and Payless ShoeSource. 

 

From google AI:

Notable Portland closures

 

• Walmart: Several locations closed in 2023 due to factors including shoplifting and safety concerns.
• REI: The Pearl District store closed in early 2024 after the company outgrew its space and could not reach an agreement with the landlord. 

•  

 

Other closures

 

• Party City: Filed for bankruptcy, with many stores closing nationwide.
• National chains: Other chains that have experienced closures in the last five years, which may have included Portland stores, include Sears, Kmart, Pier 1 Imports, and Payless ShoeSource

This is not due to the business.   this is due to the city not enforcing the law and allowing people to take what does not belong to them.   The business can't operate in that climate and has to close to stop the bleeding of money.   

mspart

 

 

[ThreePointTakedown]

do you seriously think locking down shit because it’s stolen all the time is not a thing ?  Here it is again, if you can point out where I made this claim, then I will address it. I understand if you feel triggered by my response and you no longer want to continue the conversation. But understand that trying to ask a 'straw man/gas light' question like this does not warrant a response from me until you can accurately provide the point you are responding to or demonstrate the relevance. Because this doesn't. 

 

I know you try to engage in provocative conversations but this point you are, seemingly, trying to make by asking the question and by including videos, firstly, wasn't a point I was making or refuting. So you need to be better. If for no other reason then you are more efficient with your posts and the gathering of supporting evidence. cuz this was a waste of your time and energy. 

 

And wowzer, those are a lot of videos. But even all locked up the stores are still open and seemingly profitable enough to remain so. So what is your point? 

SEATTLE – More than 60 businesses(which ones? and are they in the inner city, you should ask SH what they mean by inner city so you can determine if any of the businesses in Seattle meet that criteria to make your point. you're so close to making your point but still not there yet) are cleaning up the damage left behind by vandals and looters who ransacked their stores. Again, you might not be wrong. but you haven't provided evidence that anyone should believe you are correct. 

A largely peaceful protest was held Saturday in response to the death of George Floyd in Minnesota. The demonstration turned violent when a separate group of people interrupted with their own agenda(this is interesting, which group, what agenda? is this the same group as the peaceful protesters? I'm interested to know, care to fill in the blanks?), terrorizing the city of Seattle into the night. After the group’s destructive path through downtown, businesses began picking up the pieces Sunday.

Construction crews carefully removed shattered glass and boarded up several downtown businesses including a luxury clothing store called Buki.

 

Maybe just keep asking questions is the best way to offer nothing . I expected nothing less When you haven't sufficiently answered them, then what else can I do? I have nothing to make a comment about. I understand that its frustrating. You might feel that I am moving the goal posts, but if you go back to see the full conversation, the criteria has never changed even a bit. You just haven't been able to meet it. but you're almost there. 

 

perhaps instead of deny i should have said deflect and stall.. so as not to actually answer the question or admit you are wrong. Glad you were able to admit our confusion. If you have any questions, I'm happy to answer as usual. Often with more than 4 words. 

still haven't addressed my insurance point. you haven't substantiated your point with facts. In general, I would say yes, insurance rates tend to go up after making a claim and getting money from the insurance company. But a full exploration of the situation might, MIGHT, find that the businesses or building were rebuilt in such a way that might mitigate any increase in insurance costs by being more efficient amenities; heating, cooling, lighting, water, and/or gas. Might have better more efficient layouts so as to offer a wider range of products that could net them higher return. Enticing more and different customers that are willing to travel and in so pay more for the products. There are a bazillion things that could happen(not saying they did) to help ensure those businesses return in a better way than before. I know just the idea of this cuts at your point. But again, you have not offered support for your point. So until you can do that, you're still just asking me to trust you. I'm sure anyone reading this thread will know that we are not likely to do that. 

but keep stalling. 

[mspart]

37 minutes ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

So you have no ideas? 
Thats a shame. 

Grocery stores with 25-30% cheaper food might get robbed less. There’s one. Economics is fun. 

