Who unalived Charlie?

[uncle bernard]

We can do this all day. You've already acknowledged your initial question was stupid, though you haven't realized that yet. You are unable to see past your ideological blinders.

You think leftists are undisciplined, lazy, not committed to personal responsibility, etc...because you have an extremely narrow conception of what those things mean and how they can manifest.

Let's use an extreme example: The Palestine protestors on campus.

It takes tremendous discipline to camp in one spot for weeks, foregoing fun social activities and comfort, all while facing serious personal and professional consequences for doing it. It takes a lot of hard work to organize such a venture. It requires organizing supplies, shelter, and people to act as one cohesive unit. It's incredibly tough and gritty to stand in the face of police officers in riot gear as they try to strike you and drag you away. Imagine the discipline it takes to stand in place while your lungs fill with tear gas. 

And why were they doing this? Because they felt personally responsible, as citizens of the country to funds and arms Israel, for Israel's actions in Gaza. That's an abundance of personal responsibility! 

You are narrow-minded, and I mean that very literally. You don't understand how core principles can manifest in different ways.

[Caveira]

2 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

And why were they doing this?

They’re paid?

 

[uncle bernard]

Just now, Caveira said:

Since y’all like AI this now proves this to be a fact not a stereotype.   Two fascinating facts here.    Liberals mostly do not like wrestling.   It is to hard of a sport for them.    It is impossible for a wrestling fan to like the wnba more than wrestling.    

 

 

 

For liberals in the U.S., the top sports they are more likely to be fans of (compared with conservatives) include:

1. Soccer (MLS, World Cup, international football) – tends to attract younger, urban, and diverse fans.

2. Basketball (NBA, WNBA, college basketball) – especially the NBA, which polls show has a more liberal fan base.

3. Tennis – especially with interest in players like Serena Williams, Naomi Osaka, Rafael Nadal.

4. Track & Field / Running / Marathons – often tied to health, fitness, and urban events.

5. Swimming – both Olympic swimming and recreational swimming rank high in liberal-leaning areas.

6. Surfing / Skateboarding – alternative/lifestyle sports often connected to liberal coastal cultures.

7. Cycling – both competitive and recreational, especially in liberal cities like Portland, Austin, Boulder.

8. Climbing / Outdoor Adventure Sports – rock climbing, hiking, mountaineering often overlap with liberal outdoors culture.

9. Baseball (MLB) – still has a strong liberal fan base in big cities, though it skews mixed overall.

10. Women’s Sports in general – WNBA, NWSL (soccer), women’s college basketball, etc. have disproportionately liberal fan bases.

Conservatives also mostly do not like wrestling. It is an unpopular sport. Again, if we're going to use @jross generalizing logic, we should accept the following as true:

Conservatives do not like wrestling? 

How do we know that? Because most conservatives do not watch, follow, or support wrestling.

The hole in that logic is obvious. The reason most conservatives do not like wrestling is because most people don't like wrestling. But that's the exact kind of logical hole that @jross misses over and over again.

[mspart]

4 minutes ago, Caveira said:

For liberals in the U.S., the top sports they are more likely to be fans of (compared with conservatives) include:

1. Soccer (MLS, World Cup, international football) – tends to attract younger, urban, and diverse fans.

2. Basketball (NBA, WNBA, college basketball) – especially the NBA, which polls show has a more liberal fan base.

3. Tennis – especially with interest in players like Serena Williams, Naomi Osaka, Rafael Nadal.

4. Track & Field / Running / Marathons – often tied to health, fitness, and urban events.

5. Swimming – both Olympic swimming and recreational swimming rank high in liberal-leaning areas.

6. Surfing / Skateboarding – alternative/lifestyle sports often connected to liberal coastal cultures.

7. Cycling – both competitive and recreational, especially in liberal cities like Portland, Austin, Boulder.

8. Climbing / Outdoor Adventure Sports – rock climbing, hiking, mountaineering often overlap with liberal outdoors culture.

9. Baseball (MLB) – still has a strong liberal fan base in big cities, though it skews mixed overall.

10. Women’s Sports in general – WNBA, NWSL (soccer), women’s college basketball, etc. have disproportionately liberal fan bases.

