Are Republicans Insecure About Their Masculinity?

[mspart]

So what is toxic masculinity and why is it bad?

mspart

[ThreePointTakedown]

22 hours ago, Danny Deck said:

I think there is lots of room for reframing some things into masculine language that would be helpful. 

What I see from my women friends and co-workers are complaints about their husbands/partners not doing enough work around the house, helping with child rearing, etc. I think this is one area where things have changed a lot recently and old paradigms about the divison of labor at home doesn't make sense. Lots of couples have equally demanding jobs now, and yet there is still often the expectation that the woman will do the bulk of the household chores. 

Even if someone wants to frame themself in the traditional masculine terms as leader and provider in a household, well, a leader and a provider steps up and helps where it is needed to make sure all tasks are completed. Even if those tasks are "women's work." 

I think there is a move from younger men to be better at this, but there is so much learned helplessness. I listen to the Split Zone Duo podcast and on mailbag episodes at the end they'll often answer general life questions, and they frequently get questions about how to help their wives when they have a newborn. The host always says it isn't that hard, you should know what all chores always need to be done. There is almost certainly a load of clothes you can do, or dishes you can clean. Even in traditional masculine terms, you should take the initiative and get things done without being told to by your partner. 

So I agree this is changing in younger age groups, but I think it could change more quickly, and for the better with language that did more to meet people where they are and in terms they're more comfortable with. 

Well put

[ThreePointTakedown]

20 hours ago, Scouts Honor said:

TPT on the board being proud to replace women with men

There's an argument to be made that it'd probably be a safer and saner world. 

But let's go back to you not answering any of my questions and continuing to straw man a position I haven't even advocated for. 

Which leads me to my next question, why are you such a coward? Is it because you know you're wrong. It usually does. There is no one to hold you to account so you can spout off anything you want. As it turns out in this case being a troll, a coward, and a transphobe since you brought up Dylan Mulvaney(video). Why are you so scared of a person with a beer can? You probably pay someone on Etsy to make one for you. Just a thought. 

[red viking]

22 minutes ago, mspart said:

So what is toxic masculinity and why is it bad?

mspart

It's bad by definition. You can easily look up the definition of it. 

[ThreePointTakedown]

20 hours ago, Scouts Honor said:

the left is "ALL IN" on 

'trans' women being women... are they not?

so yes... the left is all in on replacing women with men

Nope. Not even close. But nice try. The fear is strong with you. So is your lack of understanding on this topic. 

I'll explain it to you again if you want me to. Might take awhile though. If you want to go out and read something on the subject. Say anything that would oppose your opinion, you'd find how wrong you are on the subject. But that's usually what keeps people from doing that. Knowing that if they do even a little bit of digging it'll turn out they were wrong the whole time. 

Best of luck

[Danny Deck]

13 minutes ago, mspart said:

So what is toxic masculinity and why is it bad?

mspart

I would describe it as a drive for physical dominance that presents itself in fighting and especially sexual violence. A rigid enforcement of strict gender roles and repression of emotions. 

I think the case against violence is already pretty clear. 

As for the other two, as I've said above, strict gender roles in the home just don't work as well when both partners are working 40+ hours a week. Leaving all domestic duties up to the wife isn't really fair and leads to strife in relationships. To the extent the male partner thinks they are owed June Cleaver who brings home a healthy paycheck too, it is toxic.

Repressing emotions, to me, is what leads to the violence. If you can't express what you're feeling then those emotions come out in other ways, and lots of times those ways are bad. Encouraging men to keep things bottled up is a toxic suggestion

[ThreePointTakedown]

18 hours ago, Bigbrog said:

Hey dum dum...you lecture people on admitting they don't get it... yet...YOU don't get it.  It's okay...you aren't as smart as you think you are.  YOU need to challenge your ideas and get away from Collage campus's indoctrination and experience real life...most people aren't victims, and no one is trying to oppress anyone...once you realize that your life will be much more happy

Blah blah blah... cue the right wing buzzword generator. Thanks for the name calling. You've checked off all the Bully Bingo Boxes. Congrats, you are officially a joke. 