What an infantile argument!   Ideas.   Enforce the law.   Enforce shoplifting laws.   Enforce camping laws.   Enforce open drug use laws.   Enforce assault, arson, and riot laws.   Those laws were enforced 10 years ago and we didn't have these problems to the extent that we have now.   These laws stopped being enforced around the George Floyd time.  Your idea is to run all businesses out of town.   How is that an idea of any validity?

mspart

[ThreePointTakedown]

23 minutes ago, mspart said:

What an infantile argument!   Ideas.   Enforce the law.   Enforce shoplifting laws.   Enforce camping laws.   Enforce open drug use laws.   Enforce assault, arson, and riot laws.   Those laws were enforced 10 years ago and we didn't have these problems to the extent that we have now.   These laws stopped being enforced around the George Floyd time.  Your idea is to run all businesses out of town.   How is that an idea of any validity?

mspart

What an infantile argument! Infantile, how so? Please explain. If you can't or won't then why waste the time in typing it?   Ideas. Did I say that was the extent of my ideas? Nope. Did you offer any at the time? No. If you had some then why didn't you take the opportunity to include them, like this....Enforce the law.   Enforce shoplifting laws.   Enforce camping laws.   Enforce open drug use laws.   Enforce assault, arson, and riot laws.   Those laws were enforced 10 years ago and we didn't have these problems to the extent that we have now.   These laws stopped being enforced around the George Floyd time.  Your idea is to run all businesses out of town.   How is that an idea of any validity?

 

I think I've seen you beat the drum of status quo policing theory, if it wasn't you then I'm sorry, but here are some resources that might help you understand that we don't have to do this anymore. That there are better ways to address crime other than adding more cops or throwing more people into prison. 

https://counciloncj.org/10-essential-actions/#step4

 

https://www.vitalcitynyc.org/articles/twenty-strategies-for-reducing-crime-in-cities 'And overwhelmingly, that research finds that the most effective crime-fighting tools were not explicitly about fighting crime.'

1. Help Victims of Crime 

There is far too little support for victims of crime, even though it is the most obvious place to start. Prior victimization — of a person or a place — is the top predictor of future victimization. Supporting people who have been victimized from being victimized again — through social supports and target-hardening — has enormous potential for positive change.  

2. Reduce Demand for Law Enforcement

A central reason why law enforcement does not prevent more crime or solve more crimes is that they are too busy doing things that accomplish neither objective. If the police were called less often for unproductive reasons, there would be less under-policing — and less over-policing as well. If cities and towns set the explicit goal of having people call the police less often, law enforcement would be more efficient at taking on the tasks that remain.

3. Fixing Distressed Spaces

There is a wide body of evidence that shows that places poison people more routinely than people poison places. Crime does not result from “areas” of the “inner city” being high risk, but rather from a few very small, very bad places. Concentrated efforts to improve contagious places can build resiliency across neighborhoods. 

4. Making Crime Attractors Less Appealing 

Certain places attract and generate crime — schools, the built environment and bars being at the top of the list. More often than not, careful planning and implementation of best practices in situational crime prevention can reduce the harms they unintentionally generate and, in the case of schools and transit, unlock their potential for guardianship.

5. Scientific Supports for Law Enforcement 

Police in the United States would benefit from increased reliance on civilians in two realms: translating scientific evidence into practice, and increasing their reliance on civilian analysts to study local policing practices. In particular, if law enforcement was aided by more civilian analysts who were better trained, crime would be reduced while the footprint of policing was reduced.  

6. Improving the Job Market and Job Training

The relationship between jobs and crime is far more complex than in the popular imagination — higher national-level unemployment rates, for example, do not seem to increase violence. But targeted programs can have large effects. Integrating social and emotional skills training into employment training for young people has solid evidence of effectiveness as does employment planning for people returning from prison and transitional jobs for high risk people. 

7. Facilitate Neighborhood Non-Profits

In his excellent book ”Uneasy Peace,” Professor Patrick Sharkey reports on a study that found that for each 10 additional nonprofits in a given city, the violent crime rate is reduced by 14% (in the study period between 1990 and 2013). It should come as no surprise that access to more and better services has positive effects. Local government can aid the development of these local assets by providing funding for hyper-local community projects. 

8. Make Jails and Prison Less Criminogenic

We have overwhelmingly designed our jails and prisons to prevent people from gaining the skills to work and maintain their sobriety when they go home, and cut them off from their most crime-reducing assets, their family and friends. Small investments in humanity yield large returns when jails and prisons are not designed to produce more crime.

