LJB

did not say it was a chump bracket... said gilman and fix were not in it... those would be our world and olympic reps at that weight for how many years? they didn't show up to that tourney because it meant nothing... lee had to show up to qualify for trials... seriously people... just the tiniest little bit of nuance...

i have a college degree... never wrestled a day in my life...

it is 100% not the only viable path... it is just the most common and the one that is expected by those that want to use our athletes to prop up a scummy organization... doing something for the sole reason that it has always been done like that is such small minded thinking... cejudo pico all proved there are different paths... my youngest quit folk after his freshmen year because it is awful... he was a state finalist at his walk around as a freshmen... he is now a national champ and an age level world team member... getting ready to move into the OTC so he has the best chance to actually win medals... there are options out there you just have to be willing to go against the grain at times...

i will do you one further... he should have never bothered with his senior High School year... he should have been focused on nothing but world and olympic medals from the moment he truly believed he could do it... there are plenty of wrestlers that can fit into a black adult extra small singlet...

spencer lee is already 24 years old... with two bad wheels... wasting time... and at the weight most dependent on quickness... half a step at 57 is not even making the team... i sincerely hope he makes a team and wins a gold medal... as many as can... it would legitimately make me happy... but... 100% vs 100%... i still pick gilman and that was 2 years ago... that gap has just widening as we speak because gilman is actually getting better and spencer still gets tired... again... if i am wrong it will not make me unhappy one tiny little bit... what most see as lee or iowa hate (such an average take) is more disgust with how this country wants their wrestlers to be worse internationally than better... and for what?

100% honest... i just do not get too worked up about doping... the supplements i buy every month is out of reach for 99% of the world... not just financially, but, just that level of nutrition... how much different is that from any of the numerous things athletes have popped for... like ibuprofen...

that is only because this country is too jingoistic... if our best athletes spent those years actually learning how to wrestle instead of beating themselves up... destroying their bodies... learning how to run to the edge for safety, back straight out of bounds, and lay on someone to earn 3-2 victory by a ride time... do you think they would be better prepared for long term international success? look at the average age of world medalists... it isn't 33... it is much closer to 23... when our best are wasting away trying to perfect a cross body ride... just because that is the common path does not mean it is the best path... anyone who chooses to do something different faces ridicule from the entire country... it is just super small minded thinking...

not really... does not make it less scummy... again... i praise odin daily that US athletes do not have to worry about being held responsible for their governments actions...

ugh... just for the record for those painfully average posters and their painfully average takes... i like iowa... i like the brands... i like spencer lee... i like tough wrestling... i am a greco guy, so, poo style tough wrestling is a bit of snickering point for me, but, whatever... one of my kids wrestled for a cadet bronze at cadet worlds in 2021... he was 15... he lost... he was bummed... so was i... but it was cadets... it legitimately does not matter... there is no statistical correlation between cadet success and senior success... that is a fact... i was way more bummed when my other kid got the paws put on him at junior worlds last year... so was he because that is when it starts to actually show that you are on the right path... again, spencer lee's junior gold came at 50kg... that is a child... there is no statistical correlation between 50kg juniors and senior success... i believe when this was a topic at the time it actually happened we found one 50kg in the history of ever that actually won a senior medal... it could have been two... whatever senior nationals is a step... that is it... and if your main domestic challenges do not even bother to show up, then , it is just a big piece of wood at the end of it... for most the reality of being good enough at anything to say "national champ" is something so far out of reach it does seem like a much bigger deal... there are levels to this shit...

i get you consider anything even less than absolute compliments to mean someone thinks your fav is bum... i also get you think senior nationals is a big deal... when my 19 year old made the senior national finals last year i was pretty pumped... but... 2019 senior nationals with no fix or gilman... not sure i would be waving that banner with as much fervor...

private citizen??? autonomy??? sorry, brother... private citizens can not be trusted to handle their own business... if that starts happening they might start thinking for themselves... nope... we can not allow that to even be whispered about in dimly lit corners...

would it be too much to ask for a more original internet insult?

Stick around… I will say way “dumber” things than that… particularly when it all was factually correct… lee was 100lbs when he was 10… then a myth got built while he physically dominated kids just passing through his weight… He is not a technical wrestler… he is a brute and impressive in that regard… there is no correlation between international cadet success and international senior success… there is no correlation between junior success at 50kg and senior success… the weight class does not even exist because of how irrelevant it is nowadays… He will without a doubt go down as one of the best poo style wrestlers of all time and rightfully so… But… small pond… The suggestion he is an all time great is truly laughable… could he have been? quite possibly had he chosen a bigger path… he didn’t… and that is on him…

again... trying to gather the troops with some really clever stuff... i don't hate it... i would like it much better if there was some actual humor in it, but, they can't all be winners...

it was a valiant attempt at trying to be clever... good for you...

you all forget Lee's first time at cadets... got rolled up... then he beat up a bunch of little kids at 50kg... then got chased down from 55 to go beat up some more little kids... it is a laughable assertion that Lee is among the all time greats... technically, Lee has never separated himself as a wrestler... but he can definitely beat up some runts and mids in the c league...

shameful...

For sure… Abakarov is a punk…

I just cracked the screen on my phone rolling my eyes so hard…

for average athletes i would agree... for the absolute best on the planet you want them to know they are the destroyer of worlds before they even step on that mat... they should be pissed that someone else even thinks they have a chance... false bravado or not, if you don't have that amount of psychosis then just stick to small pond of folk...

not to split hairs, but... sad went from winning "cadets" to winning seniors...

i am just going to shut the door on the way out of this thread...

there is nothing i disagree with in that post...

i remember when lee was mean mugging my then 12 year old kid at trials years ago in vegas... i texted the wife (at the time) what the hell? then i realized the kid was wearing a team big hoodie... lee was a force at one time... the NCAA and our predatory system of chewing up our best athletes and spitting them out when we are done with them ruined what might have been... again... totally on him and his decisions... if that is what he wanted then i support HIS decisions...

personally, i do not care about the BC shenanigans because i know how much a club in russia/hungary/(insert your favorite country here) can benefit from an age level world medal... the overall benefit far outweighs any perceived slight from a country that does not support its athletes...