Walz Military Record: The Right Wing Hypocrisy is Unreal!!!!

[Offthemat]

I haven’t found anything on what Walz’ MOS (military occupational specialty) was.  I know the National Guard is different from the Army, but with his rank being Master Sergeant instead of First Sergeant,, it’s very possible that he wasn’t trained combat arms.  His main career was as a teacher, so it’s unlikely his MOS was mechanic or computer repair or engineer (heavy equipment operator), so maybe a clerk or supply or something.  Funny, he was born at West Point.  West Point, Nebraska. 

[red viking]

31 minutes ago, Paul158 said:

I was wondering if you are familiar with the National Guard. Typically, they do one weekend per month for 11 months. Then they do 2 weeks training during the summer. It looks like Walz deployed to a base in Italy for 1 year.  This equates to about 9400 hours of active duty. A typical active-duty soldier in 23 years will accumulate 57,000 hours. I know these things because my son served in the National Guard for 9 years and active Duty in the Army for 12 years. He deployed to Afghanistan in combat for 1 1/2 years between his sophomore and junior years in college. He came home and finished college and got his Commision as an officer. He tried for several years to go active duty and finally was able to get in. 

Walz had a chance to serve in combat with his men in Iraq and he chose not to. All of his men that he was commanding at the time went and served in combat in Iraq. Yet he has said multiple times that he served in combat carrying a gun of war.

Yes; we already covered that. He DID lie. I don't see an issue w/ him retiring before deployment though. He served 23 years. That is enough and he has that right. 

And  yes; I did serve active duty 3 years followed by additional time in the Army Reserve and Army National Guard. 

Edited August 13 by red viking

[Paul158]

18 minutes ago, Offthemat said:

I haven’t found anything on what Walz’ MOS (military occupational specialty) was.  I know the National Guard is different from the Army, but with his rank being Master Sergeant instead of First Sergeant,, it’s very possible that he wasn’t trained combat arms.  His main career was as a teacher, so it’s unlikely his MOS was mechanic or computer repair or engineer (heavy equipment operator), so maybe a clerk or supply or something.  Funny, he was born at West Point.  West Point, Nebraska. 

He served in the Minnesota National Guard 1st Battalion ,125th Field Artillery.

[red viking]

Oh  yah, Master Sergeant is E-8; not E-9. My bad. And yes, it just means he's not in charge of his own Company. Probably an assistant at the battalion level. 

Edited August 13 by red viking

[Offthemat]

5 minutes ago, Paul158 said:

He served in the Minnesota National Guard 1st Battalion ,125th Field Artillery.

He was in the Nebraska NG before he moved and transferred to Minnesota, but I haven’t seen which unit he was originally in. 

[Paul158]

1 hour ago, Offthemat said:

He was in the Nebraska NG before he moved and transferred to Minnesota, but I haven’t seen which unit he was originally in. 

Yes, I didn't see anything on his time in Nebraska NG. How old was he when he transferred. 

[swoopdown]

Yes I served in active duty USMC.  Maybe because of that, maybe because my father truly was a retired Marine Sgt Major (WWII and Korea vet), maybe because of the opinions circulating such as those of Walz's C.O. (link), I do question Walz's misrepresentation of the truth.  I feel confident that if there is hypocrisy arising from the events that transpired, it's not coming from soldiers of  Walz's unit.

https://x.com/charliekirk11/status/1822728074582184196

Edited August 13 by swoopdown
Link

[Bigbrog]

2 hours ago, red viking said:

He was a journalist. I'm not going to call him a hero by a long shot when I was actually in combat arms. Was he forced to go with his unit or did he go out of his way to be part of the war efforts? Being deployed is part of the job and part of the risk you take. 

Trump got grazed in the ear. Doesn't make him a hero one bit, or somebody I even respects as a human being. In fact, he's a coward for dodging the draft and constantly lying. 

Man...you just can't stop digging, can you??  Who is asking you to call Vance a hero??  Why are you so worried about how he got deployed to a war zone and what his feelings were??  And the best part is once again you compare him to yourself when you never served in a war zone...and believe me, no one at any point on here will be calling you a hero.

Who is calling Trump a hero??  Do you just make crap up in your head??  The guy was almost killed and you continually belittle that fact...again you are pathetic.