9. Better Prepare People to Return Home from Prison

People returning from prison need specific supports to facilitate a successful transition – 82% of people released from prison are rearrested within 10 years. And the solutions are simple — leaving facilities with an ID, prescriptions, a place to stay, a way to get started. A goal without a plan is a wish — people should leave prison with a plan and the supports to implement that plan.

10. Fund Community-Based Violence Interruption

A growing body of evidence finds that credible messengers — individuals with lived experience — coupled with psychosocial services can prevent retaliatory violence and repeat victimization. But this is a new sector and will need time and space to learn and grow.

11. Use Technology to Reduce Violence

Professor Graham Farrell argues convincingly that increases in security technology (such as engine immobilizers and cameras) in the 1990s were the only universal explanation for the universal decline in crime. There is much more that can be done using technology without imposing on civil liberties: text message reminders for court and probation appearances, databases to maintain records on police officers with histories of abuse and anti-crime features on ordinary consumer products are just the start. 

12. Tackle the Causes and Consequences of Poverty 

Poverty drives crime and violence in numerous ways beyond a simple lack of income, through weakened social bonds. A number of important policies have been successfully piloted but not fully implemented by state and local government. These are the big-ticket items — child poverty tax credits, whole-school anti-bullying programs, expanding Medicaid — that have the biggest crime reduction benefits. But the benefits outweigh the costs for dozens of policies and programs. 

13. Fix Long-Standing Problems 

Problems often persist because they have high costs, a lack of immediacy and declining political constituency — but these perpetual problems are often the key risk condition causing crime in a place to persist. Unhealthy homes, lead paint and pipes, and under-resourced foster care all promote crime.

14. Shorten the Reach of the Criminal Justice System

Too many financial burdens are imposed on people with low risk to public safety, creating a cycle of debt and incarceration, the latter which increases violence through stigma, criminal capital accumulation and a disruption of social bonds. Removing those conditions by clearing old warrants and convictions, reducing toxic fines and fees and ending poverty traps would prevent crime.

15. Help Those with Substance-Use Disorders 

In the 1990s and 2000s, with trepidation, the justice system began treating substance-use disorders as a disease rather than a crime. Expansion in the broadest of these interventions – problem-solving courts and in-prison substance use treatment — largely ended more than a decade ago. Many extremely useful ideas have been piloted — trauma-informed care, motivational interviewing, treating withdrawal in prison — but few were ever taken fully to scale. Those foundations are ready-made to build upon. 

16. Support Programs for High-Risk Young People and Families

A lot of criminology is concerned with bending the criminal trajectory curve — to keep adolescents from accelerating their delinquency or failing to desist as they age — and a huge body of scholarship has contributed to numerous model programs. From prenatal programs, to social and emotional learning, to programs for high-risk adolescents, there is a tremendous base of knowledge.

17. Education

Improving education is its own crime-reducing category, but schools can facilitate crime reduction outside of schools. Reducing food insecurity, humanizing discipline and improving the safety of the school commute benefit everyone. 

18. Housing

Like education, housing is its own category beyond the scope of this essay. But there are housing solutions with specific crime-reducing benefits: permanent, supportive housing; transitional housing for young people leaving homelessness; and housing programs specifically for people who cycle through emergency services. 

19. Policy and Law

There are any number of laws and regulations that could be tweaked to meaningfully reduce crime and victimization. For example, higher taxes that specifically target the overuse of criminogenic products like guns and alcohol have been shown to reduce excess demand. 

20. Stop the Proliferation of Firearms 

The link between firearms and violence is ironclad — the more guns, the more crime. More guns explain much of the difference in rates of violence between the U.S and peer nations. Fixing violence in the U.S. without addressing the gun problem, which is to say ensuring fewer potentially dangerous people have easy access to weapons, is embracing half-measures.

