Hodge Watch

[Ponzi]

14 minutes ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

He won't win if he has a loss.  Hodge is supposed to be the most dominant wrestler, primarily.  An undefeated Spencer 4-timer plus multiple undefeated 3-timers and 2-timers (RBY, Starocci, O'Toole) would trump someone who has losses this year, even if they are a 4-timer.

As I said, an undefeated Lee is a lock. A one-loss, NCAA champ Lee may share w/ Yianni. But Yianni will beat undefeated guys and win if Lee does not win the NCAAs. There is no rule that says the Hodge winner must be undefeated.

[Jimmy Cinnabon]

3 minutes ago, Ponzi said:

As I said, an undefeated Lee is a lock. A one-loss, NCAA champ Lee may share w/ Yianni. But Yianni will beat undefeated guys and win if Lee does not win the NCAAs. There is no rule that says the Hodge winner must be undefeated.

Why is it a lock that a 4x champ, 1 loss Yianni beats an undefeated 3x champ, 0 loss RBY or Starocci (if that happens)?  What if those 3x champs bonus their way through the tournament?  Yianni's bonus percentage isn't that impressive compared to other top Hodge contenders this year.

Overall career accomplishments is lower on the criteria than dominance in the current season.  There is no rule that says the Hodge winner must win the most overall career NCAA titles.

[Ponzi]

I never said it was a lock or a rule. I said that that is how it should and likely will go down. Also, every 4X champ has won the Hodge, except for Smith, who pre-dated the award. Of course, they were also undefeated.

[Bigbrog]

Yianna is a great wrestler and will go down as one of the best in college wrestling, but he will not win the Hodge...nor should he.  Weird that people are arguing for him to win it because he may...and that is a big MAY...win 4 titles, but man, he lost this year...period.  It's okay...probably won't hurt is legacy in the end (unless Gomez gets him again).

[Jimmy Cinnabon]

23 minutes ago, Ponzi said:

I never said it was a lock or a rule. I said that that is how it should and likely will go down. Also, every 4X champ has won the Hodge, except for Smith, who pre-dated the award. Of course, they were also undefeated.

However this is the only year where there could be multiple 4x champs.  Cael, Dake and Stieber all won Hodges when they were the only 4x champ that year.

[Ponzi]

8 hours ago, Jimmy Cinnabon said:

However this is the only year where there could be multiple 4x champs.  Cael, Dake and Stieber all won Hodges when they were the only 4x champ that year.

Is that really true? Who are they?

[Matthew Burns]

Yanni wrestles to many tight matches in the the tournament to pull the Hodge. His defense first scramble centric style doesn't scream bonus points.

 

His finals matchups with McKenna and Meredith were narrow wins. In both cases it can be argued he benefits from a refs call. 

 

Sanderson won Hodges based on a stupid bonus rate. 3 of his 4 finals were by bonus points. Dake closed out his undefeated senior year by beating the reigning Hodge holder a second time.

 

Hodge trophies need to be won with exclamation points. This season Yanni D has a question mark.

[Ponzi]

On 2/7/2023 at 11:37 AM, Wrestleknownothing said:

It is on their stats page. They call it Match Power.

https://www.wrestlestat.com/rankings/statistical

 

Wrong. The NCAA just announced the standing for its "most dominant wrestler" award. https://www.ncaa.com/news/wrestling/article/2023-02-08/ncaa-debuts-most-dominant-wrestler-standings-latest-award-update-2023-season

Lee is not listed, I guess b/c the NCAA has a 15-match minimum.

 

[Wrestleknownothing]

I took a look at the Hodge history as I was thinking about Yianni Diakomihalis' chances of winning the award.

Reading between the lines, it looks like there was a shift in the way the award is selected starting in 2012. From 1995 to around 2011 it looks like the award was selected by WIN staff and a panel of experts. During this time there was discussion of debates and how decisions were made. In 2012 it looks like there was a shift to balloting. And in 2013 fan voting was added to the process. Fact check me here historians.

Based on that I think the 2012 - 2022 history is more instructive than the 1995 - 2011 history. During this period (11 years) there were 61 finalists. Only 9 finalists had 1 lose.  But voters tend to frown on 1 lose finalists as none of the 1 lose finalist got more than 4 first place votes. This is in spite of the fact that the 1 lose finalists had an average bonus rate of 73%. On the other hand, none of the 1 lose finalists won 4 championships.

So if Diakomihalis finishes with 1 lose he will need Lee to also finish with 1 lose AND for voters to break with precedence both with respect to loses and bonus rate. It could happen, but I am guessing it would be a very close vote.

Edited February 9, 2023 by Wrestleknownothing

[headshuck]

The old great Hodge just ain’t what it used to be, many long years ago.

[ionel]

9 minutes ago, headshuck said:

The old great Hodge just ain’t what it used to be, many long years ago.

There's posters on this hear board that ain't what they used to be. 

[headshuck]

There's posters on this hear board that ain't what they used to be. 

Ouch

[ionel]

1 minute ago, headshuck said:

Ouch

yes indeed, I feel the pain too

[flyingcement]

The old Grey mare she...

[GreatWhiteNorth]

59 minutes ago, headshuck said:

The old great Hodge just ain’t what it used to be, many long years ago.

It is basically the same as it always has been. It really is.

[headshuck]

No, no it isn’t. Ben Askren and Jayson Ness lit the forums on fire pinning as many opponents as possible in their race for the award.

[GreatWhiteNorth]

11 minutes ago, headshuck said:

No, no it isn’t. Ben Askren and Jayson Ness lit the forums on fire pinning as many opponents as possible in their race for the award.

Let's be honest. Ness barely won the title... about as close as it gets. A second or so and it goes the other way and he doesn't win the Hodge.

Really great job by Jayson that year. Throw selective memory aside. This year, it'll be a dogfight as it has always been.

 

[headshuck]

17 pins to 9.

[headshuck]

And National Duals isn’t the same as it used to be either.

[GreatWhiteNorth]

4 minutes ago, headshuck said:

17 pins to 9.

I didn't look it up, but likely true.

[GreatWhiteNorth]

3 minutes ago, headshuck said:

And National Duals isn’t the same as it used to be either.

True.

[headshuck]

https://www.ncaa.com/news/wrestling/article/2022-04-02/dan-hodge-trophy-history-winners-and-how-it-works?amp

“How wrestlers are selected for the award.

Originally created to celebrate the pin in college wrestling…”

[Wrestleknownothing]

5 minutes ago, headshuck said:

https://www.ncaa.com/news/wrestling/article/2022-04-02/dan-hodge-trophy-history-winners-and-how-it-works?amp

“How wrestlers are selected for the award.

Originally created to celebrate the pin in college wrestling…”

Emphasis on originally

[GreatWhiteNorth]

2 minutes ago, headshuck said:

https://www.ncaa.com/news/wrestling/article/2022-04-02/dan-hodge-trophy-history-winners-and-how-it-works?amp

“How wrestlers are selected for the award.

Originally created to celebrate the pin in college wrestling…”

Yes, yes, most of us here have been over this in countless arguments for many years. Undefeated is a key piece of the award, as is pinning.

I know you've been around for all these continual arguments. What's your point here? You seem to have an axe to grind. 

[headshuck]

Emphasis on originally

And now you see why I posted my comment 2 pages above.