scourge165

You said you wouldn't be shocked if he lost to Kerk or Bastida. You basically guaranteed Stevenson would lose! I totally agree. Moreso with Kerk than Bastida, but if Kerk is going to Wrestle this season with the focus and intention to beat Stevenson...I absolutely think he's capable of doing it. I don't think anyone else is, but people are sleeping on how big, long, athletic Kerk is. To me, I'd be more confident if Kerk didn't look half checked out most of the time and he's won a NC doing that. I also wouldn't be "shocked" if Keck beats Starocci at the NCAAs, if Haines beats O'Toole(that one I actually do expect) or almost any other result. The only thing I'd BET on would be a healthy Mesenbrink wins it.

Sure...they can. They can't say they beat an NCAA Champ though! I guess I'd assume we're talking about College Wrestling...not a guys first year in the sport. This really felt like a throwaway line more than anything. And in HIS case(Starocci) he likely was talking about Nolf and Dieringer as well, but...I don't know...I'll count Mesenbrink as a NC that Carr beat. I'll count Haines as a NC that O'Connor beat. I don't count the guy who I wrestled as a School Boy who went on to be a 3X NC. So, again, make your own criteria! This definitely isn't a hill I care enough to die on! LOL...the answer, however, may be Marcus Blaze in the future. Not so distant future. Especially if you're counting Freestyle.

It's not like this is being used for seeding. It's just a stupid list. But like anything, you can argue the veracity of each one. If you beat a guy the year he wins it...I think you can count that. It's kinda a meaningless award. So Starocci doesn't have the most NCAA Champs beaten. He's got 4 of them himself! That's the determining factor.

Says who? You're arbitrary ruling? He beat him the year he won an NCAA Championship. In other words, he beat an NCAA Champ.

Carlton Hasselrig

And Washington was 10-7 the year prior and never made the blood round! There is a little asterisk to my "undefeated" prediction. A-I think it's...unlikely. I mean, 4 NCs is also unlikely, even for guys who win it as Freshmen, but B-I did say the NEXT 4 years. The 4 years he's the full-time starter and competing.

Nah...I stand by it...as an '84 pounder. He's giving up too much size and length at '97. Plus...it's not like Smith is some no namer. He was in the Rd of 12 last year. At '84 though, I think he's got a chance to do great things and dominate the weight the next 4 years. I'm not pausing it because of an early November Match as a True Freshman. Cael lost to Paul Jenn his freshman year and I think we'll look back similarly on this.

You're a clown.

I know you didn't bring up his Freestyle, someone else did...which I thought was a weak argument...for the reasons I stated. 2 of the 3 best in the world were at his weight(IMO) and he was hurt. I'm just looking at one guy who's won 4 titles in 4 years and another guy who hasn't wrestled in a few 3 years and I don't know if he's all in, if he's back because he exhausted his other options at this point, but do I think he's going to lose? No, probably not. I don't think it's quite the lock others do. I think Kerkvliet could beat him. I think a lot depends on HIS approach to this season as he tends to look like Wrestling is a hassle for him rather than an opportunity, BUT...his size, length, and athletic ability? Yeah, I think he CAN beat him. I'm really not that invested in the P4P, but... let's let Gable come back and Wrestle before we push him over the guy who's going for his 5th title. That's my take...

I think you could certainly make the argument that the #1 P4P Wrestler heading into this season is Starocci. The dude HAS won 4 titles already... Pointing out he "couldn't even make the Mens FS team," is...not really the most compelling argument in my mind. He had a pretty significant knee injury and gave up his cut down to ~163 about halfway through to Wrestle 189 and his teammate, probably the best Wrestler in the world at 86KG Wrestled another former PSU guy who had won an Olympic and 3 WC and a Silver. But...people can agree to disagree(or perhaps not!)....

Well...now that you covered the entirety of my point and we've discussed the only two injuries in the sport, I guess this is done, right?

Yeah...I also see how EVERY manner of injury could be faked if you're going to have Doctors who are in on it. I don't think there are a whole lot of Doctors out there who are "in on it," and what's more, I don't really care. If you're asking for a Medical for Concussions, I'd rather they just grant it than deny it because of the slippery slope theory...

One year of D1 strength and conditioning and I think he's got a shot to be...the 2nd best '84 pounder ever. He's not going to one up Brooks coach...but I think he could POSSIBLY end up a better Wrestler than Brooks. I know how wild that sounds now. I'll check back in a year. Definitely the best prep Wrestler from Wisconsin I've seen. I got to see Swick as a little kid and he was pretty damn impressive...beat Cael as a Sr in HS, but in the last ~15-20 years, he's that dude...IMO.

Sinclair from Mizzou. Assuming he Wrestle's '84 and not '97 and he takes a RS(PK and Star is...asking a bit much) I think he could definitely win it next year. He's so smooth, so slick and I doubt he walks around at 200. Maybe 195, so the cut to '84 would probably be plenty easy(he may even test for '65). But again, to repeat what I said in the Wrestle-off thread, he just looked like he was giving up way too much length at '97. q Give the kid a year with O'Toole and the rest of that team and put him at '74 or '84(seems like '84 is...almost a given based on the last couple years) and I'd put money on him right now...for next year.