[Caveira]

5 minutes ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

 

What an infantile argument! Infantile, how so? Please explain. If you can't or won't then why waste the time in typing it?   Ideas. Did I say that was the extent of my ideas? Nope. Did you offer any at the time? No. If you had some then why didn't you take the opportunity to include them, like this....Enforce the law.   Enforce shoplifting laws.   Enforce camping laws.   Enforce open drug use laws.   Enforce assault, arson, and riot laws.   Those laws were enforced 10 years ago and we didn't have these problems to the extent that we have now.   These laws stopped being enforced around the George Floyd time.  Your idea is to run all businesses out of town.   How is that an idea of any validity?

 

I think I've seen you beat the drum of status quo policing theory, if it wasn't you then I'm sorry, but here are some resources that might help you understand that we don't have to do this anymore. That there are better ways to address crime other than adding more cops or throwing more people into prison. 

https://counciloncj.org/10-essential-actions/#step4

 

https://www.vitalcitynyc.org/articles/twenty-strategies-for-reducing-crime-in-cities 'And overwhelmingly, that research finds that the most effective crime-fighting tools were not explicitly about fighting crime.'

1. Help Victims of Crime 

There is far too little support for victims of crime, even though it is the most obvious place to start. Prior victimization — of a person or a place — is the top predictor of future victimization. Supporting people who have been victimized from being victimized again — through social supports and target-hardening — has enormous potential for positive change.  

2. Reduce Demand for Law Enforcement

A central reason why law enforcement does not prevent more crime or solve more crimes is that they are too busy doing things that accomplish neither objective. If the police were called less often for unproductive reasons, there would be less under-policing — and less over-policing as well. If cities and towns set the explicit goal of having people call the police less often, law enforcement would be more efficient at taking on the tasks that remain.

3. Fixing Distressed Spaces

There is a wide body of evidence that shows that places poison people more routinely than people poison places. Crime does not result from “areas” of the “inner city” being high risk, but rather from a few very small, very bad places. Concentrated efforts to improve contagious places can build resiliency across neighborhoods. 

4. Making Crime Attractors Less Appealing 

Certain places attract and generate crime — schools, the built environment and bars being at the top of the list. More often than not, careful planning and implementation of best practices in situational crime prevention can reduce the harms they unintentionally generate and, in the case of schools and transit, unlock their potential for guardianship.

5. Scientific Supports for Law Enforcement 

Police in the United States would benefit from increased reliance on civilians in two realms: translating scientific evidence into practice, and increasing their reliance on civilian analysts to study local policing practices. In particular, if law enforcement was aided by more civilian analysts who were better trained, crime would be reduced while the footprint of policing was reduced.  

6. Improving the Job Market and Job Training

The relationship between jobs and crime is far more complex than in the popular imagination — higher national-level unemployment rates, for example, do not seem to increase violence. But targeted programs can have large effects. Integrating social and emotional skills training into employment training for young people has solid evidence of effectiveness as does employment planning for people returning from prison and transitional jobs for high risk people. 

7. Facilitate Neighborhood Non-Profits

In his excellent book ”Uneasy Peace,” Professor Patrick Sharkey reports on a study that found that for each 10 additional nonprofits in a given city, the violent crime rate is reduced by 14% (in the study period between 1990 and 2013). It should come as no surprise that access to more and better services has positive effects. Local government can aid the development of these local assets by providing funding for hyper-local community projects. 

8. Make Jails and Prison Less Criminogenic

We have overwhelmingly designed our jails and prisons to prevent people from gaining the skills to work and maintain their sobriety when they go home, and cut them off from their most crime-reducing assets, their family and friends. Small investments in humanity yield large returns when jails and prisons are not designed to produce more crime.

9. Better Prepare People to Return Home from Prison

People returning from prison need specific supports to facilitate a successful transition – 82% of people released from prison are rearrested within 10 years. And the solutions are simple — leaving facilities with an ID, prescriptions, a place to stay, a way to get started. A goal without a plan is a wish — people should leave prison with a plan and the supports to implement that plan.

10. Fund Community-Based Violence Interruption

A growing body of evidence finds that credible messengers — individuals with lived experience — coupled with psychosocial services can prevent retaliatory violence and repeat victimization. But this is a new sector and will need time and space to learn and grow.

11. Use Technology to Reduce Violence

Professor Graham Farrell argues convincingly that increases in security technology (such as engine immobilizers and cameras) in the 1990s were the only universal explanation for the universal decline in crime. There is much more that can be done using technology without imposing on civil liberties: text message reminders for court and probation appearances, databases to maintain records on police officers with histories of abuse and anti-crime features on ordinary consumer products are just the start. 