I have a question...why did you only do 3 years active duty before going into the reserves??

[red viking]

37 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

Man...you just can't stop digging, can you??  Who is asking you to call Vance a hero??  Why are you so worried about how he got deployed to a war zone and what his feelings were??  And the best part is once again you compare him to yourself when you never served in a war zone...and believe me, no one at any point on here will be calling you a hero.

Who is calling Trump a hero??  Do you just make crap up in your head??  The guy was almost killed and you continually belittle that fact...again you are pathetic.

I have a question...why did you only do 3 years active duty before going into the reserves??

Plenty of people called Trump a hero. Did you listen to the RNC? It was nauseating. Somebody even called him "Braveheart." 

My thoughts on the military: Unless you were actually in a combat situation, it was just a job. Our military actually gets paid pretty well if they aren't in combat. I got the GI Bill and Army College Fund and had more money than I could shake a stick at in grad school. Had plenty of money in the military itself too. Soldiers got huge pay raises after I was done, under Bush. I think it's a pretty cake job if you aren't actually in a combat situation. 

Yes, my active duty was right away. National Guard and Reserves were after my 3 years was up. 

Edited August 13 by red viking

[Bigbrog]

3 minutes ago, red viking said:

Plenty of people called Trump a hero. Did you listen to the RNC? It was nauseating. Somebody even called him "Braveheart." 

My thoughts on the military: Unless you were actually in a combat situation, it was just a job. Our military actually gets paid pretty well if they aren't in combat. I got the GI Bill and Army College Fund and had more money than I could shake a stick at in grad school. Had plenty of money in the military itself too. Soldiers got huge pay raises after I was done, under Bush. I think it's a pretty cake job if you aren't actually in a combat situation. 

Yes, my active duty was right away. National Guard and Reserves were after my 3 years was up. 

Of course his staunches supports are going to call him that, just as Biden's/Harris supporters go over the top with their support for them.

Interesting that you look at it as "just a job"...I guess I look at it as very honorable because of the fact that most who enter do so for their love of the US and their willingness to put their lives on the line to defend it, if needed.  And yes, they pay well...my brother did very well after 27 years in the navy retiring as Senior Chief.  I am extremely honored and proud to call him my brother, just as I am extremely proud of my nephew who is in the EOD program after having to med out of BUD/S.

So, you don't have to serve 4 years anymore, it is only 3?  I did not know that.

[red viking]

13 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

Of course his staunches supports are going to call him that, just as Biden's/Harris supporters go over the top with their support for them.

Interesting that you look at it as "just a job"...I guess I look at it as very honorable because of the fact that most who enter do so for their love of the US and their willingness to put their lives on the line to defend it, if needed.  And yes, they pay well...my brother did very well after 27 years in the navy retiring as Senior Chief.  I am extremely honored and proud to call him my brother, just as I am extremely proud of my nephew who is in the EOD program after having to med out of BUD/S.

So, you don't have to serve 4 years anymore, it is only 3?  I did not know that.

It depends upon your contract. I was late 90s and at that time most contracts were 3. If you agree to 4, you'll probably get a bigger bonus or some other perk. Maybe 4 is the norm now; not sure. 

Most people don't sign up for "love of country." They do it for the money and other benefits. Some of those may involve the travel, experience or maybe the glamour the extra respect that they get from people like you. There are also plenty that do it because they can't hold down a civilian job. I did it because it sounded like a great experience and if I didn't decide to stay for life, the money that I would get for grad school was ridiculous. 

For my Advanced Individual Training (AIT) class, literally about 1/3 of them ended up in prison for various reasons. That was my experience with the my military colleagues in enlisted combat arms. I also had to always make sure my stuff was locked up because if I even blinked for too long it was gone. I had a friend that even got his underwear stolen. Also, everybody seemed to have a crazy story from before they joined. I knew most of them were B.S., and this was evidence that many of these guys were insecure. I swear half of them played D1 football or had some other claim to fame. One guy claimed he fought to the death in several underground sword fighting tournaments in Japan. Meanwhile, he had trouble passing his PT test. 

Most of these guys weren't the cream of the crop by any means, but some were. I'm sure it's different in special forces and officer ranks but it runs the gambit and that's why I don't consider it to be significantly different from other jobs in terms of the quality of character of these people, overall. 