Please point out where I need to learn more? One point. What am I not understanding about it? I dare you! You won't. Because there is nothing. You have an unfounded opinion. I have done nothing but repeat to you how unfounded it is and how embarrassed you should be to hold it and I am the one that needs to learn more.  And that's where you and I are different. I know your opinions hurt people. Not actively, no. You're not oppressing anyone. You have no real power. That might be your issue. But the perpetuation of your opinions in our society will keep people from challenging norms and seeking or receiving the care that they need. Be it; mental health, regular health, job training, a home, help transitioning to the gender the choose to portray. You try to fill in the 'pool' of smaller and smaller groups of people because you're scared of the changes they will force you to confront. Tale as old as time/racism!  

Filling in Pools this is an article that explains what I mean by 'filling in pools'. Which is what you're trying to do to trans people right now. You just can't find their pool so you're impotently screaming about it on the internet. 

'By the early 1970s, most of America’s urban amusement parks, like Cleveland’s Euclid Beach and Chicago’s Riverview, were closed for good. Some white consumers perceived the newly integrated parks as unsafe and in turn park owners sold the land for considerable profit. Other urban leisure sites — public swimming pools, bowling alleys and roller-skating rinks — also closed down as white consumers fled cities for the suburbs.'

Do you hear history echoing? 

[ThreePointTakedown]

6 hours ago, wrestlingguy said:

I need a puke emoji. Catering to the mentally Ill doesn't help them realize they need serious help.

Prove that they are mentally ill and not that you simply want them to be so you can feel more comfortable with their existence? 

[wrestlingguy]

1 hour ago, mspart said:

So what is toxic masculinity and why is it bad?

mspart

I saw something that said it perfectly.

"If masculinity were truly toxic, then the kids growing up without fathers would presumably be better off than those who have them. But they are not."

[wrestlingguy]

55 minutes ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

Prove that they are mentally ill and not that you simply want them to be so you can feel more comfortable with their existence? 

 the American Psychiatric Association's Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5) lists gender dysphoria as a mental disorder

[mspart]

I see where aggression is a male attribute.   Aggression to others is already unlawful.   But that is not what toxic masculinity really means in today's society.   Just being a man is somehow toxic.   Just doing man things is toxic.   The idea that men are too toxic but women cannot be is a charade.   Maybe we should talk about toxic  femininity and see where that goes.   I have never heard of that but it is just as much a thing as toxic masculinity.   Is that not a fair thing to say? 

mspart

[Scouts Honor]

2 hours ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

Nope. Not even close. But nice try. The fear is strong with you. So is your lack of understanding on this topic. 

I'll explain it to you again if you want me to. Might take awhile though. If you want to go out and read something on the subject. Say anything that would oppose your opinion, you'd find how wrong you are on the subject. But that's usually what keeps people from doing that. Knowing that if they do even a little bit of digging it'll turn out they were wrong the whole time. 

Best of luck

the left doesn't believe trans women are women? 

[Scouts Honor]

2 hours ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

There's an argument to be made that it'd probably be a safer and saner world. 

But let's go back to you not answering any of my questions and continuing to straw man a position I haven't even advocated for. 

Which leads me to my next question, why are you such a coward? Is it because you know you're wrong. It usually does. There is no one to hold you to account so you can spout off anything you want. As it turns out in this case being a troll, a coward, and a transphobe since you brought up Dylan Mulvaney(video). Why are you so scared of a person with a beer can? You probably pay someone on Etsy to make one for you. Just a thought. 

lol... replacing women with men would make for a safer, saner world

do you hear yourself?

how do you figure i am a coward?

im not scared of him. i think he and YOU, are idiots... for thinking that it's ok to pretend to be a woman, just by dressing up and playing all of the worst stereotypes of women.

 

etsy? what is that?

[Scouts Honor]

3 hours ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

There's an argument to be made that it'd probably be a safer and saner world. 

 

can there be a more misogynistic statement? 

[Scouts Honor]

toxic masculinity is bad, so lets replace women with men, so we have more of it?

we will be safer and saner with more men, which means more toxic masculinity..

 

am i doing this right? 

Edited September 4 by Scouts Honor

[Scouts Honor]

2 hours ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

Blah blah blah... cue the right wing buzzword generator. Thanks for the name calling. You've checked off all the Bully Bingo Boxes. Congrats, you are officially a joke. 