12. Tackle the Causes and Consequences of Poverty 

Poverty drives crime and violence in numerous ways beyond a simple lack of income, through weakened social bonds. A number of important policies have been successfully piloted but not fully implemented by state and local government. These are the big-ticket items — child poverty tax credits, whole-school anti-bullying programs, expanding Medicaid — that have the biggest crime reduction benefits. But the benefits outweigh the costs for dozens of policies and programs. 

13. Fix Long-Standing Problems 

Problems often persist because they have high costs, a lack of immediacy and declining political constituency — but these perpetual problems are often the key risk condition causing crime in a place to persist. Unhealthy homes, lead paint and pipes, and under-resourced foster care all promote crime.

14. Shorten the Reach of the Criminal Justice System

Too many financial burdens are imposed on people with low risk to public safety, creating a cycle of debt and incarceration, the latter which increases violence through stigma, criminal capital accumulation and a disruption of social bonds. Removing those conditions by clearing old warrants and convictions, reducing toxic fines and fees and ending poverty traps would prevent crime.

15. Help Those with Substance-Use Disorders 

In the 1990s and 2000s, with trepidation, the justice system began treating substance-use disorders as a disease rather than a crime. Expansion in the broadest of these interventions – problem-solving courts and in-prison substance use treatment — largely ended more than a decade ago. Many extremely useful ideas have been piloted — trauma-informed care, motivational interviewing, treating withdrawal in prison — but few were ever taken fully to scale. Those foundations are ready-made to build upon. 

16. Support Programs for High-Risk Young People and Families

A lot of criminology is concerned with bending the criminal trajectory curve — to keep adolescents from accelerating their delinquency or failing to desist as they age — and a huge body of scholarship has contributed to numerous model programs. From prenatal programs, to social and emotional learning, to programs for high-risk adolescents, there is a tremendous base of knowledge.

17. Education

Improving education is its own crime-reducing category, but schools can facilitate crime reduction outside of schools. Reducing food insecurity, humanizing discipline and improving the safety of the school commute benefit everyone. 

18. Housing

Like education, housing is its own category beyond the scope of this essay. But there are housing solutions with specific crime-reducing benefits: permanent, supportive housing; transitional housing for young people leaving homelessness; and housing programs specifically for people who cycle through emergency services. 

19. Policy and Law

There are any number of laws and regulations that could be tweaked to meaningfully reduce crime and victimization. For example, higher taxes that specifically target the overuse of criminogenic products like guns and alcohol have been shown to reduce excess demand. 

20. Stop the Proliferation of Firearms 

The link between firearms and violence is ironclad — the more guns, the more crime. More guns explain much of the difference in rates of violence between the U.S and peer nations. Fixing violence in the U.S. without addressing the gun problem, which is to say ensuring fewer potentially dangerous people have easy access to weapons, is embracing half-measures.

You’re in your 20s right ?   

[Offthemat]

15 minutes ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

 

What an infantile argument! Infantile, how so? Please explain. If you can't or won't then why waste the time in typing it?   Ideas. Did I say that was the extent of my ideas? Nope. Did you offer any at the time? No. If you had some then why didn't you take the opportunity to include them, like this....Enforce the law.   Enforce shoplifting laws.   Enforce camping laws.   Enforce open drug use laws.   Enforce assault, arson, and riot laws.   Those laws were enforced 10 years ago and we didn't have these problems to the extent that we have now.   These laws stopped being enforced around the George Floyd time.  Your idea is to run all businesses out of town.   How is that an idea of any validity?

 

I think I've seen you beat the drum of status quo policing theory, if it wasn't you then I'm sorry, but here are some resources that might help you understand that we don't have to do this anymore. That there are better ways to address crime other than adding more cops or throwing more people into prison. 

https://counciloncj.org/10-essential-actions/#step4

 

https://www.vitalcitynyc.org/articles/twenty-strategies-for-reducing-crime-in-cities 'And overwhelmingly, that research finds that the most effective crime-fighting tools were not explicitly about fighting crime.'