I would say, 1-10 would definitely have a conservative following.    Women's sports in general, maybe maybe not.   I don't mind women's sports, I just don't find the level of play very compelling.   Swimming is different, I'm not worried about their time as I am the race so I'll watch that.   Women's gymnastics - try getting a guy to do those events ha ha.   Figure skating or speed skating I'll watch either sex.   Heck I love surfing, doing it and watching it.   Although if you saw me surf you would not say I was actually surfing, more like drowning.   Plus I get sea sick so I'm not a good fit but love it anyway.  Baseball, I love it.  Rock climbing I love it.  

mspart

[Caveira]

4 minutes ago, mspart said:

I would say, 1-10 would definitely have a conservative following.    Women's sports in general, maybe maybe not.   I don't mind women's sports, I just don't find the level of play very compelling.   Swimming is different, I'm not worried about their time as I am the race so I'll watch that.   Women's gymnastics - try getting a guy to do those events ha ha.   Figure skating or speed skating I'll watch either sex.   Heck I love surfing, doing it and watching it.   Although if you saw me surf you would not say I was actually surfing, more like drowning.   Plus I get sea sick so I'm not a good fit but love it anyway.  Baseball, I love it.  Rock climbing I love it.  

mspart

I was joking     Enjoy surfing!

[mspart]

11 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Conservatives also mostly do not like wrestling. It is an unpopular sport. Again, if we're going to use @jross generalizing logic, we should accept the following as true:

Conservatives do not like wrestling? 

How do we know that? Because most conservatives do not watch, follow, or support wrestling.

The hole in that logic is obvious. The reason most conservatives do not like wrestling is because most people don't like wrestling. But that's the exact kind of logical hole that @jross misses over and over again.

I think you have a point based on engagement.   Not many people are interested in wrestling.   We are a small community.   But I think the fact remains that of those that do, more tend to be conservative than liberal as jross showed.   So that is a logic hole you are absolutely on purpose ignoring to try to score some pointless point.  

This argument has really run its course.   Since we don't know who killed Kirk, we have no idea of anything other than a conservative was shot and killed yesterday.   Why was he killed?   We can only speculate.   But we can make educated guesses that may be right or wrong.   We don't know enough at the moment other than there are a lot of people very happy about this event and a lot of people not very happy with it.  My son said that people at his work were happy about it.   Really, that's sick.   It's as sick as someone wanting Biden, Schumer, AOC, etc dead.   That's just sick.   Happy when they get voted out of Congress and happy he was demoted from President.   But to wish them dead and be happy with such an occurrence is sick and twisted and pathological.  Period.  

mspart

[mspart]

7 minutes ago, Caveira said:

I was joking     Enjoy surfing!

When I lived on O'ahu, I did enjoy it.   I went to one Surf competition and was amazed at how good the pro's really are.    The waves were terrible, about 2 feet high and they were riding them for all they were worth and it was amazing.   I could never get up on such little waves.   Now I live near Seattle and don't surf here.   When we lived there I kept saying I;d love to surf but didn't want to spend the money on  board.   My wife went to Costco and bought me a long board.   It was fun while it lasted!!

mspart

[jross]

14 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

Conservatives also mostly do not like wrestling. It is an unpopular sport. Again, if we're going to use @jross generalizing logic, we should accept the following as true:

Conservatives do not like wrestling? 

How do we know that? Because most conservatives do not watch, follow, or support wrestling.

The hole in that logic is obvious. The reason most conservatives do not like wrestling is because most people don't like wrestling. But that's the exact kind of logical hole that @jross misses over and over again.

Nice to see you using your own thinking powers.  What you have here is a logical fallacy.  I'd say this is a indeterminate stereotype because to say a group does not like wrestling implies that they dislike wrestling when they most likely are indifferent or oblivious to it.  Like handball.  I don't even know if its a sport played in high school.  I don't like or dislike it.

 

[jross]

51 minutes ago, uncle bernard said:

We know quite a bit about Thomas Crooks. It just doesn't track with the juicy headline people want, so they ignored it. He had an extended descent into mental illness. Father reported finding him dancing and talking to himself in his room. His internet search history shows him researching severe depression. Started buying guns and explosives. Wrote an essay on the evils of divisive political campaigns for class. Here's some good reading: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/06/08/us/thomas-crooks-trump-shooter-butler-rally.html?searchResultPosition=1

I think the general takeaway is this kid had fairly middle of the road politics (came from a mixed politics family and peers report moderate opinions) and generally disliked how hostile American politics have become. Then he suffered a mental breakdown of sorts that eventually led to violent inclinations. The most divisive politician of his lifetime visited his hometown and, after the effects of the mental issues, it "made sense" to him to kill him.

The golf-course assassin's case is more clear. He had a long criminal history and was a generally strange guy. Voted for Trump in 2016. Hated him by the end of his first term. Became obsessed with the war in Ukraine (tried to volunteer to fight for Ukraine). That is his stated motivation for the assassination attempt. 

