Richie Figs at 133

[BruceyB]

36 minutes ago, Gus said:

I can't see Swiderski beating Henson or SVN. I could see him in tier 2. 

He's not my pick right now, but I wouldn't be that surprised to see him pull out a win against either. Especially in the era where a wrestler can score a takedown in the first, and then give up 3 stall calls throughout the rest of the match and win 4-3.

[Winners Circle]

1 hour ago, nhs67 said:

https://www.wrestlestat.com/compare/wrestler/66962/jamison-tagen/71913/swiderski-casey

I mean... he wasn't as good as Jamison when they were both at 141lbs.

They never were both at 141 at the same time. Swiderski started at 141 as a true FR in 2022-2023 and made the bloodround. Jamison redshirted in 2022-2023 and went 0-0. In 2023-2024 Swiderski went 149 and finished 7th and Jamison went 0-2 at NCAAs at 141.. 

[poke1]

48 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

They never were both at 141 at the same time. Swiderski started at 141 as a true FR in 2022-2023 and made the bloodround. Jamison redshirted in 2022-2023 and went 0-0. In 2023-2024 Swiderski went 149 and finished 7th and Jamison went 0-2 at NCAAs at 141.. 

And that year Iowa St./OKST dual Swiderski wrestled Carter Young.

[happyvalet]

48 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

They never were both at 141 at the same time. Swiderski started at 141 as a true FR in 2022-2023 and made the bloodround. Jamison redshirted in 2022-2023 and went 0-0. In 2023-2024 Swiderski went 149 and finished 7th and Jamison went 0-2 at NCAAs at 141.. 

Their sophomore years (most recent) Jamison scored 5.5 tournament points and Swiderski scored 7.5, but Jamison had a tougher path. Jamison's best wins are better. Overall they're pretty similar results wise. 

[poke1]

1 minute ago, poke1 said:

And that year Iowa St./OKST dual Swiderski wrestled Carter Young.

Carter won that match 3-0.

[nhs67]

2 hours ago, Winners Circle said:

They never were both at 141 at the same time. Swiderski started at 141 as a true FR in 2022-2023 and made the bloodround. Jamison redshirted in 2022-2023 and went 0-0. In 2023-2024 Swiderski went 149 and finished 7th and Jamison went 0-2 at NCAAs at 141.. 

I never said same time, brosef.

[Boring]

On 4/8/2025 at 12:45 PM, BruceyB said:

I think others have well spelled out my point by now.

Also, to suggest I don't know much about wrestling to then go on and suggest that the backup to Witcraft (who didn't qualify for NCAAs) would absolutely smoke Figs at 133 is pretty ironic.. it's commonly understood that Hughes wasn't truly a 133 pound this year, and won't attempt to compete there again next season.

Where did I say Witcraft would smoke Figs? Witcraft is graduating. 

[nhs67]

46 minutes ago, Boring said:

Where did I say Witcraft would smoke Figs? Witcraft is graduating. 

Transitive.

You're saying a guy who couldn't beat Whitcraft would smoke Figs.

You're wrong.  We've already come to that understanding as a whole.

[Winners Circle]

16 hours ago, happyvalet said:

Their sophomore years (most recent) Jamison scored 5.5 tournament points and Swiderski scored 7.5, but Jamison had a tougher path. Jamison's best wins are better. Overall they're pretty similar results wise. 

Jamison's best win in two NCAA tournaments is Julian Tagg and Eligh Rivera. Swiderski's best wins in two NCAA tournaments are D'Emilion and Kinner. These are not similar. I AM AN OSU FAN. And as a fan I feel our best option is Swiderski. Could I be wrong, obviously. But I've seen two years of Jamison and 0 AA finishes. 

[nhs67]

2 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

Jamison's best win in two NCAA tournaments is Julian Tagg and Eligh Rivera. Swiderski's best wins in two NCAA tournaments are D'Emilion and Kinner. These are not similar. I AM AN OSU FAN. And as a fan I feel our best option is Swiderski. Could I be wrong, obviously. But I've seen two years of Jamison and 0 AA finishes. 