1. Help Victims of Crime 

There is far too little support for victims of crime, even though it is the most obvious place to start. Prior victimization — of a person or a place — is the top predictor of future victimization. Supporting people who have been victimized from being victimized again — through social supports and target-hardening — has enormous potential for positive change.  

2. Reduce Demand for Law Enforcement

A central reason why law enforcement does not prevent more crime or solve more crimes is that they are too busy doing things that accomplish neither objective. If the police were called less often for unproductive reasons, there would be less under-policing — and less over-policing as well. If cities and towns set the explicit goal of having people call the police less often, law enforcement would be more efficient at taking on the tasks that remain.

3. Fixing Distressed Spaces

There is a wide body of evidence that shows that places poison people more routinely than people poison places. Crime does not result from “areas” of the “inner city” being high risk, but rather from a few very small, very bad places. Concentrated efforts to improve contagious places can build resiliency across neighborhoods. 

4. Making Crime Attractors Less Appealing 

Certain places attract and generate crime — schools, the built environment and bars being at the top of the list. More often than not, careful planning and implementation of best practices in situational crime prevention can reduce the harms they unintentionally generate and, in the case of schools and transit, unlock their potential for guardianship.

5. Scientific Supports for Law Enforcement 

Police in the United States would benefit from increased reliance on civilians in two realms: translating scientific evidence into practice, and increasing their reliance on civilian analysts to study local policing practices. In particular, if law enforcement was aided by more civilian analysts who were better trained, crime would be reduced while the footprint of policing was reduced.  

6. Improving the Job Market and Job Training

The relationship between jobs and crime is far more complex than in the popular imagination — higher national-level unemployment rates, for example, do not seem to increase violence. But targeted programs can have large effects. Integrating social and emotional skills training into employment training for young people has solid evidence of effectiveness as does employment planning for people returning from prison and transitional jobs for high risk people. 

7. Facilitate Neighborhood Non-Profits

In his excellent book ”Uneasy Peace,” Professor Patrick Sharkey reports on a study that found that for each 10 additional nonprofits in a given city, the violent crime rate is reduced by 14% (in the study period between 1990 and 2013). It should come as no surprise that access to more and better services has positive effects. Local government can aid the development of these local assets by providing funding for hyper-local community projects. 

8. Make Jails and Prison Less Criminogenic

We have overwhelmingly designed our jails and prisons to prevent people from gaining the skills to work and maintain their sobriety when they go home, and cut them off from their most crime-reducing assets, their family and friends. Small investments in humanity yield large returns when jails and prisons are not designed to produce more crime.

9. Better Prepare People to Return Home from Prison

People returning from prison need specific supports to facilitate a successful transition – 82% of people released from prison are rearrested within 10 years. And the solutions are simple — leaving facilities with an ID, prescriptions, a place to stay, a way to get started. A goal without a plan is a wish — people should leave prison with a plan and the supports to implement that plan.

10. Fund Community-Based Violence Interruption

A growing body of evidence finds that credible messengers — individuals with lived experience — coupled with psychosocial services can prevent retaliatory violence and repeat victimization. But this is a new sector and will need time and space to learn and grow.

11. Use Technology to Reduce Violence

Professor Graham Farrell argues convincingly that increases in security technology (such as engine immobilizers and cameras) in the 1990s were the only universal explanation for the universal decline in crime. There is much more that can be done using technology without imposing on civil liberties: text message reminders for court and probation appearances, databases to maintain records on police officers with histories of abuse and anti-crime features on ordinary consumer products are just the start. 

12. Tackle the Causes and Consequences of Poverty 

Poverty drives crime and violence in numerous ways beyond a simple lack of income, through weakened social bonds. A number of important policies have been successfully piloted but not fully implemented by state and local government. These are the big-ticket items — child poverty tax credits, whole-school anti-bullying programs, expanding Medicaid — that have the biggest crime reduction benefits. But the benefits outweigh the costs for dozens of policies and programs. 

13. Fix Long-Standing Problems 

Problems often persist because they have high costs, a lack of immediacy and declining political constituency — but these perpetual problems are often the key risk condition causing crime in a place to persist. Unhealthy homes, lead paint and pipes, and under-resourced foster care all promote crime.