I'd like to hear what the plan is for Sinclair. I know the kid wrestled 92KG and he was competitive with Aiello and nearly in the finals, but that match epitomized why...in my opinion from afar, he's not suited to Wrestle '97 and he's so perfect for '84. The length and size was just a huge difference. I understand cutting sucks and it's almost always better to go up, add good weight, but some frames are just...better at certain weights. If he takes a RS, goes '84, I think he's the next guy who could be a 4X NC(Lillendahl could I suppose). And honestly...maybe not even lose a match those 4 years. He's so damn slick, but '97 is a tall order.

No...it really wouldn't be like "free redshirts for all." It's pretty simple. Dr says you're suffering from concussions. You come back and you're "recovered" because you're not showing any signs of post-concussion syndrome. People realize this isn't theoretical, right? This HAS actually happened before? He also Wrestled as a True Freshmen, so the issue isn't the NCAA, it's Cornell and the Ivy and their rules. This isn't 19th-century Archaeology in which they tried to declare the intellect of a person based on the shape of their skulls. Dr's can test for concussions and in Shapiro's case in particular, having had a history(as well as those silly Dr's for some reason prioritizing the health of the brain) I'm thinking they'd have a baseline and be inclined to grant one...if that was the issue.

This is literally why I replied to Chrome on this dude. I'm not getting stuck in one of these never-ending circular loops. You jumped in and replied to me after I replied to someone else to tell me specifically how "nobody is trashing him." A claim I HADN'T made. Then I specifically said, "after you mentioned it, yeah, actually...it kinda felt like YOU were." That's not me "implying," you were, it's me saying it felt like YOU(you-all caps for emphasis) were.

I...don't know that I can. It felt pretty straight forward. 1-Nobody is trashing him. I didn't SAY anyone was, but, after you mentioned it, yeah, actually...it kinda felt like YOU were(and I made a point of responding to Chrome specifically). Bringing me to my 2nd point; 2-You mentioned how many frivolous posts there were on this thread, right? Who's posted the most on this thread? You're working REALLY hard to share how little you care about him coming back. You "legit" can't figure out if I agree with your position about him returning to College? Seriously? I will clarify this position further. I do not agree with you. I think it's a big deal, I think it's pretty cool...and I don't see anything wrong with a 24-year-0ld coming back to try and win a 3rd title, I think it'll make the season better.

Yeah...I didn't say anyone was trashing him...though, you really kinda have been while talking about a number of frivolous posts(which given how many times you posted was amusing)...but I was just responding to Chrome there.

Kerkvliet is going to be 23 before the NCAAs and Stevenston will be 24 throughout the tournament. He's already won an Olympic Gold... How about Kerk goes out and beats his ass? The dude is built like a TANK, he's longer, bigger, probably stronger than Stevenson. Why not? Other than the fact that Kerk looks like he's bothered or annoyed to have to Wrestle most of the time, there's no reason he can't give him a match. You want to talk about legacies, this is a chance for Kerk to cement a Snyder like Collegiate legacy. For him to knock off Stevenson and win a 2nd title, that'd be a helluva story.

Yeah...but he's 24 and College Wrestling is the highest level of Wrestling you can achieve in this sport. Cael was 23 when he graduated...so, I think it's a little skewed by how big of a personality he has and the success he's had. Otherwise, this is pretty reasonable. I don't think it's sad. One more year in College? I'd take it!

Yeah, if you made a mistake, just...apologize from it and own it. Don't say, 'well we made a mistake, but the people calling us out on our mistake just hate us and that's the only reason they're saying anything.' That other guy did seem a bit...angry reading some comments and I'm curious what's there. But you made a mistake. Own it, move on.

Sure, it'd be worth it and I don't think they would grant him a medical...which is why I'm asking if he can still drop his classes, then you don't need any exceptions or anything. But I don't know where they are, when the deadlines would be. November 13th feels pretty late(and it's just my own hypothetical). Your head or back/neck. I'm not trying to deal with injuries to either.

LOL...yeah, it really is! Trying to juggle which NC/NC contender you're going to redshirt so Duke and Sealey can wrestle without cutting their balls off? Take either guy, throw them on any other team and that's who their whole fan base is talking about. At PSU it's just...two guys. That's why Bassett and Forrest should go elsewhere...but if I'm being honest, there's also something about seeing just how stacked a team can get that makes me want them to go to PSU a little bit.

I don't know if he's right or not....I mean, I assume he's not because I tend to give athletes at that level the benefit of the doubt...but the real flaw there is in his asinine logic. Walking around and talking to people fine after the match is NOT indicative of having or NOT having had a concussion. Acting like it's a sprained ankle is foolish. I will say, I wonder if it'd benefit this kid to take a year off. A full year just not Wrestling, hitting his head. Just lifting, running, healing. I'm not aware how it works at Cornell. If he withdrew from classes, would he still have 3 years left?