 

Edited August 13 by red viking

[Bigbrog]

6 minutes ago, red viking said:

It depends upon your contract. I was late 90s and at that time most contracts were 3. If you agree to 4, you'll probably get a bigger bonus or some other perk. Maybe 4 is the norm now; not sure. 

Most people don't sign up for "love of country." They do it for the money and other benefits. Some of those may involve the travel, experience or maybe the glamour the extra respect that they get from people like you. There are also plenty that do it because they can't hold down a civilian job. I did it because it sounded like a great experience and if I didn't decide to stay for life, the money that I would get for grad school was ridiculous. 

For my Advanced Individual Training (AIT) class, literally about 1/3 of them ended up in prison for various reasons. That was my experience with the my military colleagues in enlisted combat arms. I also had to always make sure my stuff was locked up because if I even blinked for too long it was gone. I had a friend that even got his underwear stolen. Also, everybody seemed to have a crazy story from before they joined. I knew most of them were B.S., and this was evidence that many of these guys were insecure. I swear half of them played D1 football or had some other claim to fame. One guy claimed he fought to the death in several underground sword fighting tournaments in Japan. Meanwhile, he had trouble passing his PT test. 

Most of these guys weren't the cream of the crop by any means, but some were. I'm sure it's different in special forces and officer ranks but it runs the gambit and that's why I don't consider it to be significantly different from other jobs in terms of the quality of character of these people, overall. 

 

Fair enough...you have your experience in the military and thus your opinion of it and I can respect that.  All I really have is my brother, his military buddies, and my nephew...all stand up guys and their experiences were not similar to yours at all.

[red viking]

4 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

Fair enough...you have your experience in the military and thus your opinion of it and I can respect that.  All I really have is my brother, his military buddies, and my nephew...all stand up guys and their experiences were not similar to yours at all.

I will say this point that supports yours. Most of the bad guys get weeded out shortly after they enter permanent party. They get their hands held through basic training and then once they get their freedom they get into trouble and don't last the full term. Most of the guys that eventually get to the rank of Sergeant or higher (like myself) have plenty of integrity and are trustworthy. 

[Bigbrog]

2 minutes ago, red viking said:

I will say this point that supports yours. Most of the bad guys get weeded out shortly after they enter permanent party. They get their hands held through basic training and then once they get their freedom they get into trouble and don't last the full term. Most of the guys that eventually get to the rank of Sergeant or higher (like myself) have plenty of integrity and are trustworthy. 

Can't help myself...you = integrity and trustworthy??       Teasing

[jross]

4 hours ago, red viking said:

Sure; the right will complain a little but there's a double standard. For Walz, they go back to 2018 to find something he lied about. 

Trump was almost assassinated but didn't get any significant damage so he's not a "Braveheart" like the fringe right likes to call him. 

Vance served 4 years as a journalist. What a joke. 

Fact Check: They go back to 2018...  Finding: True.  It is also true that Walz has been criticized by his NG peers for stolen valor since at least 2006.

[Offthemat]

3 minutes ago, Bigbrog said:

Can't help myself...you = integrity and trustworthy??       Teasing

No, you’re on target.  Any peace-time warrior who denigrates a Marine combat correspondent (they carry rifles) who served in combat deserves doubt.  They also make the kind of NCOs that discourage the retention of the good guys.  He is correct in that the personnel run the gamut of morality, though in my experience there were only a few bad ones.  
The Army being so large, they variably offer lower commitment enlistments and higher bonuses.  I was told all enlistments are for six years, but can consist of two years active, two years active reserve, and two years inactive reserve, or; three years active and three years inactive reserve, or; four years active and two years inactive reserve. 

[Ohio Elite]

12 minutes ago, jross said:

Fact Check: They go back to 2018...  Finding: True.  It is also true that Walz has been criticized by his NG peers for stolen valor since at least 2006.

No no no...

He misspoke...

 

[Offthemat]

7 minutes ago, Ohio Elite said:

No no no...

He misspoke...

 

So Walz is calling the National Guard “19 year olds that are cooks.”  While the dimocrat ticket is puerile kooks. 