Please point out where I need to learn more? One point. What am I not understanding about it? I dare you! You won't. Because there is nothing. You have an unfounded opinion. I have done nothing but repeat to you how unfounded it is and how embarrassed you should be to hold it and I am the one that needs to learn more.  And that's where you and I are different. I know your opinions hurt people. Not actively, no. You're not oppressing anyone. You have no real power. That might be your issue. But the perpetuation of your opinions in our society will keep people from challenging norms and seeking or receiving the care that they need. Be it; mental health, regular health, job training, a home, help transitioning to the gender the choose to portray. You try to fill in the 'pool' of smaller and smaller groups of people because you're scared of the changes they will force you to confront. Tale as old as time/racism!  

Filling in Pools this is an article that explains what I mean by 'filling in pools'. Which is what you're trying to do to trans people right now. You just can't find their pool so you're impotently screaming about it on the internet. 

'By the early 1970s, most of America’s urban amusement parks, like Cleveland’s Euclid Beach and Chicago’s Riverview, were closed for good. Some white consumers perceived the newly integrated parks as unsafe and in turn park owners sold the land for considerable profit. Other urban leisure sites — public swimming pools, bowling alleys and roller-skating rinks — also closed down as white consumers fled cities for the suburbs.'

Do you hear history echoing? 

blah blah blah, cue the left wing buzzwords

 

people are moving away from trans people?  really? 

 

[Scouts Honor]

1 hour ago, wrestlingguy said:

I saw something that said it perfectly.

"If masculinity were truly toxic, then the kids growing up without fathers would presumably be better off than those who have them. But they are not."

TPT agrees, bc/ he said we would be safer and saner with women replacement

[Scouts Honor]

2 hours ago, ThreePointTakedown said:

Prove that they are mentally ill and not that you simply want them to be so you can feel more comfortable with their existence? 

oops, you were saying something about people needing to learn before they post...

[Bigbrog]

Cracks me up...everyone is afraid/scared again.  Crazy

If you ask a question...have an opinion...all of a sudden you are some sort of phob/ism, etc...then they try and lecture others...man...can't make this crap up!

[Scouts Honor]

who does it hurt 

who does it hurt

 

[Danny Deck]

16 hours ago, mspart said:

I see where aggression is a male attribute.   Aggression to others is already unlawful.   But that is not what toxic masculinity really means in today's society.   Just being a man is somehow toxic.   Just doing man things is toxic.   The idea that men are too toxic but women cannot be is a charade.   Maybe we should talk about toxic  femininity and see where that goes.   I have never heard of that but it is just as much a thing as toxic masculinity.   Is that not a fair thing to say? 

mspart

Toxic femininity does exist. Often the cruelest people to women about their appearance are other women. They are enforcing a very strict and limiting view of being a woman on other women. It is toxic. 

I've thought about in relation to men in bad relationships are often described as controlling. Women are often accused of being psycho (or other words that won't get past the filter). To me these really come down to the same behavior, where one party is trying to control the others behavior. Neither physical or emotional abuse is good. Each sex just uses the weapons they have at hand to enforce the behavior they want. It is toxic no matter where it comes from. 

I don't think "just being a man is somehow toxic." I think the "inside you are two wolves" meme is true for everyone and in men it presents in certain ways and in women others. Above someone said that if toxic masculinity were real all of these people growing up without fathers would be better. And I think just the opposite. When you don't have a role model of positive masculinity, you will go looking for any role model. Unfortunately, at first the people like Andrew Tate selling toxic masculinity look more fun and it can take a long time for someone to turn away from the image of masculinity when they realize how hollow it is. 

All over you can find people commenting on stuff "dudes rock" and that, to me, is an acknowledgment that this is something only men would do and it's fun and fine and not toxic. 

[mspart]

41 minutes ago, Danny Deck said:

I don't think "just being a man is somehow toxic."

I would venture to say there are many that believe that just being a man is toxic.   I agree with you, not every man is toxic just like not every woman is toxic.   Just most women are.  

mspart

[ThreePointTakedown]

19 hours ago, wrestlingguy said:

 the American Psychiatric Association's Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5) lists gender dysphoria as a mental disorder

Fair. But if you dig a little deeper you left out that there's a difference between being transgender and having gender dysphoria. One has the element of 'psychological distress' associated with it. 

How did you come to the conclusion they weren't just transgender and instead was suffering from gender dysmorphia? 

What is the 'catering' that you referred to? 

[ThreePointTakedown]

18 hours ago, Scouts Honor said:

the left doesn't believe trans women are women? 

Women ARE women. 

[WrestlingRasta]

If trans women are women, why the preclusion of “trans” or “identify as”?