Ah, I didn't mean specifically at NCAAs.

I also want Swiderski as the starter, if I have to choose between the two, but I am biased towards Mr. Woodchopper.

I honestly would prefer to get both in the lineup, but I don't know if 141lbs should be an option for either.

[Winners Circle]

16 minutes ago, nhs67 said:

Ah, I didn't mean specifically at NCAAs.

I also want Swiderski as the starter, if I have to choose between the two, but I am biased towards Mr. Woodchopper.

I honestly would prefer to get both in the lineup, but I don't know if 141lbs should be an option for either.

We agree on this 100%.

[alex1fly]

38 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

Jamison's best win in two NCAA tournaments is Julian Tagg and Eligh Rivera. Swiderski's best wins in two NCAA tournaments are D'Emilion and Kinner. These are not similar. I AM AN OSU FAN. And as a fan I feel our best option is Swiderski. Could I be wrong, obviously. But I've seen two years of Jamison and 0 AA finishes. 

Not NCAAs but he beat Alirez at Big 12s this year. I was at the park with my kid and just about screamed when that happened. Then my kid rode her bike for the first time without me holding her and I DID scream haha

hes got all the tools. I’d love to see him up a weight. 

[Winners Circle]

4 minutes ago, alex1fly said:

Not NCAAs but he beat Alirez at Big 12s this year. I was at the park with my kid and just about screamed when that happened. Then my kid rode her bike for the first time without me holding her and I DID scream haha

hes got all the tools. I’d love to see him up a weight. 

The same Andrew Alirez that went 1-2 at NCAAs including an 11-6 loss to Eligh Rivera. I'm not sure that win is the measuring stick here. 

[Gus]

40 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

The same Andrew Alirez that went 1-2 at NCAAs including an 11-6 loss to Eligh Rivera. I'm not sure that win is the measuring stick here. 

That is not Jamison's only good career win. He had a win over NCAA finalist Brock Hardy this year (and one last year). He also has career wins over Anthony Echemendia, Cole Matthews, Sergio Lemely, Vince Cornella, Clay Carlson, Sam Latona, Josh Koderhandt, Sammy Alvarez, Mosha Schwartz, Eligh Rivera, Jason Miranda, Jordan Titus, Emilio Ysaguirre.... It's a solid hit list for Tagen. 

[Winners Circle]

13 minutes ago, Gus said:

That is not Jamison's only good career win. He had a win over NCAA finalist Brock Hardy this year (and one last year). He also has career wins over Anthony Echemendia, Cole Matthews, Sergio Lemely, Vince Cornella, Clay Carlson, Sam Latona, Josh Koderhandt, Sammy Alvarez, Mosha Schwartz, Eligh Rivera, Jason Miranda, Jordan Titus, Emilio Ysaguirre.... It's a solid hit list for Tagen. 

I'm aware. I have watched every Jamison match for the last two years. The problem is he hasn't beat anyone on this level at either NCAA tournament. Could that be weight cut related? Maybe. Could that be mental/anxiety related? Maybe. I lean towards the latter because he usually performs pretty well two weeks before at B12s. Hard for me to believe you develop weight cutting issues two weeks later. 

[nhs67]

1 hour ago, Gus said:

That is not Jamison's only good career win. He had a win over NCAA finalist Brock Hardy this year (and one last year). He also has career wins over Anthony Echemendia, Cole Matthews, Sergio Lemely, Vince Cornella, Clay Carlson, Sam Latona, Josh Koderhandt, Sammy Alvarez, Mosha Schwartz, Eligh Rivera, Jason Miranda, Jordan Titus, Emilio Ysaguirre.... It's a solid hit list for Tagen. 

Chittum too, yeah? 

[1032004]

2 hours ago, Winners Circle said:

Jamison's best win in two NCAA tournaments is Julian Tagg and Eligh Rivera. Swiderski's best wins in two NCAA tournaments are D'Emilion and Kinner. These are not similar.