[red viking]

29 minutes ago, Offthemat said:

No, you’re on target.  Any peace-time warrior who denigrates a Marine combat correspondent (they carry rifles) who served in combat deserves doubt.  They also make the kind of NCOs that discourage the retention of the good guys.  He is correct in that the personnel run the gamut of morality, though in my experience there were only a few bad ones.  
The Army being so large, they variably offer lower commitment enlistments and higher bonuses.  I was told all enlistments are for six years, but can consist of two years active, two years active reserve, and two years inactive reserve, or; three years active and three years inactive reserve, or; four years active and two years inactive reserve. 

He didn't see any combat whatsoever. He was merely deployed to Iraq where other people saw the actual combat. 

I'll reserve my special recognition to people that actually see combat. I don't see my time in S. Korea (north of Seoul where we had alarms randomly go off in the middle of the night) as anything that special either. 

Vance isn't a piece of garbage because he served his country. He's a piece of garbage simply because of the other things he's done and said. I have almost zero respect for him. That's more than the amount of respect I have for Trump though. 

Edited August 13 by red viking

[Offthemat]

Yeah, I was at Camp Greaves and GP Ouellette, and Vance saw a lot more than I did.  Vance didn’t get any special favor or cronyism, he had to have scored very highly on the aptitude test to qualify for the MOS.  

[WrestlingRash]

6 hours ago, red viking said:

Yah. How about your service record?

I served 3 years active duty artillery (Multiple Launch Rocket System); followed by 3 years National Guard and Army Reserve as a medic. Requested transfer to IRR in August 2001. 

did you go around lying about your service record to gullible voters in order to get elected? you'd think someone who actually served wouldn't be down with obvious stolen valor. amazing mental gymnastics you've got there. 

[WrestlingRash]

56 minutes ago, red viking said:

He didn't see any combat whatsoever. He was merely deployed to Iraq where other people saw the actual combat. 

I'll reserve my special recognition to people that actually see combat. I don't see my time in S. Korea (north of Seoul where we had alarms randomly go off in the middle of the night) as anything that special either. 

Vance isn't a piece of garbage because he served his country. He's a piece of garbage simply because of the other things he's done and said. I have almost zero respect for him. That's more than the amount of respect I have for Trump though. 

you sound like a cat lady. do better. 

[Scouts Honor]

8 hours ago, red viking said:

 

Trump was almost assassinated but didn't get any significant damage so he's not a "Braveheart" like the fringe right likes to call him. 

 

continuing to go out after a bullet is one inch the lucky way

sounds pretty brave

[jross]

12 hours ago, red viking said:

Granted, Walz made a mistake by saying he was in a war. This was a lie. It was 6 years ago. Meanwhile, Trump makes several lies every single time he makes a speech. Nobody complains about that. And he and Vance never served their countries at all. In fact, Trump purposely evaded any type of military service during the Vietnam War. 

Thank you Governor Walz for your 23 years of military service. Definitely more brave than being grazed by a bullet in the ear. 

Yes, there’s clear right-wing hypocrisy. Trump often lies, and while he faces criticism for it, many people (this forum, right wingers, etc.) question his character. His draft dodging is also a valid criticism, but he didn’t run on his military record, so it’s a separate issue.

Walz made a commitment to serve, knowing he might face combat. Retiring when faced with that possibility and the exaggerations about his service for political gain complicate things. His criticism is about both his decision to leave and the misleading claims about his service.

While Trump’s draft dodging is a separate known issue, Walz’s situation involves new public awareness to his retirement controversy and his misleading military experience statements. Each deserves its own attention, but understanding both helps explain why Walz is facing current criticism.

[scourge165]

14 hours ago, Bigbrog said:

So many things wrong here...you seriously think no one complains when Trump lies??  What world are you living in?  Probably the same world where you think Vance never served...he was in the Marines...and served in a war zone!!  And the doozy is belittling the fact that Trump was almost assassinated...you know...KILLED!!  Does your partisan run so deep you are okay with someone almost getting killed just because the person has ideologically different opinions??  Dude you are sick!

I like presidents who weren't nearly assassinated.

LOL...seriously, save the moral outrage for the guy who called those who did serve "losers and suckers," while asking, "what's in it for them."

That tells you everything you need to know about Trump. He looks at the service and says, "what's it in for them." If it's nothing, he's out. He's only looking to serve if there's something in it for him...

 

But hey, don't worry. If Trump wins, you won't have to worry about voting in '28. "You won't have to ever vote again."