14. Shorten the Reach of the Criminal Justice System

Too many financial burdens are imposed on people with low risk to public safety, creating a cycle of debt and incarceration, the latter which increases violence through stigma, criminal capital accumulation and a disruption of social bonds. Removing those conditions by clearing old warrants and convictions, reducing toxic fines and fees and ending poverty traps would prevent crime.

15. Help Those with Substance-Use Disorders 

In the 1990s and 2000s, with trepidation, the justice system began treating substance-use disorders as a disease rather than a crime. Expansion in the broadest of these interventions – problem-solving courts and in-prison substance use treatment — largely ended more than a decade ago. Many extremely useful ideas have been piloted — trauma-informed care, motivational interviewing, treating withdrawal in prison — but few were ever taken fully to scale. Those foundations are ready-made to build upon. 

16. Support Programs for High-Risk Young People and Families

A lot of criminology is concerned with bending the criminal trajectory curve — to keep adolescents from accelerating their delinquency or failing to desist as they age — and a huge body of scholarship has contributed to numerous model programs. From prenatal programs, to social and emotional learning, to programs for high-risk adolescents, there is a tremendous base of knowledge.

17. Education

Improving education is its own crime-reducing category, but schools can facilitate crime reduction outside of schools. Reducing food insecurity, humanizing discipline and improving the safety of the school commute benefit everyone. 

18. Housing

Like education, housing is its own category beyond the scope of this essay. But there are housing solutions with specific crime-reducing benefits: permanent, supportive housing; transitional housing for young people leaving homelessness; and housing programs specifically for people who cycle through emergency services. 

19. Policy and Law

There are any number of laws and regulations that could be tweaked to meaningfully reduce crime and victimization. For example, higher taxes that specifically target the overuse of criminogenic products like guns and alcohol have been shown to reduce excess demand. 

20. Stop the Proliferation of Firearms 

The link between firearms and violence is ironclad — the more guns, the more crime. More guns explain much of the difference in rates of violence between the U.S and peer nations. Fixing violence in the U.S. without addressing the gun problem, which is to say ensuring fewer potentially dangerous people have easy access to weapons, is embracing half-measures.

Psychobabble. 

[Gene Mills Fan]

1 hour ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

 

do you seriously think locking down shit because it’s stolen all the time is not a thing ?  Here it is again, if you can point out where I made this claim, then I will address it. I understand if you feel triggered by my response and you no longer want to continue the conversation. But understand that trying to ask a 'straw man/gas light' question like this does not warrant a response from me until you can accurately provide the point you are responding to or demonstrate the relevance. Because this doesn't. 

 

I know you try to engage in provocative conversations but this point you are, seemingly, trying to make by asking the question and by including videos, firstly, wasn't a point I was making or refuting. So you need to be better. If for no other reason then you are more efficient with your posts and the gathering of supporting evidence. cuz this was a waste of your time and energy. 

 

And wowzer, those are a lot of videos. But even all locked up the stores are still open and seemingly profitable enough to remain so. So what is your point?  You copied and pasted this(above in black) into my reply, its from another poster, what are you trying to put words in my mouth? analyzing and explaining to me how I feel? 

 

now my reply begins: 

 

SEATTLE – More than 60 businesses(which ones? and are they in the inner city, you should ask SH what they mean by inner city so you can determine if any of the businesses in Seattle meet that criteria to make your point. you're so close to making your point but still not there yet) are cleaning up the damage left behind by vandals and looters who ransacked their stores. Again, you might not be wrong. but you haven't provided evidence that anyone should believe you are correct. the text from Seattle says downtown can't you read?

A largely peaceful protest was held Saturday in response to the death of George Floyd in Minnesota. The demonstration turned violent when a separate group of people interrupted with their own agenda(this is interesting, which group, what agenda? is this the same group as the peaceful protesters? I'm interested to know, care to fill in the blanks?), terrorizing the city of Seattle into the night. After the group’s destructive path through downtown, businesses began picking up the pieces Sunday. which group? c'mon do I have to go get news clips and pics again? see downtown!. BLM and antifa

Construction crews carefully removed shattered glass and boarded up several downtown businesses including a luxury clothing store called Buki.