I mean there’s not a huge separation there TBH.  Tagg and Rivera both finished R16 this year.   D’Emilio did not AA the year Swiderski beat him and Kinner finished 8th.

[Winners Circle]

7 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

I mean there’s not a huge separation there TBH.  Tagg and Rivera both finished R16 this year.   D’Emilio did not AA the year Swiderski beat him and Kinner finished 8th.

D'Emilio was a returning AA from the year before. And there's a HUGE difference between 8th and R16. You have to win two more matches against some of the best dudes in the country. It's a big difference. 

[1032004]

8 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

D'Emilio was a returning AA from the year before. And there's a HUGE difference between 8th and R16. You have to win two more matches against some of the best dudes in the country. It's a big difference. 

But it seems silly to limit the judgement to only NCAA’s.  Jamison has some great wins in the regular season/B12’s.  I also wouldn’t totally poo-poo Alirez this year, despite the limited regular season schedule he did have an 8-2 win over Composto who ended up taking 4th.  I’m guessing the loss to Rivera was more of a sad boy hours situation.

It does seem that it is well known Jamison cuts a lot of weight, so in terms of can he replicate some of those 141 wins at 149, I would tend to think so.    But sure, TBD if he can do it at NCAA’s.

[Winners Circle]

15 minutes ago, 1032004 said:

But it seems silly to limit the judgement to only NCAA’s.  Jamison has some great wins in the regular season/B12’s.  I also wouldn’t totally poo-poo Alirez this year, despite the limited regular season schedule he did have an 8-2 win over Composto who ended up taking 4th.  I’m guessing the loss to Rivera was more of a sad boy hours situation.

It does seem that it is well known Jamison cuts a lot of weight, so in terms of can he replicate some of those 141 wins at 149, I would tend to think so.    But sure, TBD if he can do it at NCAA’s.

The way our sport is currently structured, NCAAs is the only thing that matters. Ask any college coach. 

[1032004]

6 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

The way our sport is currently structured, NCAAs is the only thing that matters. Ask any college coach. 

OK and in their last tournament Swiderski scored 2 more points.  “Different tiers” is a stretch IMO, but you are welcome to your own opinion.

[Winners Circle]

Just now, 1032004 said:

OK and in their last tournament Swiderski scored 2 more points.  “Different tiers” is a stretch IMO, but you are welcome to your own opinion.

One guy AA'd and one didn't. PERIOD. 

[poke1]

2 hours ago, Winners Circle said:

I'm aware. I have watched every Jamison match for the last two years. The problem is he hasn't beat anyone on this level at either NCAA tournament. Could that be weight cut related? Maybe. Could that be mental/anxiety related? Maybe. I lean towards the latter because he usually performs pretty well two weeks before at B12s. Hard for me to believe you develop weight cutting issues two weeks later. 

I want to chime in as well and as a huge OState fan.  My thoughts on Jamison:  He's one of my favorites on the team, but my critique from watching him over the years is we all know he is as strong as an ox! For him to be a 141lber, which I consider to still be a lighter weight, he always seems to be a bit slower than eveyone else.  Which hinders his shots, kind of "slow and methodical" and I do believe most can see his shots coming. I also feel like he relies on his whizzer to much, which we all know he's comfortable being in and can score from but top guys can wrestle through it sometimes.  With his skill set, if he had the speed of someone like Mendez he would be a beast and right there at the top!

[okokzach]

18 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

One guy AA'd and one didn't. PERIOD. 

5.5 vs 7.5 points. Tagen had a much tougher match up facing the 4 seed in the blood round while Swiderski faced the 14 seed. If you think Swiderski is better than Tagen, go for it, but saying they're in different tiers is dumb tbh

[Boring]

30 minutes ago, Winners Circle said:

One guy AA'd and one didn't. PERIOD. 

That doesn't tell the entire story.