wrestle87

In wrestling we are particularly given to holding up certain figures in borderline religious, certainly cult-like ways. The wrestling community doesn’t know what to do if it doesn’t have somebody to bow to as the next “gable”. This (apparently, I’m just hearing about most of this stuff this week) leads to narrow, myopic, and uncritical or highly unobjective lenses being applied to lots of situations. Sex-related and abuse-related topics all bursting forth at once smacks very much of a broader issue of a lack of accountability or standards maintenance as a community.

This is the most tired and trite of simultaneously defeatest and enabling comments you can make. It’s a wrestling specific issue in that this is a wrestling forum and we are talking about wrestling, and we care about the continued health and safety of the sport, and all athletes therein. The excessively physical nature of the sport needn’t be expounded upon, but respecting and protecting the physical wellbeing of your opponents is a fundamental tenet of the sport in a way that is extremely rare in sport. I’m pretty sure that is self-evident though.

They’re all *I poop my pants, don't laugh at me*ty, sex-based or sex-adjacent issues of power dynamics, all of which got covered up, swept under the rug, or otherwise ignored or minimized by other responsible adults, oftentimes for years even decades. The issue is that many of the people who were committing these acts, hiding these messes, or sidestepping responsibility for being a responsible adult are people who have been lionized as a considerable part of modern wrestling lore. That is all the same issue, and it is not a small one. The fact that in the span of a month Snyder’s situation went from “oh nooo bad bad bad” to “[shoulder shrug] eh, not much to write home about all things considered” is the big whiplash aspect of this.

100% this. We have seen how forward and opinionated all wrestling “journalists” are willing to be at times, and how they will, under certain circumstances, absolute hold underperforming teams and individuals accountable. Silence here on both this and Snyder is just so striking and out of character. There aren’t really any charitable options left for how we can look at previous (rightfully) aggressive, opinionated pieces, and then hear nothing but crickets here. All that remains is the “hmmm…did you guys get scared or bought off, or both?” This is a fat juicy journalistic t-bone steak and nobody in the wrestling community wants to report on it. Quite the disappointing head scratcher.

All due respect, you shouldn’t lump yourself in with these other folks Mr Saylor. Your forum is a last bastion of free and open discussion in an increasingly paywalled universe. Slow-pedaling certain news about high impact, high click-generating programs is what people are talking about. It’s the Brady Belichik T-swift Mahomes parade, but with wrestling shoes. Honest reporting on important issues gets dismissed or under-reported, because nobody is willing to risk being locked out of Ohio State or Penn State for a decade. But that’s no longer journalism. Why did it take a non-wrestling journalist break the Ohio State hellickson-era story? Because that journalist needed to be outside the sport to be impartial and unaffected by the potential backlash from programs and coaches. If this Starrocci news was breaking at oregon state or little rock or Chattanooga, it would be completely dissected and completely out in the open, no holds barred. But with state college in particular, people treat that room the way they treat the vatican. And that’s not good. The inherent societal value of journalism is asking the unseemly questions at the inappropriate times. It is the magnifying glass society simultaneously offers and levels at all individuals. Asymmetric application is where the disapproval comes from.

Why do people constantly create threads about topics, so they can be discussed, but not follow through on the "rumors" when people ask to know why this might be the case? You're curious enough to ask and/or participate, but not curious enough to put the information out on the wire that you heard from a dude who heard from another dude who heard from his friend at the deli. We all know lots of it tends to be played up or exaggerated, so if you make the thread and you have the info, at least be decent enough to provide the full context, instead of just leaving an "Ooooh, look, did you hear thing about person in place? Bc I heard person from other place said different thing about same person, and with a slightly different context..."

I have heard tell they are standard techniques in water polo. Apparently everybody leaves the pool with hands that smell of chlorine and 10W30

Ah yes, the Daton Fix defense. How is it that all these athletes who go to GNC just that one time always get the bad supplement, but people who have been going there for decades are never so lucky to find free steroids in a bottle of vitamin C? This world is so strange, all those jacked top level athletes getting tripped by not reading the label. Most people would intentionally seek out tainted supplements if they knew there was a free androgenic boost in them.