This actually is a another good example of why your reliance on stereotypes is dangerous. The *accuracy* of your stereotypes is only as good as your knowledge of the world and you seem to have very little drive to learn about the world (lack of personal responsibility imo). All of this stuff has been out there for along time and is easily accessible. Instead, you just assumed because you hadn't seen it, it didn't exist. 

I read up that the latest is that there was not a second shooter with Thomas Crooks.  The last I had heard before was potentially misinformation that there was a second more professional shooter.

[El Luchador]

2 hours ago, mspart said:

I would say, 1-10 would definitely have a conservative following.    Women's sports in general, maybe maybe not.   I don't mind women's sports, I just don't find the level of play very compelling.   Swimming is different, I'm not worried about their time as I am the race so I'll watch that.   Women's gymnastics - try getting a guy to do those events ha ha.   Figure skating or speed skating I'll watch either sex.   Heck I love surfing, doing it and watching it.   Although if you saw me surf you would not say I was actually surfing, more like drowning.   Plus I get sea sick so I'm not a good fit but love it anyway.  Baseball, I love it.  Rock climbing I love it.  

mspart

I enjoy gymnastics. About a year ago I watched a video of girls doing men's gymnastics and then the men doing female gymnastics. It was entertaining.

[El Luchador]

 

 

 

[El Luchador]

 

 

 

[1032004]

6 hours ago, jross said:

What discussion led you to believe one cannot push back?

Unlike the accurate stereotypes, to say that conservatives are racist is a wrong and harmful one.  If it was most conservatives, then you would be fine.  But it is by far a minority of conservatives that are racist... so you are wrong.

 

Are a majority of blacks violent?  That stereotype seems to be a popular one in recent days

[Caveira]

5 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Are a majority of blacks violent?  That stereotype seems to be a popular one in recent days

Who said that?

[1032004]

6 minutes ago, Caveira said:

Who said that?

A lot more people than are celebrating the death of Charlie Kirk.

[jross]

10 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

Are a majority of blacks violent?  That stereotype seems to be a popular one in recent days

of course not per fed data.  it’s a small fraction of the black population.

[jross]

8 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

A lot more people than are celebrating the death of Charlie Kirk.

Did they say the majority of blacks are violent OR did they say blacks are more violent than other races?  The fed data makes it clear that blacks are overwhelmingly not violent while also being more violent than other races.

But that’s just federal data facts.

Not racist but it is uncomfortable.

[1032004]

3 minutes ago, jross said:

Did they say the majority of blacks are violent OR did they say blacks are more violent than other races?  The fed data makes it clear that blacks are overwhelmingly not violent while also being more violent than other races.

But that’s just federal data facts.

Not racist but it is uncomfortable.

So can we say conservatives are more racist than liberals?

[jross]

13 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

A lot more people than are celebrating the death of Charlie Kirk.

I haven’t seen or read news about people saying that, but a little research does pull up examples.

I can’t not see people celebrating Kirk’s death.  It’s multiple places, multiple times a day.  My sophomores classmates, facebook, twitter, news…

[jross]

1 minute ago, 1032004 said:

So can we say conservatives are more racist than liberals?

Speech is free but do you have data that supports it?  

[1032004]

1 minute ago, jross said:

I haven’t seen or read news about people saying that, but a little research does pull up examples.

I can’t not see people celebrating Kirk’s death.  It’s multiple places, multiple times a day.  My sophomores classmates, facebook, twitter, news…

The closest I’ve seen to someone personally celebrating it is probably Tripnsweep here.  All the rest have been shared by someone else.

[JimmySpeaks]

1 minute ago, 1032004 said:

The closest I’ve seen to someone personally celebrating it is probably Tripnsweep here.  All the rest have been shared by someone else.

It’s everywhere on social media.  And you still haven’t found any conservatives that have done anything comparable to slip n tweet on this site have you.  You’re always so thorough going back theu the archives here too. 

[jross]

If one accepts that racism can exist against the majority race… then DEI is codified racism… supported by one form of liberals

[jross]

2 minutes ago, JimmySpeaks said:

It’s everywhere on social media.  And you still haven’t found any conservatives that have done anything comparable to slip n tweet on this site have you.  You’re always so thorough going back theu the archives here too. 

I am definitely seeing conservatives accused of not speaking out to denounce violence against leftists.  Deflection and whataboutism running strong.

[JimmySpeaks]

5 minutes ago, jross said:

I am definitely seeing conservatives accused of not speaking out to denounce violence against leftists.  Deflection and whataboutism running strong.

Yep we’ve had records amounts of what abouts the last couple days.