 

Maybe just keep asking questions is the best way to offer nothing . I expected nothing less When you haven't sufficiently answered them, then what else can I do? I have nothing to make a comment about. I understand that its frustrating. You might feel that I am moving the goal posts, but if you go back to see the full conversation, the criteria has never changed even a bit. You just haven't been able to meet it. but you're almost there. 

Can you provide evidence these things did not happen? Theres a good question. In your own mind; the bold above makes the rest of your commentary gibberish and moot? 

perhaps instead of deny i should have said deflect and stall.. so as not to actually answer the question or admit you are wrong. Glad you were able to admit our confusion. If you have any questions, I'm happy to answer as usual. Often with more than 4 words. 

I never mentioned insurance in one of my posts. what are you trying to put words in my mouth?

still haven't addressed my insurance point. you haven't substantiated your point with facts. In general, I would say yes, insurance rates tend to go up after making a claim and getting money from the insurance company. But a full exploration of the situation might, MIGHT, find that the businesses or building were rebuilt in such a way that might mitigate any increase in insurance costs by being more efficient amenities; heating, cooling, lighting, water, and/or gas. Might have better more efficient layouts so as to offer a wider range of products that could net them higher return. Enticing more and different customers that are willing to travel and in so pay more for the products. There are a bazillion things that could happen(not saying they did) to help ensure those businesses return in a better way than before. I know just the idea of this cuts at your point. But again, you have not offered support for your point. So until you can do that, you're still just asking me to trust you. I'm sure anyone reading this thread will know that we are not likely to do that. 

but keep stalling. 

Ask Mspart he lives there

Edited November 14, 2025 by Gene Mills Fan

[ThreePointTakedown]

Just gonna take the Dub from you jamokes! 
 

(Dab)

Do better! 
I’m out!

[mspart]

13 minutes ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

Just gonna take the Dub from you jamokes! 
 

(Dab)

Do better! 
I’m out!

You are getting more unreasonable each time you post.   Now because we answer you and you want nuance you win?   You obviously cannot remember life pre George Floyd.   Stores did not lock their stuff in cages, that is now.   Stores did not lose a lot of money due to shoplifting.   There were consequences for doing that.   You don't want to see that apparently.   Life was a lot different 6 years ago.   We have allowed people to act badly and that is what we get and now people like you say that is the new norm.   It doesn't have to be the new norm.   But with attitudes like yours, that is what we will get.   

We are lowering the standards of civil conduct to the lowest common denominator.   Of course we will have problems when we do that.  You obviously don't have an answer for this and won't listen when answers are given.  

mspart

[Scouts Honor]

2 hours ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

So you have no ideas? 
Thats a shame. 

Grocery stores with 25-30% cheaper food might get robbed less. There’s one. Economics is fun. 

wow. he just gave you an idea.

[Scouts Honor]

2 hours ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

Which of those were inner city businesses? 
I know connections are difficult. But examples of buildings on fire don’t necessarily meet the criteria we were talking about. But go ahead and run from the nuances of a conversation because you can’t find examples of what I was asking for! I expected nothing less. 

why would it matter if it were an inner city business? 

[Scouts Honor]

2 hours ago, Caveira said:

@ThreePointTakedown

do you seriously think locking down shit because it’s stolen all the time is not a thing ?  

 

 

 

 

yes he ignores all evidence not generated by 1 point loss 

[Scouts Honor]

2 hours ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

 Glad you were able to admit our confusion. If you have any questions, I'm happy to answer as usual. Often with more than 4 words. 

 

we know.. you have to hide your lies etc with BS 

[Scouts Honor]

1 hour ago, Caveira said:

You’re in your 20s right ?   

no we established... less than 5

[Scouts Honor]

1 hour ago, Offthemat said:

Psychobabble. 

his mo

everything must be more than 4 words... to hide his bs 

[Scouts Honor]

[Scouts Honor]

here is a solution he won't like.

but it applies to most everyday situations

[JimmySpeaks]

3 hours ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

Me alpha. Me don’t help anyone. Bootstraps are best for lifting. Me no lose. Me make point. Good point. Best point. You young. Me scared of immigrants. Me no like talking with facts. Only emotional outbursts. 

Yep. You’re all talk no action. Typical young commie