Lol I don’t Jesus hard enough to be allowed to be the bearer of the syringe of the holy Trenity.

Oooh, yeah definitely not me. Drugs are a tool with specific applied benefits, but also major long term downside risks. Saying all people should take drugs is like saying all people should be allowed to run around holding running chainsaws in my opinion.

The "one"? You think there's just one person on this board who feels that way? But no, I'm not one of those people. Steroids are compounds which are far too powerful to just flip that switch wholesale. Young kids get themselves into way too much trouble at an early age even in the face of societal pressure against drug use. I am the one, however, who thinks that better access to dispassionate discussion of what these compounds do would be a good thing.

I’m amazed by how many posters 1) think that olympic athletes don’t use exogenous supplementation as part of training 2) think that there are actually morals to be upheld at the highest level regarding PED use. ”This athlete cheated, he was breathing air during the competition.” Olympics is about revenue, and protecting same. Anything else is just a big cup of Jim Jones favorite Kool-Aid.

Most teams have a dude named stanky fingers. It's pretty gross, I never had it happen over 13 years. But every year in the ncaa finals at least one high crotch is defended with the ol' coin purse yank.

This sucks. Youtube just recommended a Sanderson highlight video, and I reflexively swiped away from it out of disgust. I think the impact has already been had, we’re just waiting to for the knock-on effects. That is the room that is or has been home to the best wrestlers and the majority of medals the US has earned over the past 20 years. Also…safesport…wtf? Where were you when it mattered?

Honestly, they deserve to be cooked. I have been a huge supporter for a long time, but this is the epitome of "all your eggs in one basket" as a sport. If this goes south, this will be a problem that takes the better part of the next decade to come back from. People talk about the OSU sanctions back in the 80's and early 90's being bad, this will be worse. And frankly, it should be. Wrestling historically has a problem of not holding highest performers to the standards of human decency. In the past people have often sited Sanderson has having a "dry" sense of humor. In retrospect, it is really starting to just sound like another instance of athletic sociopathy, where the only thing that matters is winning, and apparently truly winning at all costs. Gable had standards, Smith appeared to at least require some human decency from his athletes. This issue with this is it casts a pall on the entire program, and everyone in the entire room for the entire time that someone like this was around. And frankly, it should. Bartlett is brave for doing what he did, and saying what he did. That takes incredible conviction and courage as a young man, but it is also a massive indictment of the powers that be in the institution that empowered negative actors for such a long time. With how tightly the coaches have that program under lock and key, there's not a chance in hell that the coaches didn't know about this. Ben Askren, come back healthy please, we need you now more than ever.

In many schools there is a lot of stigma around being the dumb kids who are only there because they got in the easy way, and the athlete's only lifeline to legitimacy on campus is through their sporting endeavors. "In exchange for being a good part of our team, we give you this education in exchange" sort of a thing. Obviously it's not universal, but it is very common.

If you are a kid on a scholarship, the first one from your family to go to a college, and you are entirely unfamiliar with big college environments, you may have nothing to fall back on, and causing a stink with a university professional is a great way to get kicked out, especially since most college athletes felt like they were typically persona non-grata away from their sporting environment anyway. This dude put student athletes in a position to choose their dignity or their future, career etc. Horrifyingly calculated behavior.

Dude… Firstly, student athletes can be minors. Second, the power and influence dynamic dictates the entire situation. Also, f*cking really?

Also the very best place for him to go if he wants to get into MMA.

Someone please put him in touch with Chance Marsteller.

Anybody know anything about super secret updates on how Askren’s doing?

Nickerson got hired as the head coach at Army

“He abuuuuuused-ah! The power of the looooord-ah! And the power of the looooord did free their souls oh yes it diiiid-ah! But not…from the evils of this tiny message board-ah!”

That’s not what democrats want…

Lol, or AJ put in a transfer application without talking to Kohl, and Kohl went to the AD and said “no, reject him please.” Kohl doesn’t strike me as a Ferrari bandwagon type of guy. Sure he’s understands the business of coaching and has had a trip on the carousel recently, but nothing about him has ever made me believe he’d permit that sort of individual to be on his team.